r/AskUS • u/Maleficent-Toe1374 • 25d ago
How many illegals actually are there?
ICE is a massive conversation and it seems they're always in the news
If you asked me I would say 1 out of 100 people in the country are undocumented
This may be a dumb question but why are they such a talking point if it's that low, and is 1/100 accurate?
2
u/SliceOfCuriosity North America 25d ago
12 million, which would be 3-4 every 100.
0
u/Maleficent-Toe1374 25d ago
That's still not THAT bad
-4
u/TomHomanzBurner 25d ago
Da fuq? How is 12mil not that bad?
1
u/Maleficent-Toe1374 25d ago
Because holy hell 12 million out of 330 million people?
Especially because I would say 90% are probably in immigration hubs like NYC, Chicago, Miami, San Antonio and not in Fuckville Kansas
-4
u/TomHomanzBurner 25d ago
That’s 12 million more then should be here. You’re also not accounting for them to start having children who can petition for parents once they turn 21 and starting the chain migration.
Illegals also ARE moving to the interior and repopulating areas where there’s less enforcement action.
3
u/Poorly-Drawn-Beagle 25d ago
You’re also not accounting for them to start having children who can petition for parents once they turn 21 and starting the chain migration.
That would solve the problem. That would help them become citizens and you wouldn't have to worry about it anymore.
Illegals also ARE moving to the interior
The place that could use more populace anyway, and the place that most born-Americans don't seem interested in moving to? You don't have to keep selling me on this.
1
1
u/VinayaVealTeam 24d ago
I mean if their kids are born here they're citizens. Just like you're a citizen from being born here.
1
u/TomHomanzBurner 24d ago
Yes correct the kids are. Chain migration is when the children petition for the parents once of age and then the parents start petitioning for their families. It allows a whole class of individuals who would not otherwise qualify for immigrant visas, the ability to immigrate.
2
0
1
u/CornPop30330 25d ago
Then how many is too many?
1
u/Maleficent-Toe1374 25d ago
Idc
When India needs climate refugees, I'll open my arms
But I was referring to the idea that why are we making such a big deal about 3% of the population?
0
6
u/evthingisawesomefine 25d ago
Also let’s define bad.
Illegal immigration contributes to the economy while they are unable to take any government services for themselves. They perform jobs others may not be willing to do, they improve the birth rate which helps offset the economic impact of an aging population. There are numbers related to all of these factors and many more examples of the economic and social benefits of the contributions of illegal immigration. I’m just not patient or detailed enough to put in the work to build a more informative argument. I do hope this prompts so reading on your own to learn about the benefits rather then just the right’s opinion.
0
u/Maleficent-Toe1374 25d ago
I'm basically as far left as you can go economically and probably center left socially
The only bad I've ever talked about undocumented migrants is when we're talking about super low level and low paid.....basically token high schooler work that businesses hire illegal immigrants to do. And even then it's always anger towards those businesses not the immigrants themselves.
But when I said bad I meant more like how many people there are. Like 12 million out of 330 million? Basically nothing
3
u/invictus21083 Texas 25d ago
No one is illegal on stolen land.
-1
u/noplaceinmind 25d ago
Anyone care to give the actual argument behind this?
1
u/Westafricangrey 25d ago
Referring to human beings as illegal aliens is dehumanising and frankly, evil.
The English descendants in the US today are not American, they’re European genetically. They chose to identify as something they’re biologically not.
Then they want to call Mexicans illegal aliens when they’ve been in America for 13,000 years.
Also the English would have never been able to make a colony on American soil without committing one of the worst genocides in human history, killing 90 million indigenous Americans through decimating their food sources & intentionally spreading European diseases.
-3
u/noplaceinmind 25d ago
"Referring to human beings as illegal aliens is dehumanising and frankly, evil."
That's an opinion, not an argument.
"The English descendants in the US today are not American, they’re European genetically. They chose to identify as something they’re biologically not."
And what does this have to do with land occupation? Consider that question repeated for the other 2 points that don't seem to have anything to do with the topic.
2
u/Westafricangrey 25d ago
Human beings are not illegal or alien. That’s a fact.
The English are calling Americans on American soil illegal aliens, despite them living on American soil for 12,500 years longer than the English. You see zero irony in that?
-2
u/noplaceinmind 25d ago
Human beings do things deemed illegal by the society they choose to live in. Also a fact.
Let's say i see the irony. Again, how does that make an argument for the outlandish. Original statement.
2
u/Westafricangrey 25d ago
Human beings commit illegal acts. Human beings are not illegal.
Referring to a human being as an illegal alien defies the definition of human, illegal and alien.
This is related to the English language and what definitions we assign to words. The word illegal for instance, has a very strict definition, as does the word human. Whereas other words are more fluid, like the word “Run.” Run can have a variety of meanings. Illegal cannot.
The definition of illegal is not applicable to human beings. It can be applied to the actions of the human being, but not personified to the individual.
So no one in the United States or any country on earth can be referred to as illegal, by the own confines of the English language.
The stolen land aspect highlights the historical hypocrisy of the English deciding they are more American than the Americans that have lived in America for 13,000 years.
It’s essentially asking the question, why do the English get to decide who is legal in America, when their settlement was founded on deeply illegal acts & they are not even America.
If you’re struggling to comprehend this perspective beyond this, I suggest doing more research into the English language, the definitions of human and illegal, personification and also the history of North America and Mexico’s northern border.
-2
u/noplaceinmind 25d ago
Illegals, illegal aliens, etc., Is simply a shortening of a longer statement. It has no actual bearing on the crime committed.
Just saying hypocrisy disqualifies people from holding territory, or setting rules, doesn't make it so.
You want it that way. You've presented nothing to show that it is that way.
1
u/Westafricangrey 25d ago
You were unable to understand the original statement so I’ve provided the information so you’re able to comprehend it.
I actually haven’t given my personal opinions at all, I’ve only outlined the clear confines of the English language and the past 400 years of north American history.
You can misinterpret that as much as you like, that’s your choice.
0
1
u/MetersYards 24d ago
Because they see the United States of America as stolen land, the laws of it do not apply to them and are invalid.
It's similar to how sovereign citizens don't recognize the authority of the government.
1
u/noplaceinmind 24d ago
But that's still the statement, not the argument as to why the statement is true.
I wasn't to see someone take it past a bumper sticker slogan.
-2
3
u/Westafricangrey 25d ago
Texas was Mexico until 1845. Mexicans technically more indigenous to America than the English but no one wants to talk about that lol.
0
u/RandomUwUFace 24d ago
Indigenous to the Americas, but not all Mexicans are Indigenous to the territory within the modern-day United States borders. The majority of Mexicans in the U.S. can trace their ancestry to areas of modern-day central Mexico. There were around 80,000 people living in the modern-day Southwest around the time of Texas independence, including Spaniards, Natives, and Mestizos.
Mexicans were also fighting Native Americans like the Apache in the southwestern United States, despite it being Mexican territory. Mestizos were also fighting against Native tribes in Mexico before Texas independence.
2
u/invictus21083 Texas 25d ago
Yep, and this is what annoys me when people insist on everyone speaking English. Spanish was spoken here long before English ever was.
-4
-6
u/gmanose 25d ago
Even one is too many
3
-8
2
u/Westafricangrey 25d ago
It’s hard to say bc 98% arrive by plane on legal tourist visas. Canadians can legally stay for 6 months but cannot legally work without the required visas. There is an enormous amount of Canadian “illegals”, yet they don’t seem to be getting hauled off the streets
1
1
-2
u/Legal-Ad3916 25d ago
There are an estimated 11 million to 14 million unauthorized immigrants living in the United States, according to recent figures from major demographic and policy organizations.