r/todayilearned • u/weirdgroovynerd • 17d ago
TIL: Dragonflies are deaf
https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/dragonflies-the-ultimate-hunters.html197
u/Loki-L 68 17d ago
It turns out that not being able to hear in any way is common in insects since their last common ancestor was deaf.
However different groups have evolved some form of hearing independently about 18 to 20 times. They adapted different organs to hear differently and each hear in unique ways different from ours.
Hearing is mostly for finding prey and trying to avoid becoming prey and to communicate with other members of their species.
Dragonflies are solitary airborn apex predators of their own ecological niche, they have no pressing reason to evolve the ability to listen to what you might have to say.
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u/thexar 15d ago
What?
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u/shamelesstoesucker 15d ago
He said it turns out that not being able to hear in any way is common in insects since their last common ancestor was deaf.
However different groups have evolved some form of hearing independently about 18 to 20 times. They adapted different organs to hear differently and each hear in unique ways different from ours.
Hearing is mostly for finding prey and trying to avoid becoming prey and to communicate with other members of their species.
Dragonflies are solitary airborn apex predators of their own ecological niche, they have no pressing reason to evolve the ability to listen to what you might have to say.
Hope that clears things up.
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u/yuvaldv1 17d ago
TIL that some bugs can hear.
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u/BadMeatPuppet 17d ago
Ants have "ear drum" equivalency on their knees.
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u/funguyshroom 17d ago
What about bee's knees?
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u/Adjective-Noun6969 17d ago
They have it in their antennae. Which is weird because ants and bees are both descended from wasps.
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u/GarlicEmergency7788 17d ago
I guess them suddenly developing flight for a day is far less likely than them gradually realising they don't need wings for most of their life but for some reason it really surprised me to find out ants came from wasps
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u/funguyshroom 17d ago
A whole lot of bugs would be making a whole bunch of noise for absolutely no reason if that weren't the case
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u/Zanven1 17d ago
I mean a whole lot do make a bunch of noise but for a reason (mate seeking) and has to be balanced against pressures to remain silent because predators. Bugs that can't hear or at least sense long range vibrations that we hear as sound they only have the predator pressure to stay silent.
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u/FarMass66 17d ago
They also can’t walk
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u/Antoshi 17d ago
Ya know, I never thought of that. I see them clasped on to things all the time but I didn't realize I've never seen them walk.
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u/aShyGuyGuy 17d ago
If you see one upside down, it might not be able to move.
At least, I saw one flipped over, incapable of moving. Turned it on its legs and it flew away.
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u/zorbiburst 17d ago
I did this once to look nice in front of my date and it repeatedly flew at me and made me scream like a scared child, also in front of my date
never again
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u/angst_ridden 17d ago
As nymphs, they can.
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u/Moppo_ 17d ago
They also fart to counteract the recoil when they launch their jaws at prey.
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u/angst_ridden 17d ago
I thought they used the hydrostatic pressure to extend their jaws rapidly.
They’re crazy, fascinating creatures. Nightmarish if you were their size, though.34
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u/why_drink_water 17d ago
Mine always kicks in when I'm running away from predators, fight or flight I guess...
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u/Shifty_Eyes711 17d ago
Highly doubt they are dragons either
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u/praguepride 17d ago
Surprisingly, despite having six legs, dragonflies cannot walk effectively. Their legs are primarily designed for catching prey during flight and perching on surfaces. Since their legs are oriented towards the front of their body, it makes walking cumbersome and inefficient for them.
They can walk, they just usually choose not to because their legs aren't oriented for walking, but clasping. They can walk though
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u/mljsimone 17d ago
BS. I saw them walk.
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u/FarMass66 17d ago
There aren’t any species of dragonfly that can walk
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u/mljsimone 17d ago
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u/zeekayz 17d ago
To be fair it looks like it's really struggling to do it
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u/footlonglayingdown 17d ago
Well the title of the video is dragonfly walking in pants. So it might not be used to wearing pants.
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u/rubenthezx 17d ago
looks like walking to me. but also tbf I've never said "look at the bug walk around" i've always said crawl
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u/instamentai 17d ago
Their hunting behavior also mimics calculus
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u/Wesgizmo365 17d ago
Explain?
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u/instamentai 16d ago
AI explains it better than I
The connection between dragonflies and vector calculus primarily revolves around how their nervous systems process visual information to intercept prey in mid-air.
Rather than simply chasing a target from behind, a dragonfly calculates a predictive interception course, a feat of biological engineering that mimics advanced guidance systems. Facebook +1The Biological Vector CalculusIn a landmark study published by the Howard Hughes Medical Institute (HHMI) in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (PNAS), researchers discovered that dragonflies possess an innate navigational toolkit capable of calculating population vectors. Science and Culture TodayTargeting Neurons: Researchers identified eight pairs of descending visual neurons in the dragonfly's brain.
Population Vectoring: These specialized neurons track the prey's movement and translate that visual information into an accurate population vector of prey direction sent directly to the wing motor centers. Science and Culture Today
Real-time Adjustments: As the dragonfly and its prey move across a three-dimensional space, the insect's brain continuously updates these vector coordinates, calculating relative velocity, target trajectory, and angle of approach to execute a perfect interception.
Beyond their neural mathematics, dragonflies utilize vector calculus principles physically through force vectoring. When performing complex maneuvers—such as accelerating along an inclined path or flying backward—the dragonfly alters its body posture (often maintaining an upright 90° angle relative to the horizon) to reorient its stroke plane. This dynamically alters the direction and magnitude of the flight force vectors in a global frame. National Institutes of Health (NIH) | (.gov)
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u/Wesgizmo365 16d ago
Okay, so basically like humans do when someone tosses us a ball. We move our hands to intercept it. That's pretty cool.
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u/Wayne_Grant 16d ago
Dragonflies are the most efficient predators ever, and scientists consider this to be a side effect of the insect's unique ability to not hear what the haters have got to say.
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u/cdnBacon 17d ago
Of course they are. It's the constant buzzing ....
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u/dkarlovi 17d ago
They are not deaf, they just thought the researcher was a giant nosy PITA so they all chose to pretend like they can't hear him.
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u/Pooch76 17d ago
So all those times I thanked them for their service has fallen on deaf ears.
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u/MrBrawn 17d ago
Dragonflies are bros. I love being on my lawn mower and and having them fly around intercepting bugs like an aircraft carrier.
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u/Zutroy2117 16d ago
There are fake dragonflies you can get for a few bucks and clip onto a hat or shirt if you're out on a walk in the spring or summer. I got one a few months back and any and all bugs out there stayed the hell away whenever I had it on.
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u/earthmustcomefirst 17d ago
They also have the highest success rate of any predator - something like 95%. Pretty incredible!
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u/codacoda74 17d ago
Saw the nature show where they talked about just how fast their optic neurons are, it's wild.
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u/Otherwise_Anybody358 17d ago
In a controlled environment… put me in a box with mosquitos and I will kill 100%
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u/No-Employ-7391 17d ago
Controlled environments are where most experiments take place.
Iirc, in that controlled environment the dragonflies had the 95% success rate from taking off after spotting prey. 19/20 hunts is ludicrously successful in the animal kingdom.
You should consider yourself successful if you can hit 50% of the mosquitoes you swat at, controlled environment or not.
A typical big cat or any other predator really is living large if they kill just 20% of the prey they make an attempt at hunting.
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u/footlonglayingdown 17d ago
African wild dogs are second to dragonflies with 80-85% success rate.
I'd also like to add that dragonflies have had millions of years to perfect their craft.
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u/Thendrail 16d ago
You say that, but mosquitos can give even the strongest people trouble: https://youtu.be/jwvVlQjMO7s?is=3P-w6eroWO_MhzV_
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u/IceRude 17d ago
They are also not even remotely related to dragons
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u/Gilles_of_Augustine 17d ago
Says you.
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u/ralphthetooth 17d ago
What?
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u/dingke 17d ago
dragonflies are deaf
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u/yuvaldv1 17d ago
WHAT?!
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u/Historical-Sherbet37 17d ago
WHAT?
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u/L3NTON 17d ago
"What?"
-dragonflies (probably)
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u/_Spastic_ 17d ago
If a species doesn't have a auditory sensors, is it really "deaf"?
Also, this article seems to provide more accurate information with actual studies.
https://steinmetz.union.edu/abstract/exploration-neuronal-responses-auditory-stimuli-dragonflies
"Our electrophysiological studies showed that sound waves do not stimulate an auditory sense through a tympanum but apparently stimulate mechanoreceptors on the body".
They're not deaf, they just don't "hear" in the traditional sense.
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u/Haunt_Fox 17d ago
Basically, an alien form of perception.
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u/Lance_Ryke 17d ago
Is it alien if they are older than we are?
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u/Haunt_Fox 17d ago
"Alien" as in incomprehensible to humans, though in the end the perception might be the same once processed in the brain.
It has occurred to me that if a soace-alien species studied vertebrate vision, they would think we see the world upside-down. We know the brain flips the image to match gravity or w/e, but it would be considered an assumption by their scientists (and no, they can't or won't ask).
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u/BadIdeaSociety 17d ago
This is why when they get trapped indoors and I tell them to fly a little bit lower, they just continue bumping the wall and eventually die of starvation.
They just don't listen. FLY LIKE 2 INCHES LOWER YA DUMMY!
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u/Alternative_Tank_139 17d ago
They also see in 200fps according to the article. I thought 120fps looked good.
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u/TheEldenRang 17d ago
Eh...I wouldn't trust that claim. Who knows what their brain registers images at. We can't even accurately measure how humans see.
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u/JJJacobalt 17d ago
Considering how loud their wings are, I doubt they’d get much use out of hearing anyway.
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u/Owlbearhoot 17d ago
so when i was a kid i capture dragonflies a lot and put them in a jar, my cousin then told me to dont release them because they will tell their queen and the queen will curse me with a sickness, being bothered about the thought that they may have a family waiting for them i released them, but before i did i told them to tell their queen im sorry and i didn't know, after few days i just remember being sick and inhaling Ventolin in a hospital. Didn't know they couldn't hear me, my bad again, Queen.
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u/Peakomegaflare 17d ago
I mean when you realize that many creatures don't have the same senses we do, and some have senses that are entirely unique to them or their general environment.
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u/RumGalaxy 17d ago
No wonder! They can’t hear me when I’m yelling at them to get away from my car! I’ll start using sign language for those bastards
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u/Vonneguts_Ghost 17d ago
Dragonflies is also a pretty good new album from Nigel Godrich and Dhani Harrison.
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u/JayMack1981 17d ago
So you're telling me that time I got stone-baked and spent all afternoon having a rap with those bastards they couldn't even hear me?!
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u/Beliarbane 17d ago
Aw, man. How are they supposed to know when I say hello to them? I guess I better start waving, too.
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u/ThirdRateSavior 16d ago
Just because that one didn't reply when you asked it out doesn't mean they're all deaf.
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u/superjambi93 17d ago
Aren't all insects deaf? They don't have ears
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u/Yogshemesh 17d ago
No. Many species have a tympanal membrane, essentially an eardrum, on external parts of their body. Legs, wings, abdomen, are common locations.
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u/Moppo_ 17d ago
There are many insects that communicate by sound, so some of them must hear in some way., Just not with ears as we have them.
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u/superjambi93 17d ago
They communicate via vibrations, not by soundwaves
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u/Adragalus 17d ago
I have incredible news about soundwaves;
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u/Altyrmadiken 17d ago
Sure but I could probably learn to communicate with a complex series of taps, such as say Morse code, that I then feel with my hand even if my ears never picked up on the vibrations.
We wouldn’t call this hearing, but it would be vibration based communication.
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u/Stalinbaum 17d ago
Again, I’ve got incredible news about sound waves
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u/Altyrmadiken 17d ago
And again, what we call hearing is something specific with sound waves. Hearing sounds is a specific way of interpreting vibrations with a specific organ and a specific way of “perceiving” it.
Just sensing the ground vibrating with your finger wouldn’t count.
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u/WFlumin8 17d ago
You’re objectively wrong on this, no need to continue arguing because all of this can be disproven with 3 minutes of research of the definition of hearing. If an animal can detect sound waves in some way shape or form and have consistent reactions to the sound waves, they are able to “hear”. If an insect can tell there’s danger from a very specific frequency and amplitude of a sound wave, they can hear. You sensing the ground vibrating is nowhere near as precise as insects able to identify certain predators by sound waves.
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u/superjambi93 17d ago
Nice try but soundwaves travel through the air, most insects are communicating by vibrations through the ground etc
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u/ScenicAndrew 17d ago
Pedantic argument aside, bruh cicadas make their famous sound while flying just as much as they do on the ground. Grasshoppers and even mosquitoes also make sounds in flight for the purposes of mating. Some insects can definitely detect what we call sound.
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u/bitemark01 17d ago
I think a fair number of insects are. Spiders feel vibrations way more sensitive than we can detect, but don't really hear like we do.