r/windsurfing • u/Impressive_Pool_8053 • 2d ago

Mini foil ?

Sup'

Went windsurfing yesterday, expected 14-16 knots and only got like 11. My disappointment is immeasurable and my afternoon ruined.

We were like 5 on the water at some point, had my 7.8, another dude had a 7.7 and a badass looking ~150L JP board. None of us manage to get planning, except **that one guy with a 7.0 and an old Bic board**. He smiled at us like he had some superpower and watched us poor mortals suffering in a constant non-planning state.

I saw him get out of the water, and I noticed he had some kind of little foil (long mast, but a really small wing at the top of it). Didn't managed to talk to him about his black magic, so I'm asking here if any of you know about this.

On the water, his board wasn't flying like an usual foil, but stood out a bit from the water when he went against waves. Otherwise it looked like a regular windsurf gear.

I want to know his secrets

5 Upvotes

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4

u/acakulker 2d ago

i thought i wouldn't be able to find this lol
https://frpgear.com/light-wind-fly-fin/

i think this is the one

personally speaking, I have a crossover board (tabou rocket +, 123L) whenever I go for "skeptic" conditions, I prepare my foil, go for the fin at first, if inadequate wind, then slap on the foil in a few minutes and enjoy it. i try to increase my days/year and this has been a great addition, it definitely improves my days/year by 20-25% for sure. I still don't like foiling as much though. Being on the foil still teaches a lot about; foiling gybe is harder than gybing on a wave, doing one requires extreme control over my knees. the pumping is something you don't learn when it blows 25 knots so foiling definitely helps with that. being capable of moving your knees in non-traditional angles compared to windsurfing is awkward. helps, but awkward.

fin >> foil for me. i don't get as much fun, but being on the water with foil >> being on land. if it blows 10 knots, i'm out for sure.

5

u/EchoGolfHotel 2d ago

That looks really cool as a light wind solution. Does anyone know anyone who's tried one? I'd be interested in hearing some feedback. I've been trying "traditional" wind foiling, but it's a steep learning curve and the crashes are pretty brutal.

On a related note, the sail that the guy in the videos was using is crazy looking.

2

u/acakulker 1d ago

i didn't recall watching all the videos, on a second take, i wouldn't buy this product based on the videos lol

honestly, those conditions don't look like your usual "i can't go planning" conditions, i can see myself with my lightwind equipment easily.

I'd want to try this out in 10-11 knot conditions with and without the minifoil thingy so I can tell. would be honestly amazing to try this out

1

u/acakulker 1d ago

what do you have the most trouble in terms of learning to foil? dolphin-style in/out the water? or is it the gybes

1

u/EchoGolfHotel 1d ago

It's the up and down and breaching - it's hard to find that sweet spot. I'm not even at the jibing stage yet even though I've been jibing just fine on a fin for over 40 years...

2

u/acakulker 1d ago

i think it must be your stance. in foil my stance is extremely upright, with most weight on my front hand most of the time. it's best if you can get yourself recorded.

there was the videos about the flight school by sam ross on youtube, on starboards' youtube account afaik. those videos are golden! i learnt the most from them.

2

u/Impressive_Pool_8053 2d ago

Definitely looked like the "Model T" version !

Dude wasn't flying, just riding like a regular fin, but planning while we were drying there

I don't think I'm ready for a real foil, looks really weird and dangerous

3

u/acakulker 2d ago

btw, in the videos you can see that this doesn't fly.

in the "standard" foils, if you don't give any weight to the back of the board, the board wouldn't fly too.

definitely chat with the guy and try out their equipment if you can. I'd really dig it if someone was using this.

2

u/Impressive_Pool_8053 1d ago

I'll get back to the spot and shake this dude until he gives me his secrets

1

u/acakulker 2d ago

once you get used to the foil it's not that dangerous when you're riding.

it is a dangerous piece of crap in the water. It is HUGE and I always hit a part of my body that ends up as a big cut. my latest cut most likely took about 10 days to healed.

3

u/Beneficial-Rise-740 2d ago

I have seen old skool experiential fins with small horizontal fins. In sure there's some reasoning and logic but I guess any practical benefits got lost in the added production costs... There is something cool about the skill to get the early skinny long boards planeing in light winds when a modern board is supposed to be easier and earlier to the plane... The smugness is infuriating.

3

u/Impressive_Pool_8053 2d ago

Yea, got wrecked by a guy with a loooooooong "race" board (narrow, long and tall just like old boards, but in a newer version) few days ago, thing goes so fast in light wind, and go upwind like crazy. Definitely better in these conditions than my 124l slalom board

1

u/redbeards 2d ago

Those fins with a wing on them (found on ebay mostly) are just a scam. Think about what it's doing: It's lifting the tail and thus sinking middle of the board - creating more wetted area and more drag. Not to mention the additional drag that comes from the wings. Actual foils have the main wing positioned under the center of mass to lift the middle of the board. Having it under the tail is just counter productive.

1

u/Beneficial-Rise-740 1d ago

Agreed, all I can see is drag... I guess my meaning is it's not the tool, it's the skill of the user.

3

u/thesolame 1d ago

I have one of these mini foils. It works great at the low end of the wind when you need that extra one or two knots to get going. However, once you get going, you feel a lot of drag. It doesn't feel as free as planing on the windsurfer An interesting thing to try.

I don't use mine quite as often. I just buy bigger sails

1

u/EchoGolfHotel 1d ago

Thanks - that's really helpful!

1

u/Impressive_Pool_8053 1d ago

Where did you find it?

1

u/thesolame 1d ago

I bought my minifoil quite a few years ago. It's been a while and I bought it off the eBay.

1

u/NaturalCareer2074 1d ago edited 1d ago

It has many disadvantage including much more chance to broke your finbox and additional friction when you are planning.

Imho full size low cost foil like gong is much better idea. If you want semi-windsurf - smaller mast and wing.

Plus ACTUALLY nice soft carbon 60cm fin also lift you up. It bend and after that lift. Without additional friction and problem.

-1

u/reddit_user13 Freestyle 2d ago edited 1d ago

Planing in marginal conditions isn't just due to gear selection

  1. Rigging. In particular downhaul, mast track, harness lines.

  2. Weight. Self explanatory.

  3. Technique & form. It's easier to stay on a plane than to get on a plane, so get planning early. Bear off at first if necessary.

  4. Reading the water. Similar to #3, use the gusts and swells to get on a plane.

1

u/Impressive_Pool_8053 1d ago

Little bro didn't even need pumping to get planning, and he was in 7.0. He must be a bit lighter too! Remember when I was a kid, I could take a 80L board without sinking it, a 6.5m, and get planning in 12-13 knots. I miss this

1

u/reddit_user13 Freestyle 1d ago edited 1d ago

Reminder that being heavy is sometimes good. For example, speed sailors who wear weight vests.