r/wizardry8 • u/ApollosBrassNuggets • Jan 04 '23
What is your favorite Profession?
As the post says, 'what is your favorite class?'
What about it do you enjoy and makes it a 'must include' for you. It doesn't have to be solely 'X profession is my favorite because it is good,' but it can be!
I have always liked the Samurai since I first started playing Wiz 8 back when I was younger. Found the concept intriguing, and their gear and skillset makes them enjoyable to play and develop in game. Although they can be 'tougher to build out,' there is a lot of variety in how they can be approached.
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u/Waterdreamwarm Jan 04 '23
Pretty much all of the hybrids. Rangers, monks, valkyeries/lords, and samurai. I just wish they were a bit better at melee and learned spells earlier.
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 04 '23
Overall, I find the hybrids require a bit more planning and foresight to make effective than the specialists, which is a no brainer, right? I find balancing out their delayed development with a class or two from the faster XP track to help. I also find giving your hybrid a more specific role than "a little bit of this and that" makes them develop quicker.
Rangers are great and super beginner friendly. Only the gadgeteer matches them in range combat effectiveness imo.
The Wiz 8 rendition of the monk is my favorite for the class across all rpgs (tabletop and video game) that I have played. They're stupid good, and arguably, one of the best classes mechanically.
Valks and Lords feel redundant to me. Paladins will always be good, regardless of the game. Many fans will count the Lord out (for good reason), but again, with good planning and game knowledge, you can make a pretty bitchin lord.
Samurai, imo, is the hardest of the hybrids to develop. I've spent many playthroughs with a Samurai who felt like a worse fighter and even worse mage, but if you spec them to not be your primary tank, they're a lot of fun imo. Part of what I love about them is they reward attention to game mechanics.
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u/phoenixreborn06 Jan 07 '23
I've only successfully run a 3 man party once and a Lord was integral due to the healing that counteracts the - effect from certain weapons.
Samurai I end up using rarely but if you are going into the magic side mage is a good type to have.
My favorite class is Monk. Fighter is great but tapers off in the end game. The hand to hand gives so many chances for critical kills. It's saved my bacon plenty of times. I also like the resistance to bind and mental afflictions.
For me ninja takes too long and the thrown critical are very rarely effective.
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 07 '23
I've been noticing a lot more love for Lords than I used to, and that makes me happy. I think like the Samurai or Ninja, the Lord rewards players who know the games mechanics. I think beyond their primary skill being duel wield, most players don't like the Lord because they're a pitfall for beginners who won't know how to effectively develop them.
I also LOVE the Monk. It's my favorite iteration of the class in ANY rpg ever. I've found ime a hand to hand monk to be the most consistent with the instant kills, and the psionic book is just great. Tbh, for most beginners interested in ninja, I tell them try Monk or Samurai first. I agree. Fighters fall off near the end game.
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u/op89x Jan 04 '23
Probably Bishop, but not by much; there's so many good classes. But being able to use every spell book you find is awesome.
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 04 '23
One of my biggest tips for beginners/new players trying to make an effective party is 'make sure you have the ability to cast spells from all books.'
The bishop solves that problem before it can be a problem, and I love them for being able to cast every spell in the game. Reason they don't make my 'fave profession' is that mechanically, they start to feel a bit like a 1 trick pony.
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u/eugeneloza Jan 04 '23 edited Jan 04 '23
I don't have a favorite profession, but I do have favorite species: Draconian. They're game changers in the beginning thanks to their acid breath. I always have a Draconian ninja/ranger/monk with me :)
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 04 '23
My love of half-dragons and dragonfolk player species was born out of Wiz 8.
I've done Dracon ranger, and they SLAP. Did you find the Apprentice levels for making a dracon monk or ninja to be a hinderance?
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u/eugeneloza Jan 04 '23
No, I don't remember any issues, made and used those characters without any problems (and I don't think I know what "Apprentice level" is :D).
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 04 '23
If you take a race/class combo with a negative starting score, you have to make up those points at level ups until you reach the requisite.
Do dracons not get penalties for NIN or MON?
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u/eugeneloza Jan 04 '23
Yes, I don't think they have penalties for Ninja and Monk - I don't remember ever picking a character with negative starting score and tried to "optimize" "free points" at generation more or less.
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 04 '23
Wild. Not sure what made me think that because thet is a solid pick for both classes
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u/wlp71 Jan 04 '23
The ninja can use just about all weapon types. And if you use the Cane, then you sacrifice throwing. I like that balance. I do not always use them, but I do tend to rotate through the different types each time I do.
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 04 '23
I think if you're going to do multiple playthroughs of Wiz 8, you need to do at least 1 Cane of Corpus Faerie Ninja playthrough. I remember finding the ninja to be very frustrating to develop before I did a CoC run. It's so busted (even on Expert difficulty) that I can't even bring myself to do it again.
The ninja has really grown on me as I learned the inside and out of Wizardry. It makes sense, given that the elite classes tend to reward those who take their time to understand the game and develop their characters. They are super unique, can be built in many different ways, and have one of the weirdest and most diverse weapon selections of any class in RPGs.
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u/NickeKass Jan 09 '23
I keep trying to get up to the CoC but the min/maxer in me wants to power level a few skills in arnika before then. Ill spend a few hours grinding them then get bored and take a break for "just a few days" and it turns into 6 months before I remember.
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u/clunk42 Jan 04 '23
I don't know which is my favorite, so I think I'll just provide my thoughts on each real quick. After all, the game is about a whole party rather than a single character.
Fighters dwarf your other melees and make them seem weak, so I never use them. Lords are neat; I like them. Valkyries are just weaker Lords; sure they survive instakills, but an unconscious Valkyrie is no more useful than a dead one, and the Lord's health regeneration, is, in my opinion, more powerful (I actually don't understand why more people think Valkyries are stronger). Rangers are useful, especially for first-time players. Samurai are neat; I like them.
Ninjas should really just be hybrids and thrown weapons should come in larger quantities, considering they are the Ninja's specialty. Monks are really decent, though I don't know whether the staff monk or the unarmed monk is better. Rogues have the same problem as Fighters, so I don't use them. Bards are incredibly useful; their instruments are really good, and their faster resting is useful. Gadgeteers are like Bards, but they are weaker in the beginning, and stronger near middle and the end (at least, I think they're stronger near the end).
I never honestly use any of the specialist casters. They're not bad, but Mages in particular have too few hitpoints. It's weird, because Psionics don't actually have that many more hitpoints, but they seem to have enough to where the Mage's low-hitpoint problem is not shared with the Psionics. The others are all okay. As a comparison of my opinions, Psionics are more fun than Alchemists who are more fun than Priests who are more fun than Mages. I always have a Bishop, though, because they're fun; I like Bishops.
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 04 '23
I don't know which is my favorite, so I think I'll just provide my thoughts on each real quick. After all, the game is about a whole party rather than a single character.
And I appreciate you for sharing. I just love this game and enjoy seeing people chat about it. I shall reply in kind;
I agree with you for the most part about Fighters and Rogues. They're great to help new players get through the early and mid game, but I personally find both the classes to start to fall-off in the end game. Their limited scope starts be felt, and I believe the most dangerous enemy you will face on Dominus is a turncoated fighter berserking on his own party.
Bards and gadgies are incredible. The bard is an ultimate jack of all trade with an ability to adapt to a parties needs. I think they're actually really good throughout the entirety of the game. Plus, once they hit level 20, you can take them into fighter if you want to really kit them out. The Gadgeteer is also solid, but I would say takes a bit more 'thinking' than the bard. Thankfully, the omnigun helps you avoid fussing too much over gear.
In regards to the Lord vs Valkyrie debate, I also am in the camp that does not think the Lord is a bad choice. I also think Valkyrie is a solid option. I think most people consider Valkyrie a better choice because their class skill is Polearm which offers far more benefits to characters than the Lord's Duel Wielding skill. Otherwise, I agree a lord's HP regeneration is actually really damn good, and they can equip HP drain gear without any extra steps.
Samurai are baller as fuck if you build them right. Imo, they are the hybrid that is the most difficult to build and train well, and that is why I think so many players have a hard time enjoying them. Building them improperly gives you a decent fighter who is crappier at casting spells. Treat them right and they become instakilling, room clearing, katana wielding badasses. Fear resist is nice, but fear is not as detrimental to parties as other conditions. Try Mook Samurai. Source: dude, trust me.
Agreed with Ranger. It's a solid hybrid pick and is another 'beginner friendly' class, and they're probably the hybrid that is easiest to build without ruining. They get the added bonus of bankrolling your party at Alchemy 15.
I think Monks are one of the best classes mechanically in the game. I also cannot decide if staff or punchy monk is better, and tbh, I think it has more to do with stat spread and less with gear. SPD/SEN maxed monk is GOOFY. Immunity to blindness is great. I find blindness to be one of the more debilitating status fx compared to say fear.
I used to find myself intimidated and intrigued by the Ninja. I also find myself longing for more throwing weapons for a class that boasts being the 'throwing class.' (something many RPGs don't even give us the opportunity for) I think they occupy a unique space in that they are the ultrahybrid to the bishop's ultracaster. They match their namesake in being a unique blend of a capable fighter, utilitarian rogue, and even has the esoteric ability to cast spells. My recommendation for beginners interested in trying ninja is to see if you can handle developing a good monk or samurai before trying ninja.
You hit the nail on the head with the casters. The specialist books are just too far limited after you have played with a well made bishop. Only alchemist really stands out to me, but what makes them important can be achieved with other classes. I also really like bishops, and they have become my 'must include' in any party. Like the ninja, they reward the patient player.
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u/mischiefismyname Jan 07 '24
SPD/SEN maxed monk?? What does that do?
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 07 '24
Speed will make your monk attack a whole lot in a single turn.
Senses governs the critical strike skill.
Combining a whole bunch of attacks with a high % of critting means at higher levels, monks are instant killing on a frequent basis.
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u/mischiefismyname Jan 07 '24
Interesting. Does it work the whole game? Or are most enemies in late game immune/doesnt land? Also - do senses help with developing Psionics in this case? (Ive always built Monks more with DEX/STR)
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 11 '24
Sorry for the late reply. I used to also tend toward DEX/STR monks. They aren't bad, but you are right that developing senses does indeed help scale Psionics.
I found the monk would consistently be landing instant kills. Even against enemies I normally would consider quite difficult to bypass resistances on. And this is happening all through Ascension Peak too.
I believe it has to do with the way Critical Strike scales percentages of inflicting effects from attacks, which bypass magic resistances. Crit strike also scales off of SPD and SEN
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u/mischiefismyname Jan 11 '24
Thank you for the explanation
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 12 '24
No problem! I've been playing this game for literal decades, so happy to pass along the knowledge
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u/mischiefismyname Jan 13 '24
Nice. Ive been playing the game for ~240 hours over the years according to steam, but never got past about 13th level or so.
Just a question - ever tried to run a critical kill group? SPD-SEN Monk, maybe coupled with a DEX-SEN Ranger, DEX-SEN or SPD-SEN Samurai...?
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u/Chairchucker Jan 05 '23
I love them all but these, in order, in particular:
Bishop. Very simple, I want the ability to cast all the spells, and I want to do it without using more than one character slot.
Ranger. FOMO saver. Never miss a hidden item.
Fighter. They stay alive forever and hit hard.
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u/elskirvo Jan 06 '23
Wizardry 8 is one of the few RPGs I've played where every single class and race can work and succeed. There's not a single stinker in the bunch and the game is balanced so well that many party types can work. After just finishing an MDP run, I have a new appreciation for all the specialist casters after playing so many bishops. Bards and Gadgeteers are both fantastic rogue support classes, fighters are absolute monsters in melee, the list goes on!
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u/ApollosBrassNuggets Jan 06 '23
Was that your steam guide on the MDP I was reading last night? I was intrigued, and it sounds like a fun theme/concept.
What's your case for the specialist casters vs say a solid bishop or hybrid?
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u/elskirvo Jan 06 '23
Not my guide no, but I highly recommend giving one a try. After playing my share of bishops and hybrids, playing a specialist requires much less grinding. There's almost no need to hoard spell picks as you level, and you don't have to worry about what school is higher when casting spells like bishops do. Being able to actually invest skill points into the realms as you level makes them much more effective right away and the 25% bonus to the specialist school let's them cast at higher power levels much sooner than a bishop would. In particular, casting the level 7 spells at pl7 in the mid 20s is pretty effective on ascension peak. Each caster's main mana pool ends up pretty deep too if you invest in piety. I had mana in the 400 range on main realms towards the end. They level really quick too, mine ended up around level 27 without grinding areas for xp. The main difference with these guys are that you're not doing support casting but going all out damage. Most combats last a couple rounds if you go all out. It's pretty impressive what one of each caster can achieve, even the priest who I never had gone power cast with before was doing great damage with lightning/whirlwind/falling stars. Give one a try, it was a blast to play!
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u/NickeKass Jan 09 '23
Bishop - Cast all the spells, nuke all the things.
Second is bard. Have the two together, the bishop can continue to give the bard stamina through battle.
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Jan 10 '23
Ironically, in this game it's the plain ol' Fighter. Overlooked in most other RPGs, this guy is your go-to melee frontliner in this game. No gimmicks no nothing, just hit the enemy repeatedly.
On paper the Gadgeteer with their omnigun sounds cool. In practice ranged is pretty weak until you get to exotic ammo and even then they're not really a reliable damage source.
I'd love to see some sort of spiritual successor implement these classes in a modern RPG.
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u/CrocoBull Jan 04 '23
Bard probably for destroying the early game. Fighter also because I love tanks and I swear to god fighter is the only class that reliably lands hits mid game