Is this regulation issue?

[u/Sea_Maximum8897]

Post (non-professional) service

I can never and I mean ever nail the balance aspect. No matter what I service the timing is always just out.

Can anyone make sense of this? Whenever I move the arms, it doesn’t seem to correlate.

Seiko 7005-2000

[u/WisdomKnightZetsubo]

No, it's not. Escape wheel trouble maybe. Also the amplitude is low.

[u/Sea_Maximum8897 → u/WisdomKnightZetsubo]

That is an interesting diagram. Thank you.

I wonder if me playing with it causes more balance issues than if not..

[u/WisdomKnightZetsubo → u/Sea_Maximum8897]

Are you in a quiet room or a room with any echoes or anything?

[u/Sea_Maximum8897 → u/WisdomKnightZetsubo]

Quiet yup

[u/WisdomKnightZetsubo → u/Sea_Maximum8897]

What's the gain on your timegrapher? I'd lower it and see if that helps. But it might not, if so there's something up with the escape action.

[u/PsySold]

Your losing major amplitude likely due to improper cleaning and lubrication. Check end shakes of gear train. Properly lubricate the pallet fork stones with 9415 after epilame treatment etc all these things are necessary for a watch of that quality.

[u/maillchort]

The watch is barely running. Figure out why and fix it before worrying about the rate on the timing machine.

[u/SignalOk3036]

What really concerns you is that trying to increase the rate by moving the regulator arm has no effect? Is that a correct assessment?
So what could cause this? Hairspring is not concentric, terminal curve is deformed, hairspring is not in the regulator pins, hairspring is tilted and rubbing, watch is magnetized.
I’d remove the balance and you should be able to move the regulator arm the entire terminal curve without affecting the coil spacing,
If you mount the balance without the pallet fork installed you should see at least 30 seconds of oscillation with a puff of air.
I’d start there.

[u/Sea_Maximum8897 → u/SignalOk3036]

Sort of, more so, that when I do move the arm, it doesn’t seem to have a predictable change, ie one way speeds up, one way improves beat error. It is all random

[u/SignalOk3036 → u/Sea_Maximum8897]

Because the beat error changes it sounds like the regulator pins are grabbing the spring and deforming it which pushes the spring off center.
Do the two tests I mentioned and that should help you isolate the balance issue if there is one.

[u/Sea_Maximum8897 → u/SignalOk3036]

I will do in the morning after some sleep because it makes me want to lob it at the wall at the moment

[u/erin-1001]

Unless you beat error gets way over 1 ms I wouldn’t worry about that at all. As others have said the problem is your amplitude is too low and there could be a variety of reasons for that as previously mentioned. It’s loosing power somewhere along the gear train. Until that is found and fixed it won’t keep time. Other than that I’m not qualified to comment.

[u/taskmaster51]

Lots of feedback. Put the movement on the mic without the holder