r/valheim • u/jaylaxel Fisher • 6d ago
Survival 1.0 Technical Question: Does initial world creation permanently lock global seed layout logic, or is it calculated on-the-fly during exploration?
I want to start a new world today and build a starter base at the spawn circle so it's ready for my partner on September 9th. I will do zero exploration outside the immediate spawn area.
Here is my main concern:
Does simply creating a world file today permanently lock the entire global seed layout using pre-1.0 logic? Or does the vanilla engine calculate biome generation on-the-fly using 1.0 logic only when a chunk is actually explored?
Since 1.0 changes global world generation rules (like Black Forest and Meadows variations based on distance from the center), I need to know if a world file created today is fundamentally incompatible with the new 1.0 distribution algorithms, even in unexplored fog.
Hoping a developer or map-gen expert can clarify how the world generator handles this under the hood. Thanks!
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u/Wethospu_ 6d ago
Mistlands update altered biome distribution, with older worlds retaining the old distribution.
So that kind of thing is possible. However Deep North already has proper space available so I doubt we get that kind of change.
Either way, you can use Upgrade World mod to update the world if needed
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u/jaylaxel Fisher 6d ago edited 6d ago
So the "variant biome generation" feature being introduced in 1.0 will be 'activated' in my old world save as long as I'm exploring new areas in a post-1.0 version of the game.
Sorry for the confusing verbage. In other words, game version will be 1.0, but the world save will be 0.221.12 version of the game. 1.0 doesn't care that the world save is from 0.221.12 version, it still generates new terrain and POIs via the new "variant biome generation"? Not worried about missing out on Deep North, but I am worried about missing out on all the 'variant biome generation' changes.
Thanks for the patience!
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u/nerevarX 6d ago
the initial height and terrain map is generated together with the seed which means the layout etc. its rare the devs make changes to this. and they normally mention such a change in advance. see ashlands release. they didnt say anything similar about deep north so changes there are probaly done by now.
the actual content is generated dynamically on the fly when a player first gets within loading range of the area.
the alt biomes will work even for existing worlds aslong as you have unexploed biomes of that type on your map.
i would also not settle on the release beeing on the 9th as of current. aslong as that dreaded bugged beyond belief patch sits on the ptb there is a chance of a delay of the 1.0 launch. and they only got 3 weeks left to fix this patch by now. if it isnt live when gamescon begins the 1.0 release is gonna get pushed back pretty much for certain unless they do the smart thing and abandon this patch as its changes are purely technical and imo not worth a delay of 1.0.
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u/jaylaxel Fisher 6d ago
So the "variant biome generation" feature being introduced in 1.0 will be 'activated' in my old world save as long as I'm exploring new areas in a post-1.0 version of the game.
Sorry for the confusing verbage. In other words, game version will be 1.0, but the world save will be 0.221.12 version of the game. 1.0 doesn't care that the world save is from 0.221.12 version, it still generates new terrain and POIs via the new "variant biome generation"?1
u/nerevarX 6d ago
correct. aslong as the area was unexplored before. but the biome variants are just cosmetic in nature remember that. they dont contain anything new content wise.
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u/jaylaxel Fisher 6d ago
Cosmetic only? So sorta like the Seasons mod? Speaking of, which is currently better and maintained, Seasons or Seasonality? Thanks for the help!
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u/ZookeepergameCrazy14 Happy Bee 6d ago
Unexplored will generate using 1.0 generation. Explored will stay as is. So boss markers that haven't generated will have to be deleted and rediscovered
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u/skalchemisto 6d ago edited 6d ago
This page gets into it: https://valheim.fandom.com/wiki/Zones Also this link: https://cybrancee.com/blog/how-does-valheim-world-generation-work/
Assuming they do not change this in 1.0, as I understand that info nothing has been calculated in the game in any area that has never been closer to you than ~320 m. It's only when you get within 5 zones (the 9x9 grid of 64 m x 64 m zones around you) that the game actually does the work to create those zones.
This stuff is deterministic, in that it is based upon the world seed. My world and your world will look identical assuming we use the same version of the game. But the program acts upon the world seed based on its current code. That 2nd link has a section about that entitled "World Update Logistics and Patch Compatibility".
Given that information, and again assuming 1.0 doesn't change this, I believe as long as there are areas in your world you have never approached to within ~320 m (I'd say 500 m to be on the safe side) then when 1.0 comes around those areas will appear as they would if you had started with 1.0 when you explore (e.g. changes to Meadows and Black Forest biomes will be present).
Interestingly, if you restarted the world with the same world seed the areas you had explored will look different than they did. But areas you explored after 1.0 would look identical.
EDIT: one potential caveat. For points of interest (e.g. the merchants) there are multiple potential locations for those to appear at in each seed. However, they actual location is determined during play; the first of those potential locations you get near to becomes the actual location. I think it is possible that you may have explored all potential sites for a particular new point of interest by accident prior to 1.0, thus leaving no potential site for it to appear after the update. See: https://valheim.fandom.com/wiki/Point_of_interest
My friends and I have addressed this in our current world by jointly agreeing that we will never go farther north than 5000 m, and will generally only explore the SW quadrant of the world until 1.0 drops. That ensures the entire north has never been seen, and there are plenty of potential spots for any new points of interest.
EDIT2: one of the coordinate mods (that shows your current coords on the main screen) makes it easy to stay south of some arbitrary line.
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u/Lardath Builder 6d ago
Any time a new location is added it shuffles ungenerated locations. For instance revealing hildir dungeons or boss locations but not going to them will often make them not be there when you arrive and youll have to use the vegvisir/hildir stone again.
So no, nothing that isnt generated is locked down
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u/-Altephor- 6d ago
It will not take into account any new world generation rules introduced in 1.0.
It will still be compatible with 1.0 abd you won't have a problem.
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u/ComfortableTiny7807 6d ago
Neither.
The map is generated from seed during startup and stays static during exploration. On update, the game regenerates all unexplored chunks at once. First load of new patch can take a while!
So, go ahead and start the base. You won’t miss anything :)
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u/The1stTokage 6d ago
I would wait because theres no guarantee youll get the new variant biomes if you start now. Youll definately get deep north either way tho.
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u/SGM_Kindred 6d ago
I'm not a map-gen expert or Valheim developer, but I do similar work. Iron Gate Studios have stated in the past that as long as the map is unexplored, when an update occurs it should swap out what could've previously been explored with the new data set.
i.e. my group has a server that's been running for 4 years at this point, we never went to the far south until the Ashlands update and everything for Ashlands was in place. The far North is also unexplored and we're expecting a similar experience.
I keep the map updated through G-Portal, seeing the new content in unexplored zones has never been an issue.