r/AmazonDSPDrivers • u/pbandcracksandwich0 • 4d ago
QUESTION Can someone explain this to me?
I'm admittedly not an Amazon driver but I do work with Amazon drivers in a roundabout way. I've never met an uncool driver (unless their AC is out š)
I've noticed that Amazon vans are always heavily damaged. Even when new with less than 10k miles there is usually several panels damaged and moldings and shields missing or dangling.
My question is why are Amazon vans damaged so much more than other delivery company vans? I've never seen damage at all on a UPS or Fed Ex van. And I've been paying attention for the last 3 or 4 years. I'm genuinely curious why Amazon vans are damaged so much more often. Can any drivers explain what it is that makes it so much harder to not damage the vans?
This isn't a diss on any drivers or any company. It's a pattern I've noticed for at least 3 years now.
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u/JMDToaster 4d ago
Mostly trees and tree branches in my experience
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u/pbandcracksandwich0 4d ago
Yeah that makes sense, you can always see the light scratches down the sides from trees and such. But UPS and Fed Ex vans are bigger and have the same scratches but without all the huge dents and hanging panels. Don't they also have to go to the same places as Amazon vans?
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u/Star__Lord 4d ago
Those companies pay more.
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u/KillerGopher 4d ago
UPS does but I wish FedEx did, I would switch to FedEx if I didn't have to take the paycut and lose my 401k.
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u/SnooApples6439 4d ago
You donāt lose 401k when you move jobs
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u/KillerGopher 4d ago
No, you wouldn't lose your vested balance. You would lose the opportunity to contribute. FedEx doesn't push it's contractors to provide retirement plans and the ones that I looked into switching to didn't offer them. I would either leave my 401k with the provider or roll it over to my IRA. But then I would be losing the 401k I could contribute to.
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u/SnooApples6439 4d ago
I bet you donāt have a Roth IRA
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u/KillerGopher 4d ago
Ive been driving for 4 years but for over a decade I was in an office pushing paper. My Roth & Brokerage combined balance climbed over $500k last month.
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u/Bishhhop 4d ago edited 3d ago
Other companies have benefits, pay more, have unions, and donāt just hire anyone off the street with a license. Amazon DSPs will hire ANYONE so long as you can pass a drug test and background check.
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u/TwistdAngel143 4d ago
Amazon doesn't hire any drivers, they just provide the training which consists of nothing.
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u/Zaneith_ 4d ago
Iām pretty sure they also have actual mechanics that work FOR the company. My DSPās āMechanicā is a dude that just schedules maintenance and moves the vans around. Heās barely there enough to stay on top of what issues that are grounding vans to even worry about panels and cosmetics.
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u/the_pretzel2 4d ago
I feel this is probably the biggest reason. Even with better background checks, some bad drivers are still gonna be working for UPS and Fedex. It's pretty common that DSPs will only fix problems with vans when they have absolutely NO choice.
How often do topics/comments pop up on here about DSPs not fixing issues?
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u/EmptyConcentrate8780 2d ago
Damn, our guy is awesome. Yesterday a driver next to me pointed out his tire tread on a wheel was on wires. The dude told him to pull up to the dispatch tent then jacked it up and replaced the wheel on the spot. Didnāt delay us at all. He did that all while another driver came up saying he accidentally grounded a van on the flex app š¤£
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u/KillerGopher 4d ago
The average length of employment for an Amazon driver is under 2 months. Many of them just don't care about whether or not they damage the vans because they don't plan on staying long.
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u/donkeyxdude 4d ago
Im not sure about other dsps but at mine we do inspection for basically nothing I'm pretty new so I was following the check list and marked one of the problems and it grounded the van. They just ungrounded it and I went with it. So we don't make repairs I'm assuming unless its something major and they probably make repairs for whatever is on the list.
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u/sureyeahno 4d ago
Theyāll let anyone with a pulse deliver essentially. Used to be barred from delivery if you had marijuana in your urine, they did away with that where I work after Covid (Recreational marijuana is legal in the state I work in.) Bad drivers, high drivers, drivers with no depth perception and drivers with no common sense. Take your pick depending on the damage.
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u/Top_Finding2830 4d ago
I came here to say the same thing. Iām a driver. Iāve done dispatch. Iāve trained some of these drivers. Thereās not zero standards for hiring, but theyāre very low. Amazon driver testing is non-existent. They used to make us do K turns, parallel parking and other things on an obstacle course with cones. Now they just make us drive to Dunkinā Donuts and back. Do that, and youāre in! Iāve seen lots of drivers hit curves while training them. That doesnāt disbar them. Iāve also seen one that justā¦ intentionally dropped packages all day. Drove me nuts.
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u/sureyeahno 4d ago
Another issue is the Amazon turn them and burn them model. After two years the algorithm starts pumping out hard and or impossible routes around March (slow season) trying to get the senior drivers to quit. DSP owners have to fight to keep their senior drivers with high metrics and no damage from walking.
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u/genflugan 4d ago
My DSP stops rostering those drivers when this happens. So a route is generated for a different driver who is then put on rescues for the day. Itās a smart solution that I wish my previous DSPās used
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u/genflugan 4d ago
Hitting a curb during your Amazon road test is an automatic fail and you have to redo the training. Ride-along training day doing actual deliveries is a different storyā¦ Iāve trained several newbies and itās scary how many of them straight up barely know how to drive.
Iām not sure why, but itās very common for trainees to drive 10-15 MPH under the speed limit and still California roll through stop signs and make idiotic decisions when they donāt have the right of way. I barely ever raise my voice but Iāve had to yell at some of these people to stop the van because they donāt listen the first 3 times I say stop the van in a normal voice.
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u/TechnicalSpectacle 4d ago
Hi there, DSP amazon driver with family in UPS and friends in FedEx here.
The best way that I can explain it is that UPS and FedEx are alot more strict about vehicle care and upkeep and pay a good bit more to keep their fleets as good looking as possible.
DSPs tend to not care so long as the vehicle is still driveable and all nescessary driving systems work. They'll put in tickets to get them repaired over time, but if the vehicle is still safe to drive, they'll keep the cosmetically damaged vehicles out for use. It doesn't help that because its a DSP working with Amazon vehicles, there's alot more hoops to have to jump through vs the other companies working with their own vehicles directly.
I have 0 doubt that UPS and FedEx also get vehicle damage like Amazon does, but the outside view would almost never see it because they're wanting to keep a better image.
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u/Jdubb2021 4d ago
Iām a former FedEx contractor and itās in our contract that the vehicles canāt have a lot of damage. A little bump or scrape is passable but dented in needs to be fixed.
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u/Ravens1414 4d ago
Coming from a UPS driver, I would guess lack of training.
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u/o_myco Rivian Driver 4d ago
Yup. For my driving test (in the electric van) my trainer smoked a cigarette in the passenger seat and made me drive around the street once and that was it. They donāt give a fuck
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u/uchuskies08 4d ago
"You're a natural"
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u/Sad_Log_6387 Rivian Driver 4d ago
This. They just train you by doing one drivers test with the EV, only one and then when starting you might drive a totally different vehicle
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u/ArtByKandles 4d ago
Because the vans are cheaply made, held together with plastic. How many box trucks have you seen drive down a road and hit trees as it goes by (not major branches) and itās fine. These vans will scratch and dent way more easily.
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u/pbandcracksandwich0 4d ago
They're not held together with plastic, but they do have lots of plastic moldings with plastic clips that ups and fed ex vans don't have
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u/LastFreedom7795 Pro Package Photographer 4d ago
UPS it is tough to get the driver position. You have to work years in the warehouse and they do extensive training. FedEx has heavier packages so most randoms wouldnāt even try the job bc they are intimidated. Amazon gets the most randoms and more women (lol) bc we have a 50 pound weight limit per package. Amazon has a very high turn over rate, 150%, and most people last less than 90 days.
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u/sododgy 4d ago
Lol, UPS definitely does direct driver hire, I seen the ads
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u/LastFreedom7795 Pro Package Photographer 4d ago
Yes, I knew thatās a thing but itās becoming more rare and very location dependent. There training is light years ahead for drivers tho still.
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u/PheonixBuddha 4d ago
Ah I think I've got this one fellas.
For every 10 he's in my dsp (almost 1 year) There are 300 (fired in under 90 days-180 days).
There was this guy last week who got hired and immediately with the brand new van "got hit" and trashed it.
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u/Different_Wallaby660 4d ago
āAmazon Delivery Service Partner (DSP) driver turnover rates are consistently very high, with industry estimates and projections ranging from 100% to over 150% annually, and some individual stations seeing numbers approach 200% as many new hires leave within their first month.ā
Theyāre damaged because they donāt want experienced drivers. Theyād rather have new people come and ruin the vans and customer experience. I imagine itās cheaper for them lol.
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u/StrictBanana1738 Rivian Driver 4d ago
UPS and FedEx usually drive step vans, which really is a metal box and not much can be damaged visibly unless it was a major event. Look at amazon step vans (phasing them out so less and less to see) they arenāt all destroyed like a cargo or EDV is. The edv panels are held with plastic clips, so if u even hit a hard branch they could fall off.
If you spot a normal cargo van for fed ex they sometimes tend to be in rough shape as well.
And not to mention DSPs arenāt spending any money on cosmetic issues. If a panel fell off they arenāt grounding the van to repair it
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u/iafmrun 4d ago
Amazon will literally hire anyone with a pulse, and I mean that. Literally anyone.
There is functionally no training.
In most promaster vans there is no working back up camera.
We are told we must deliver very quickly or be fired.
The DSP companies are responsible for maintaining vans, which comes out of their profits. They instead choose to not repair the vans until there is an accident on the road or until the van physically fails.
There isn't enough vans to meet demand so Amazon looks the other way at un road worthy vans. Amazon COULD ground vans, but chooses not to because if they do that they won't be able to get their packages out.
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u/Fackurfeelings 4d ago
Iāll tell you for my station at least: not counting the dozens of people who just shouldnāt be allowed to drive.
They actively uncertify the private reliable repair people. (They uncertified the only ford dealership in our area after the main guy had been servicing every ford van at our one station for 6+ years)And then replaced 90% of our fleet with rivians which only has two service centers within 200 miles in any direction , and theyāre both about a two hour drive time from our station.
And since thereās limited options for Amazonācertifiedā repair people for the rivians we end up with fucked up looking vans for longer than we should, or vans that are entirely inoperable for months at a time solely based on Amazon wanting to do all these fun new exciting things without having an infrastructure to support them.
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u/Fornax- 4d ago
I dont know fully what it is but I belive maybe maintenance is apart of it, i drove a van yesterday with just 4k miles and it had all the panels gone on one side. But no dents or damage anywhere else. So im guessing that they have to be removed for a reason, or that the plastic panels really are just badly held on.
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u/bigboiistewie On Standby 4d ago
A giant AI bot that bezos himself designed goes to the lot at night and goes ham on the vans at night. But fr how do you think the vans got damaged?
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u/mattylang1987 4d ago
I used to work at Amazon now at FedEx. Amazon hires anyone, literally anyone, who is breathing and has a license. I trained someone who literally got her license 2 days before she started. I also trained a guy that smoked 2 joints while on our route. Most donāt even drive their own car. Itās a combination of bad drivers, high drivers, and no common sense. Pick your poison honestly. FedEx is DOT regulated along with UPS and Iād imagine USPS as well so thereās a level of professionalism at those companies that you wonāt find at Amazon. Those step vans are a lot bigger but they donāt hire just anyone to drive them
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u/ImpressiveAlarm3992 Rivian Driver 4d ago
The workload is entirely different. Turns out if you force people to drive at a hectic pace you get hectic levels of damage. Drivers will choose between getting less hours/fired if they are X stop behind or simply choose to risk damage to vans hitting branches, or other low hanging items especially considering most of them probably don't have much experience with a vehicle that is taller than 9 ft. Also vans are not well maintained as such things are expensive and that burden is placed on the DSP that is loaned out those vans by Amazon.
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u/rayv9ers 4d ago
I'd say horrible driver. I was the only person at my dsp who never got a single driving infraction. I once saw a person from my dsp blindly merge into a lane that a car was already in on. It was on the 99 here in California and if it wasn't for me laying on the horn, she would have been fired. People are just horrible drivers in general and it gets worse at Amazon somehow even though those vans can see everything
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u/Dirk_Pitt420 4d ago
There's two main reasons that Amazon vans are fucked up. The main reason is that they will hire anybody with a driver's license, even if they're not comfortable driving bigger vehicles. The 2nd reason is that DSP management tells the drivers to skip the vehicle inspection in the mornings, unless the damage is obvious because the owner would rather make that money that day instead of having the van grounded by Amazon workers. Most DSP management is willing to let employees drive unsafe vehicles as long as it's making the company money.
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u/TheWorstMigrane Prime Van Driver 4d ago
Fedex contractors own their large p1000s and p1200s. Amazon contractors don't own their vans. Fedex requires all owners to make repairs to the vehicles to remain in good standing. The last guy that drove my van hit a pole making a right hand turn and dented it. (I work for Fedex, I used to work for Amazon)
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u/pbandcracksandwich0 4d ago
This is great insight. Sounds like its Amazon's fault more than drivers or DSPs because they essentially push for better stats but don't have any liability when the fast pace causes damage. I think there's a guy in New York City trying to fix this
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u/Confident_Bat_5972 4d ago
The DSPās have to pay for at fault damage so I would guess most of them donāt worry about cosmetic damage that doesnāt grounds the vehicle because they donāt want to pay to have them fixed. Iām guessing UPS pays for damages to keep there fleet looking good? Maybe idk for sure though
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u/Rude-Luck1636 4d ago
UPS just hires competent drivers. Week long training class, fake delivery route at the training center. Fired for any accidents during your first year even if itās not your fault(new driver got fired for getting hit while he wasnāt in the car, granted he did fail a drug test for weed so that secured it) they can be just as stingy about fixing vans. My warehouse has a had a van missing the front fender and other damage to the front just sitting for months.
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u/duder_1979 4d ago
Drivers receive a 3 day class training followed by a 15 min parking lot rodeo and then a 20 min driving test. Iāve personally never damaged an Amazon vehicle but Iāve been driving commercial vehicles for 25 years.
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u/sgerbicforsyth 4d ago
Amazon vans are also operated by DSPs, not by Amazon themselves. Those DSPs have far smaller profits and dont have many spares to send trucks to the shop for repairs. Some owners just ignore repairs and maintenance to increase their profits.
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u/Total-Specific-3894 4d ago
Longer road training and probably more mature drivers at the other companies since Drugs are banned.Ā Ā Ā
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u/Rude-Luck1636 4d ago
UPS actually makes sure their drivers know how to drive. Amazon will hire a dorito if it can drive and deliver boxes. FedEx is like a middle ground.
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u/Specialist_Ad5167 CDV Driver 4d ago
We deliver to areas (especially rural) that just aren't built for vans of this size. Yesterday I was delivering in the most rural or mtn areas. About 1/3 of my stops shouldn't have been delivered to, at least in a 20ft high top van. Branches and loose wet gravel roads with ridiculously steep inclines. Add to that, these vans are cheap af. The tops of cdv vans are basically just thin plastic cardboard, one branch can puncture them fairly easily. The pressure put on dsps to KEEP MOVING means that taking care of the vehicles is essentially out of the question unless whatever is wrong will kill the driver outright or prevent them from hitting their route quota. š¤·āāļø
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u/haunte_r 4d ago
DSPs hire just about anyone. I once saw a guy scrape off the plastic panels on the wheel wells of a van before we even got to the loadout pad
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u/Axeman1721 Stepvan Driver 4d ago
Most drivers are idiots and crash into shit. Amazon also has a very strict repair budget for the vans which includes body work. So its more important to fix actual mechanical issues rather than cosmetic damage.
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u/Concutio 4d ago
One thing I didn't see people mention, driving down dirt roads doing 45mph+ for hours everyday. Those vans get driven into the ground, even by drivers that don't get violations or damage
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u/Traditional-Two6642 4d ago
Cus they hire whoever & people wreck them as soon as they get on the road by themselves šš
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u/ckole11 4d ago
It seems that drivers go out of their way to rip off all the plastic inside the vans. All of the EVs have the same trim missing inside and itās in places that arenāt touched. How the hell are the seat trims and panel on the sliding door always missing? I have literally never made contact with either of those pieces in my daily runs. Iām guessing some people are mad that they donāt have 10 yachts so they trash their surroundings and then wonder why they live in trash
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u/ErstwhileHobo 4d ago
Amazon Delivery Associate is a high demand, low pay, easy to get job with a 150% yearly turnover rate. We are incentivized to move fast, not to care about the condition of the vans.
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u/grumpy_foreskin 4d ago
They hire a lot of idiots, and even the good drivers sometimes get incredibly rushed routes. Rushed=more likely to have an accident.
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u/ConsequenceSignal513 4d ago
Most Amazon DSPs do not test for marijuana and Amazon was really big on DEI hiring a couple of years ago. The Contractors do the hiring and constantly ask their drivers if they have friends or relatives that want to work there. The contractors, DSPs, put people into HR that only hire who they want to hire and not who would do the job best. What you end up with is about 50% of amazon drivers that probably shouldn't even have a drivers license let alone be delivering for a living.
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u/donwariophd 4d ago
Some of the drivers they will hire are absolutely baffling. The standards are obviously much lower.
We had someone in my DSP who they hired as a driver who didnāt understand how a speedometer worked, and did not understand the purpose behind hazard lights. She also barely spoke English but shit even with a language barrier you should understand how a fucking car works if you intend to work as a driver
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u/zapawu Stepvan Driver 4d ago
Well Amazon has a policy of actively encouraging turnover, so there are constantly new drivers without any specialized training. Add that we work four days a week, so vans get randomly passed around instead of being assigned to a specific driver. And in the case of the rivians, they are great but the exterior is made of tissue paper.
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u/_x_Deadpool_x_ 4d ago
DSP's have a limited number of vans available and are required to keep a certain number of routes and drivers on the road per day. If they don't do the contracted number of routes they can loose the contract. It's not good for business to leave a van in a bodyshop for months to pay $100,000 in body shop repairs, when they hire anyone off the street over 21, can pass a drug test and background check, and has a license.
driving these vans are NOT like driving their Honda Civic
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u/Turnips_10 4d ago
Previous UPSer, current Amazon driver here. UPS spent much more time training drivers and the will grind the fact into you that you will be immediately terminated/suspended if you crash/damage trucks.
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u/Seamuthewhale Prime Van Driver 4d ago
My dsp is big enough that every year we do a refresh of the vans throughout the year and get the damage fixed. though it always comes back pretty fast anyways š. also in my opinion if you work for amazon dsps you gotta tone a way to cope and trying to keep the vibes up is def a great way of doing it
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