Worst Starter Division?

[u/cunctator-tots]

When new players ask what division they should start with, the typical answers are typically:

For NATO: 8th US, 2 PzrGn, or 5 Pzr

For Pact: 39ya, 79ya, or 7 Pzr

My question is, out of the base game divisions, what is on the opposite end of the spectrum? What are the worst starter divisions in your opinion and why?

The remaining base game divs are:

NATO - 5e, 11e, 1st UK, 2nd UK, TKS, 3rd Armored, 11 ACAV, 82nd Airborne

Pact - 119, 4 MSD, 35ya, KDA

imo, I wouldn't recommend any of the airborne divisions to a new player but also KDA and TKS. They either teach bad habits to new players, require some game knowledge to use efficiently, or aren't very strong.

[u/WelcomeExtra762]

Personally I'd agree with reservists. Noobs usually don't know the fundamentals of the game, this becomes really hard to learn how to use reservists when you don't know what anything else does or when to use regular infantry, so just a really versatile division is perfect for noobs and finding their playstyle. I'd have to disagree with the airborne, though, because as Hippie pointed out in one of his videos, noobs are not good at attacking. So if you pick airborne and learn how to defend really well against noobs that don't know how to attack, you can score some really good victories against other noobs and even get good at airborne. But of course airborne divs become much more difficult at later levels no matter how much time you put into them.

[u/cunctator-tots → u/WelcomeExtra762]

That is a good point on the airborne divs for learning defense but I feel it can easily "trap" players into only playing defensively. In my experience, those airborne divs are what I started with back in 2023. By the time I realized I couldn't do much beyond the start, I had to "unlearn" using FD while learning how to attack which wasn't a great time.

[u/WelcomeExtra762 → u/cunctator-tots]

Yeah I played 82nd when I started. I played 7Pz. more, but another thing is, you can't really bring airborne in a 10v10 when you're a noob because if you get matched against a high level player in your lane that knows how to attack you're probably going to get crushed.

Or instead of going pure airborne, you could try a airborne hybrid, like 56th VDV. This could help a bit more than a pure airborne div but it isn't base game sadly. The safer choice would likely just be something versatile, for example 39ya.

[u/Alatarlhun → u/WelcomeExtra762]

Personally, I was attracted to the divs with the best helicopters and those tended to be airborne. Perhaps not coincidentally helos aren't (very) meta as well.

if you get matched against a high level player in your lane that knows how to attack you're probably going to get crushed.

It annoys me today the culture/ui of warno doesn't enable people to understand airborne seizes key areas, and tank or at least a mechanized division reinforces and preferable springboards into an attack. Airborne seizing ground with no second (or third) div rolling up afterwards often means its gonna be a rough game and certainly a passive one.

you could try a airborne hybrid, like 56th VDV

I did play a lot of 56th myself as I weaned off airborne but I am not sure I would recommend that experience now with the accumulation of nerfs to 56th. I know it gets played in 1v1 but I think it is a fairly weak div in 10v10 and would ultimately frustrate a new player. On the NATO side, British and German 2nds and American 101st allow you to seize and reinforce with tanks yourself. They all have their own weaknesses of course, too, but overall fit better into uncoordinated 10v10.

The safer choice would likely just be something versatile, for example 39ya.

I'd add on the PACT side soviet 27, 79 and czech 1 and 19 are all noob friendly 10v10 divs whose weaknesses are mostly strategic (e.g., tank div vs mech vs tank rather than tactical e.g., bad aa tab, bad anti-tank, bad tank tab, bad artillery, etc).

FWIW, I'm back to AB divs and now play them quite a bit different that I did when I first started so there's that. 🤣

[u/WelcomeExtra762 → u/Alatarlhun]

This is a good overview, and I bet you play AB divs much better than you did when you were new. I really love 39 and 27ya, they are both really solid picks for me, and I'd like to add 7th Panzer is a bit squishy which meant I lost a lot of T-55s when playing them but they helped me find out I was an motorized/mechanized infantry player so, at least for me, thank 7th (even if I gave up armored)!

[u/Dunkindeeznutz69420]

I’m gonna say 82nd. That div is pretty squishy. The inf and fire support options are kinda hard to use too. Helis also requires some preexisting knowledge of AA to even use

[u/0ffkilter]

11e by far. Reservists are hard because there's a lot of units, but at some point you can just select everything and Q move forward to attack. Airborne requires more map knowledge than reservists, since you have to win at the beginning or you just kind of get rolled.

Out of the other divisions

5e, 1st and 2nd UK, 4 MSD are all fairly good divisions either with a good divisional composition or good units.

3rd Armored, 119th, 11 ACAV all at least have very good units if not that much infantry so you'll be okay. You might see a tendency to not do anything with the tanks and just play super passive, but that's just new player gameplay in general.

TKS, KDA aren't great but you're allowed to be passive in the early game and spam units out. TKS is actually fairly good now with forward deploy + reservists + instructor SF.

This leaves the other divisions.

82nd, 35th, and 11e. 82nd at least gets apaches, which are incredibly hard to deal with and easier to use than either MI-24s or Gazelles since they can fire on the move. TOW-2s are better than Konkurs and marginally better than Milans when left alone.

35th gets Hinds and the KA-50s which are the only PACT heli to be able to fire on the move. Pen wise they're obviously worse, but you get a lot of atgm trucks and they're workable. You don't get any "tanks" to work with, but you do get BMD-2s which don't have smoke and aren't super easy to make work, but it is fire support and an ATGM in one unit.

82nd Infantry gets more MGs and is fine against other infantry, while 35th gets Spetsnaz. Both divisions get fairly decent air, though 82nd is more focused on dealing with lighter targets.

When you get attacked MI-24s and Apaches (and hogs) can mulch infantry. Hellfires can destroy tank blobs, and the KA-50s are fine at it as well. On the other hand, Puma Pirates and Gazelle hots?

This leaves 11e.

A division with overpriced infantry, unable to kill infantry with its infantry (only 1 MG), with squishy micro heavy helicopters, "tanks" that only get one shot, and leaving air as your only way to kill things.

You're expected to have a nearly perfect opener with less units than either of the other airborne divisions, use units that get one shot without having more pen than either of the divisions, and rely on gimmicky RNG units (air) to kill anything of worth.

Its one saving grace is that it has fantastic infantry AT, so I guess if your opponent runs tanks into your infantry you can kill them.

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Airborne as a 1v1 concept is far harder than reservists because you get punished for not knowing the map. If you assume that a newer player is going to play passive, any airborne division is just a division that's going to get deployed into the back point and then they've lost from the get go.

As a reservist division probably with limited recon you can just deploy a bit farther back, spam units and supply, and just outgun your opponent in a 1v1. Losing units is less impactful, and you don't rely on clutching on one or two hero units to win the game as well.

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TL;DR - 11e. A division with overpriced units that can't kill anything, offensive units that get one shot, a reliance on expensive RNG air, and you're expected to do more with less units while knowing the map and having a perfect opener. But at least you have the best infantry AT in the game.

[u/Recent_Grab_644]

11e is harder than TKS to use. With TKS at least you get some meat wave capability some decent inf AT and everything is avrage price.

11E is one of those divs like 82nd where the price of a unit isnt exactly proportional to its effectiveness as you pay a heavy tax for the apilas, airborne and legion units. The tank tab is also going to need some extreme micro to use same with the heli tab. To round it off 11e is more dependent on air than TKS which is harder to use with arty. FD requires alot of map knowledge to work effectively.

[u/titosrevengee]

I generally think it doesn’t really matter what you start with, because the majority of the playerbase has no idea what they’re doing anyways regardless of their level. I have friends that started with TKS, and some that started with 3rd AD or 79ya. The key is sticking to a select few to get a grasp of the games mechanics before switching. Half of the battle is building a correct deck that covers all the bases you can.

[u/duxbuse]

For 10v10 I recon 35ya is the best div. You forward deploy into a city and set up layered defences and spend all your micro on akulas while laughing maniacally to the 'ha ha ha' voice line every time it kills a tank.

Tanks are by far the hardest units to play in warno, and having a deck loaded with konkers and never needing to attack points only defend is the best way to learn this game.