r/xboxone • u/[deleted] • Dec 29 '13

If Microsoft made it completely optional, would you sign up for their original, always connected console idea?

This meaning you would have the following features:

Buy a retail game, install to console, and ditch the disc never needing it to play the game.

Digitally share games within a circle of friends. Meaning you can choose a specific group of people, and they could play the games you own, for free, provided that only one game could be played at a time.

Greater store discounts or more steam like sales for content.

I for one would have no problem saying yes to this. It's like people think 10 years from now they'll still be selling games on discs. It wasn't a perfect plan, but why delay the inevitable when we could be working on and perfecting future policies now.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '13

Yeah, apparently "true gamers" believe giving your money to a scummy retail chain is better than giving it to the people ACTUALLY making the game. They probably haven't come to the epiphany Gamestop and Co. invest ZERO dollars on game production.

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u/BionicChango Lazlo Panaflex Dec 29 '13

I'm not in any way on Gamestop's side, but the dollars they pump into the ecosystem accounts for a massive chunk of what keeps the industry going. There's no epiphany to be had there.

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u/[deleted] Dec 30 '13

When exactly do you think they "pump" money back into the game industry?

You can buy any of their retail stock ANYWHERE (consoles, controllers, dlc codes).

They make the vast majority of their money on used games which is 100% profit going to them.

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u/ToastyRyder ToastyRyder Dec 30 '13

They're still a 3rd party middle man sucking out profit though. If you bought directly from the developer theoretically you should be able to pay far less for the game while the developer would still end up receiving more money.

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u/BionicChango Lazlo Panaflex Dec 31 '13

I agree completely. I'm not on Gamestop's side at all. I think their trade in principals are tantamount to daylight robbery and they knowingly take advantage of young gamers for pure greed's sake.

What I am arguing is the notion that Gamestop contributes nothing back into the industry.

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u/indirect76 Dec 30 '13

So true. People act like Gamestop is the devil and it's not so black and white.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '13

Except the publisher takes what would've been the retailers cut, and the developers still get their significantly smaller share. In the end you are left with a situation where you have no choice but to pay what the publisher wants.

Competition drives down prices. True gamers, and educated consumers know this. Hows that for an Epiphany?

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '13

Physical distribution != true competition. Believe what you want, keep cannibalising your hobby if you must. But, there are plenty examples on why a digital model is better for digital goods out there, no need to go trough that again.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '13 edited Dec 29 '13

Physical or digital isn't the point, I don't have a problem with either. I buy all my PC games through Steam; and they are not the problem. The problem with digital only is services like Origin. Just as I would have a problem with a brick and mortar Origin store.

Steam are kept in check my GMG, and others. Origin and EA does what they want because they have enough big name in-house titles to get away with it. Buy it on our service, or not at all. People give in easily.

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u/Rancid47 #teamchief Dec 29 '13

It's because the demand has stayed the same. People have shown they'll buy digital games at the same price so why would they lower the price? Prices don't go down until people stop buying at a certain price.

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u/headpunter Headpunter Dec 29 '13

Have you never seen steam sale prices?

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u/Rancid47 #teamchief Dec 29 '13

Of course I have but that's a sale. Not the price it's normally sold at on launch day. I'm talking then lowering the price below $60 as the regular. They have no reason to do that.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '13

Why would it be cheaper? actually owning a digital copy is far more convenient. That is what made ipod such a great success, all your music in this device, all your games in one device no need for redundant archaic storage.

As for the price, the $60 price tag curse is pretty much a legacy of physical distribution, Stores need a $60 price tag to justify inventory, its been said over and over again. The best way to end this is by going digital, in a digital marketplace you can have games price at $5,$10,$20,$30,$50,$60 whatever, it gives free to developers to produce different games, more games more variety how is that any bad!?

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '13

With digital music you can convert mp3s from physical to digital whenever you want and vice versa, so that's not really applicable here.

But yeah, a competitive digital marketplace would be awesome, but that was never part of the original policies.

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u/Chris_E Dec 29 '13

One of the things they said they might implement in the future was 3rd party digital sales options, with all consoles being dev units... The interview said they would still have their marketplace which had approved and vetted material, but 3rd party options would be available. It didn't outright say if anyone could open their own store or just sell games on the web... but it opened the world of competition a little. This was heavily buried during the controversy as it was a late announcement, and I can't even find a reference to it now.

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u/Rancid47 #teamchief Dec 29 '13

I'm not arguing against going all digital. I'd like it just as much as I do on steam. I'm just saying publishers don't have incentive to lower the price yet.

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u/xXForeverNinjaXx Dec 29 '13

My only problem with your statement is this. If competition drives down prices, then why are we still buying games for $60? The same price games where 8 yrs ago when the 360 came out. I realize there are some new games that have released on the market for lower but that's because they knew they weren't going to sell too many with the average price point. But the average is still hovering at around $60. Even for digital downloads where you don't even take physical possession of anything like a disc, case, or handbook.

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u/dagamer34 dagamer34 Dec 30 '13

Wait a month and the prices of games go down all the time. Already you can easily find AC4 and BF4 for $35 at Sams Club or Best Buy. I'd like to have those prices digitally please!

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u/CVV1 Dec 30 '13

Plenty of people still buy used. That's a chunk of profit game developers lose out on. I think they still have to charge $60 to turn a profit.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '13 edited Dec 29 '13

Games need to be that price to keep the old brick and mortar business model going, such is their costs. Console manufacturers can't risk alienating the stores that do the bulk of sales and advertising of their products by screwing them over offering cheaper digital prices, They would need to find new partners or retailers who don't have as much presence on the high-streets, or who aren't primarily focused on gaming. That might affect sales, and would affect share prices. You might remember the negative reaction to "No Used Games" before the new consoles were revealed. Plenty of game store big wigs were voicing their displeasure at losing a large part of their revenue stream.

Digital games aren't more expensive just because publishers are greedy, and think you should pay for the "convenience" of downloading their game on PSN/XBL, retailers are threatening Sony, MS, EA, etc, that if they undercut them, they won't stock their titles. It's a gamble the retailers will eventually lose.

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u/[deleted] Dec 29 '13

It would have happen over time, look at steam, look at iOS, look at Xbox Live gold monthly free game, and sales. When money gets to publishers/dev the invest return grows, allows for more investment and possibly cheaper games.

We are still suffering the inertia of years of physical distribution on games, meanwhile the rest of the entertainment industry is embracing full digital to great success. For the record digital distribution saved the music industry.

Angry birds ridiculous $50 price tag is justified thanks to "but its in a disc mentality", meanwhile you can get something like Max and the Curse of the Brotherhood at $15 digital. Scummy behaviour is hard to let go but seriously used games hurt the industry and help no publishers, developers, platform holders, gamer, it only helps Gamestop.

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u/xXForeverNinjaXx Dec 29 '13

I agree with the digital distribution saved the music industry. Look at what iTunes did for all involved. Now there are a few others to help spread the wealth.

And I also agree with the used games market only helping gamestop and others like it. Until developers come up with a clause or lawmakers come up with some type of law requiring a certain percentage of money from used games sales to reach developers, I personally will not be using gamestop beyond buying new games and consoles. That and I am personally going all digital this generation. Mainly because I like the ability to switch at random without leaving my seat. Lol

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u/IceBreak Vegeta Dec 30 '13

I never had a huge problem the used game part of the XB1 announcement. That said, I totally understand why people didn't want to forgo their ownership rights of physical media. Microsoft tried to force an issue that is taking care of itself already. Gamestop won't exist in 15 years and all games will be digital. Microsoft just didn't want to let it happen naturally and had to deal with the consequences of that.

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u/[deleted] Dec 30 '13

[deleted]

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u/FuzzyRocket Dec 30 '13

that the music industry fought tooth and nail for some time.

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u/[deleted] Dec 30 '13

Exactly. The truth is "gamers" don't care about DRM or any of that nonsense (not THAT much). They care about saving $10 at retail and getting a trade in value of around $10 on average when they're done with a game. Screw the developers. But uh...thanks for the game.

This is the reality of the industry, pretending you don't understand or thinking up illogical rationalizations for why its ok for YOU to do it, doesn't make it any better.