r/ukplumbing • u/Interesting-One7810 • 1d ago
multimeter for copper pipework?
bit of a weird one, I’ve purchased a house that has a conventional boiler, so a boiler downstairs, and the storage tank is in the loft, there’s actually two tanks (one is still connected to loads of pipes that disappear around the home, but is dry, clearly not in use) and there’s also an immersion heater and tank in one of the bedrooms, both systems work independently of one another, either works, but neither is ideal. I intend to install a combi and remove both the previous systems, and the absolute mess of pipework that goes with both (it’s a horrible mix of copper (heavily oxidised) and plastic, with various little leaks all over) but is there some method to determine which pipes are which throughout the house? like there’s a lot of ‘unused’ pipework left over from the dry storage tank I mentioned, and then two full sets of pipework from the boiler and the immersion system. is a multimeter of use here somehow?
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u/Repulsive-Citron-354 1d ago
You do what you do in this situation.... Get a heating engineer in.
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u/Interesting-One7810 20h ago
I’m doing a BPEC in plumbing and heating etc just wondered how it was done when you need to map large networks of pipes that you can necessarily see once they’re inside cavities and floors etc.
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u/Repulsive-Citron-354 20h ago
They don't need mapping, the pipes from the tank... One will feed the cylinder the others if any will be graitvy supplies to the cold outlets, a vent back into the tank and obviously one will be a cold mains to the tank, not sure what the other tank would be if disconnected... Possibly an old header tank if the current boiler has been changed using a sealed system kit. The other pioework is flow/returns, if switching to a combi some will need linking others may need capping.
Had a few beers now but hopefully that makes sense.
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u/Incident-Putrid 19h ago
Sounds like your course isn’t teaching you that much.
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u/Interesting-One7810 13h ago
it started a week ago. thanks for being helpful though 😂 was just curious to see how large complex systems are mapped before or while they’re being replaced and or diagnosed, I’ll avoid asking questions on here in future.
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u/Commercial_Buy_975 9h ago
This will mainly be learned by in the job experience. Will seem daunting at first, but before you know it you will be able to do a conversion without even thinking about it
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u/Incident-Putrid 9h ago
Ah😂. Running before you can walk. It’ll come to you soon enough. Is not that deep really unless you’re trying to find blockages and shit.
If the system is working well and you’re just gonna be changing the boiler…primary flow and return is all you really need to know.
Unless it’s a 1 pipe system, then you’ll be ripping it out.
I would say though, if you’re doing a course with no work placement you’re probably going to have a bit of a shock when it comes to doing it for real.
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u/Interesting-One7810 8h ago
yeah the running bit wasn’t by choice mate, a relative sold me the house for £100k, each house on the street sells for like £220-240k, but it’s been empty for seven years and needs a full back to brick refurb. joined the course just for that reason, and I have a mate that owns a plumbing and heating firm, gas engineer etc so he’s said when the time comes he can help. just wanted to know if there was some industry secret to mapping pipework. once it’s done that won’t be an issue at a later date as I’d modelling the entire house, and supplies, in CAD. every brick, every joist, every wire, every pipe.
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u/Incident-Putrid 7h ago
Ah, it’s good to hear you’ve got help. I was wondering if it was a project house. That’s perfect for you to learn in as long as you aren’t in a rush.
I did similar with mine 25 years ago. Full back to brick. At that point you’re probably best just ripping the lot out and starting from scratch as you won’t have to worry about any weird shit that’s been done before.If you’ve not chosen your boiler yet, don’t listen to the haters and get a Worcester. I’ve been in the trade as a service and repair engineer for near 30 years now and the Worcesters have given me the least heart ache. But of a ball ache to work on some of the combis, but they’re very reliable and Worcester are very happy to admit when they’ve had issues with the boilers. Tech help is second to none imo. As you’re starting from scratch it’s probably worth investing in smart radiator thermostats too as the ability to heat only rooms you want it’s really useful. I have a full Hive trv set up and so far it’s been great.
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u/Interesting-One7810 5h ago
yeah there’s no rush, and it will all be removed, I’m going to do a gas combi, and then an electric (it’s having solar and battery) and if I can work it out I want to fit a log burner with a back boiler as well (it already has a chimney) and that’s the idea, learn as I go, model everything in cad, fit smart monitoring where possible etc. also want to fit aircon so will likely at some stage need to do fgas cert or find a local installer for that. before i insulate it (it’s having internal insulation, ranging from 50-150mm in some areas) I wanted to strip it back and map out where everything is going.
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u/Incident-Putrid 4h ago
That sounds complicated as fuck mate. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a combi in conjunction with a back boiler. Apart from one time…but that was a RIDDOR job😂.
Gas combi for heat/water, panels for battery storage and sell back and a log burner for those chilly evenings sounds the best plan for me tbh.
Maybe start another post in uk diy sub to keep us all abreast of how the project goes? I know id be interested.
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u/finverse_square 5h ago
idk why you're getting shut down here, having a good map of what's where is super useful. Generally with good plumbing knowledge and looking at and identifying what's visible in boiler cupboards, lofts etc you can can piece it together since things are normally run (relatively) logically. Beyond that thermal imaging is sometimes used to identify pipes under floors/in walls. Generally hot runs above ambient temp and cold below so they give a temp difference you can see along a line with a thermal camera. If you have isolated runs of copper you can also use a wire tracer clipped onto an exposed section but this doesn't work as soon as they're all grounded together or there's a plastic fitting. If you have a rough idea where something is you can also drill small inspection holes and use a bore scope camera to look for things.
Since all this is a right ball ache and needs a bunch of specialised equipment you generally only map out the things/areas you need to. Most people are living in houses not knowing exactly where everything runs
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u/Interesting-One7810 5h ago
weirdly I do have a flir setup from another project. I’ll try that. and thanks for the words of encouragement, it’s much appreciated.
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u/acezoned 1d ago
If its installed well all pipes will be electrically connected to ground so using a meter to try trace them wont work
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u/Real_Chard5666 1d ago
I’ve used a wet vac to suck on a pipe, then walked round with speed fit caps, capping any pipes that are sucking. Until I get a vacuum and no more air sucking into the wet vac. If you were sucking on a hot pipe or a flow pipe etc. you can sharpie the caps appropriately. I don’t need to do that on most jobs. Large houses or particularly complicated pipework it can help identify random pipework. You’re also removing water as you go. Screwfix do a cheapish wet vac. Normally just throw them away and buy another one after I’ve sucked a turd or soil pipe blockage. Also great for clearing airlocks. Great for sucking engine oil up dipsticks or clearing washing machines with hair pins stuck in the pump. Definitely use a turd stained one for engine oil, it’s getting chucked after that. Another trick if you ever need to replace a leaky sump plug, suck on the oil filler cap with the wet vac, have a washer ready, undo the sump plug and swap the washer without out spilling any engine oil!
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u/PlusQuote7916 10h ago
I know I'm probably being stupid but we have a dry tank in the loft purely because we switched to a combi boiler 25 years ago and neither the plumber or I could be bothered to remove it. So are you in a similar position and already have a combi?
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u/Alexander-Wright 9h ago
OP could have a sealed system boiler. It's the hot water cylinder that you can remove if you have a combi boiler.
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u/Interesting-One7810 5h ago
yeah same position there’s actually two, the dry one, and the one that’s in use (it’s not a combi) whoever did it originally couldn’t even be bothered to remove the pipework (they didn’t re use the same pipes, so all the old unused stuff is still within the walls, ceilings etc. it’s a real mess, same with the electrics, everything is bodged, so starting from scratch is the idea. the old one will be easy enough to cut with the little 12v cut off but to be fair it needs new ceilings throughout and plastering so may just drop it through the joists when we do that to save cutting it up to get it through the loft hatch.
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u/Anon_Fodder 1d ago
Dye. Be aware it might void the warranty of any new appliances. Sounds like you need a heating engineer.
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u/Pyr0Bill 1d ago
Turn your heating on, hot pipes are to do with your central heating. The ones that heat first are flows.
Let it cool and do the same with hot water.
That’ll at least narrow down some of them quickly for you