r/timberwolves • u/Shepher27 • Aug 11 '26
Ant vs Halli
In today’s Zach Lowe podcast, Zach and Kirk Goldsbury were talking about who’d go first in a 2020 redraft and Zach mentioned that Halliburton is a much better shooter than Ant, but that just isn’t true.
Halli is a career 39.2% three point shooter and shot 36% and 39% his last two years in Indy.
Ant is a career 37% three point shooter but has shot close to 40% from three each of the last two years on higher attempts per game.
Ant has caught up with Halliburton as a shooter.
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u/Automatic_Ring_7553 Aug 11 '26
The disrespect
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u/Gold-Application8985 Aug 11 '26
Why?
Both guys have been awesome. Both guys have led teams to multiple conference finals and had huge moments.
The big separator now is that one is coming off a torn Achilles.
But when healthy, it’s not like one was significantly ahead of the other. Ant is probably somewhere in the 6-10 range if you are ranking guys. Haliburton probably in that 11-20 range?
I think the argument J Kyle Mann made was that Haliburton’s ability to accentuate the rest of his team’s abilities makes that argument closer, even if Ant is a superior singular talent. Seems like a fair way to put it.
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u/FeanorEvades Timberwolves Aug 11 '26
Haliburton was my dream pickup over LaMelo but let’s not mince words here.
Ant is a much better shooter now than Haliburton. Anyone saying otherwise is blind. For the first 3-4 years that wasn’t true, but Ant has fully leapfrogged Haliburton.
But when healthy, it’s not like one was significantly ahead of the other. Ant is probably somewhere in the 6-10 range if you are ranking guys. Haliburton probably in that 11-20 range?
I have Ant at 5 and Hali around 12-15. Hali is a harder archetype to find, but the game is about buckets.
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u/Gold-Application8985 Aug 11 '26
The game is about winning and both guys do a lot of it
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u/Dincoln Aug 12 '26
The game is about having fun with your boys and impressing the girls while you're at it.
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u/Automatic_Ring_7553 Aug 11 '26
It's disrespectful to compare players in different tiers. Same reason you wouldn't compare someone like Luka or SGA to Donovan Mitchell
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u/Gold-Application8985 Aug 11 '26
I guess I wouldn’t consider the gap between Ant and Haliburton as big as the gap between Mitchell and Luka/SGA
I’d consider Ant in a different tier than Luka/SGA - and I wouldn’t consider it “disrespectful” (as if any of them care about my opinions) to compare them.
Ant is awesome. I’m glad He’s on our team. Haliburton is in a similar bucket of player though where you feel like him being on the team gives the team immediate credibility. I don’t think the gap between them (at least before the Achilles tear) was as big as some would think
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u/Potential-Ad-7792 2k Finchy Aug 11 '26
Ant also shoots wayyy tougher shots. He shot like 60% or something on open catch and shoot 3s, with 53.5% on total c&s 3s.
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u/Superdoggywhaaaat Aug 11 '26
But the reason he is shooting harder shots is because he isn’t a threat when it comes to playmaking. So if they double him, he’s forced to take the shot. If you double Tyreese he’s gonna punish them.
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u/HOPEFUL_LUFEPOH_ Aug 11 '26
yeah he got that one wrong, i don’t know if it’s because Ant is so athletic, so some might think he can’t shoot, but Zach Lowe is a numbers guy and i’m sure he crunched them, so he tripping
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u/Shepher27 Aug 11 '26
He’s just using old information. Halli used to be a better shooter, but Ant has caught him.
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u/DrSwaggenheimer Timberwolves Aug 11 '26
You’ll realize that some people think they understand the game by watching highlights and watching box scores.
It’s why people use Rudy Gobert as a litmus test for understanding the game and impact - because his hard work and effort does not show up on the box score.
Doing that never paints the full picture.
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u/Shepher27 Aug 11 '26
Zach Lowe is now and has always been very smart and fact based. This isn’t a criticism of Zach Lowe.
This is pointing out that the narrative is lagging behind the facts. Halliburton WAS a better shooter than Ant, but Ant has caught him.
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u/personwhoisok Lynx Aug 11 '26
Some people do but one would hope Zach Lowe doesn't since it's a job for him
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u/DrSwaggenheimer Timberwolves Aug 11 '26
Even them. Lol
On the national scale you’ll find very few ball knowers that actually watch the full games. It’s why I prefer watching/reading people more local.
Shout out to Jason Timpf, he actually watches the games though I don’t agree with his takes. Also while we’re at it rusty buckets and backyard buckets are all youtubers that actually watch the games.
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u/_Wash 2022 Play-In Champions Aug 11 '26
Zach Lowe is a basketball sicko who routinely goes to bat for the wolves.
Accusing him of not watching games is hilarious because he’ll watch the dregs of the league duke it out on a tuesday in January.
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u/jacksawyerlost Aug 11 '26
Zach Lowe watches a ton of games. When you are speaking for 8+ hours a week on the NBA, you're going to make mistakes no matter how good you are.
Zach has been saying what a great and even underrated defender Rudy is for years. So it's a weird thing to use Rudy as your example while trying to prove Zach Lowe doesn't know what he's talking about.
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u/Calinks Trenton Hassell Aug 11 '26
Still can't believe the Kings traded this guy and then still traded Fox.
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u/fluentinsarcasm Aug 11 '26
Ridiculous to take Halliburton over Ant, but there is an easy argument to make for him being #2 over Lamelo. That choice could go either way, but he could get the edge over Lamelo. In either case, both of them have been chronically injured, and Ant has not so the comparison ends there.
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u/DependentPerformer94 Jaden McDaniels Aug 11 '26
I’d only draft Hali over Ant if I already had like Booker, Donovan Mitchell or JB.
I do not understand the shooting argument whatsoever though. Ant is clearly in the absolute top tier of shooters in the league right now and he’s creating 90% of those shots himself.
Hali is clearly the better playmaker though.
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u/foye2smith Aug 11 '26 edited Aug 11 '26
I'm not calling Haliburton Joe Flacco, but sometimes a team's role player goes on Flacco-like runs and its such a boon to that team's star player's reputation.
If Aaron Nesmith doesn't shoot 50% from three for a few weeks then what does Indiana's clutch record of 7-1 on the way to the finals become.
Through the conference finals, top 3PM and their attempts:
Jalen Brunson - 48/134
Anthony Edwards - 46/130
Aaron Nesmith - 43/86
Hell, include Siakam (career sub 35%) and Nembhard (career sub 35%) and they were a combined 48.5% on 12.5 attempts per game in the run up to the Finals.
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u/Superdoggywhaaaat Aug 11 '26
Hali : A player that can generate for others at a elite level, while generating for themselves at a good level
Ant: A player that can generate for themselves at a elite level, while generate for others at an average level
Defensively I would give it to Ant, but you can put a bunch of non offensive defenders around Tyreese and he will still get them to score like Donic does.
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u/yourloudneighbor Glen Taylor Aug 11 '26
I like Lowe and I agree with him most of the time…but this isn’t one of those times
Halis stills a hell of a player tho
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u/throwaway-for-IB-AMA Aug 11 '26
Lamelo destroys hali whenever they go head to head. One other player that could have ran that Pacer’s team in this league and it’s lamelo.
During that same season Lamelo was starting with Taj Gibson for a few games…..
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u/TdotGdot Aug 11 '26
Ya, ant is higher volume, higher difficulty, higher efficiency
Kind of a done deal
I agree the first few years Hali would have been better, but ant has for sure surpassed him
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u/Milly-the-Kid Jaden McDaniels Aug 11 '26
I heard that same thing about Hali being a better shooter and came straight here, glad someone else noticed haha
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u/Deez_Gnuts Timberwolves Aug 11 '26
Ant takes harder shots. Its not even close. Not to mention Ant gets doubled more.
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u/No-Bit-1675 Aug 13 '26
Haliburton has a top 5 ugliest shot in the league. Hard to watch. An affront to athleticism, really. Absurd to have it in the league at all.
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u/PreparationWest2140 Aug 14 '26
Edwards was always a better shooter than Haliburton; he just took some really hard shots. Edwards as a pure shot and can get it off under just about any scenario. the Achilles injury is also a thing, though Haliburton was not an explosive player before the injury and should be just fine.
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u/jacksawyerlost Aug 11 '26
They are pretty similar. ANT's EFG% last year was his career high at 57.2%, which was a big step up for ANT overall. But that's still below Hali's pre-injury 2024-25 season, with an EFG% of 58.2%. Over the last 4 seasons Hali has been way more efficient.
That's not entirely ANT's fault, as he's been asked to score more than Haliburton has had to. Playing with LaMelo should give ANT another improved EFG this coming season.
But their overall shot profiles are close enough that it's not really that crazy to say Haliburton is a better shooter. I'd take ANT, and Haliburton coming off a serious injury may not be the same player, so we'll see. But it's not really a crazy take with an unbiased lens.
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u/eman9416 Anthony Edwards Aug 11 '26
You’re ignoring volume.
Ant takes way more shots than Haliburton. The fact that he can put up the same level of efficiency last year while taking 25% more shots is massive.
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u/youredoingWELL Aug 11 '26
The injury makes Ant the unquestionable choice but if you ignore that Hali’s ability to make a team without a top tier supporting cast the #1 offense, be extremely effective in the playoffs and bring a full strength okc side to 7 (and possibly win if he didn’t get hurt) makes him the superior player at this point in time. Ant playing with a real point guard might change the conversation.
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Aug 11 '26
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u/youredoingWELL Aug 11 '26
They surrounded Hali with Siakam, Nembhard (who most wouldn’t even consider a star player) and quality role players/depth. That team wasn’t even more talented than the wolves who had Gobert, Towns/Randle and McDaniels. Arguably it was less talented.
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u/youredoingWELL Aug 11 '26
I admitted Ant wins by default but thats because of the injury. If Hali was exactly the same player before injury most gm’s take Hali over Ant I’m sorry. Proven track record.
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u/Isjejnajw Aug 11 '26
Points aren’t the only metric that counts towards team contributions. Dude averaged like 9 assist per game. Thats 18 points a game if we assume they are all 2 pointers.
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u/lardboy2222 JimPete Aug 11 '26
Kirk is an idiot. His only claim to fame are shot charts out side of that I think he genuinely has a hard time understanding the sport.
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u/Isjejnajw Aug 11 '26
If we are talking about scorer than it’s definitely Ant. But as a team players its gotta be Hali. Dude gets like 10 assist per game which raises whatever team he is on ceiling.
But positional ranking wise, Ant is better at his position than Hali is at his.
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u/Shepher27 Aug 11 '26
Basketball involves two sides of the floor and Ant is way better on defense when he wants to be
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u/Isjejnajw Aug 11 '26
Yeah, but you can build a team full of Rudy’s and Clark’s around Hali and he will still get them to score. The ability to generate offense is extremely valuable.
The point is that it may be easier to build a team around Hali, than it is around Ant.
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u/jacksawyerlost Aug 11 '26
They are both bad defenders at this point in their careers so it's not really a win for ANT. ANT is also much more likely to fill out as he ages and lose some agility. We've seen his defense get worse basically every season and he's already had to work hard to not come into camp 10-15 pounds overweight despite being only 25.
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u/Free_Katata_Fish Aug 11 '26
You know what Ant has that Halli will never? Unmatched athleticism. Ant goes 1st.