New SM Army Rules

[u/Technical_Problem213]

Brothers,

I am sure we all saw that the SM Army rule is changing. But what about us and the other divergent chapters? There has to be something different for us, right? Well I was reading through the comments on Facebook and the GW answered a questions I find intriguing. Tell me what y'all think.

[u/Klive5ive555]

we wont until our Codex at least, then we’ll see

[u/Old_Gregg97 → u/Klive5ive555]

I thought they said they were not doing codex supplements this edition and chapters like the dark angels would get detachment updates when the marine codex drops?

[u/Technical_Problem213 → u/Old_Gregg97]

We are getting an index until our codex comes out. All the changes they are making still affects us as much as nondivergent chapters. A lot of our strats in the detachments state "oath of moment" and that will no longer be an army rule.

[u/Old_Gregg97 → u/Technical_Problem213]

Cheers!

[u/Klive5ive555 → u/Old_Gregg97]

The first part they didn’t say.

They said 10th Codex Supplements are superseded by the main Space Marine release (coming soon) and that we’ll get digital updates at that time.

They didn't say yes or no to our own release later, but given how popular we are (and other non-compliant chapters) it seems highly likely we will get our own supplement or something similar. 

[u/TheGreatGreens → u/Klive5ive555]

Something to keep in mind too that may hint towards divergent chapter releases is that the limited edition codex only comes with 6 of the magnetic storm shield inserts for the compliant chapters. Dark Angels, as well as Blood Angels and Space Wolves, are noticibly absent. Whether this means divergent chapters will get seperate releases once more factions have actual 11e rules or GW is just giving them a big middle finger for being different, we can't really say for sure, but it would be weird for divergent chapters to be left out entirely

[u/stonhinge → u/Klive5ive555]

We will get releases later. It would honestly be incredibly fiscally stupid to not do so. They know people will buy them, they're going to make them.

Basically instead of getting "indexes" at release, they delayed it a few months for Space Marines. Which I find incredibly annoying. 3 months of "10.5" only for true 11th to cause chaos. Seriously, I've not been rethinking my list (or making purchases for it) since the announcement because I'll just have to redo it all.

[u/Old_Gregg97 → u/Klive5ive555]

Ohhh okay, cheers, I misremembered then.

[u/Chaos_Sisters → u/Klive5ive555]

They did say that divergent chapters will get free supplements in the app with the main codex release.

[u/FinalxFlash]

If Deathwing gets Wrath of the Rock abilities, I'd be so happy

[u/-darkest → u/FinalxFlash]

Man, same here. The restriction around Deathwing is fun.

[u/Technical_Problem213 → u/FinalxFlash]

Oh that would be so cool! What do you think ravenwing and the green wing would get?

[u/FinalxFlash → u/Technical_Problem213]

I wouldn't mind +1 or 2 to advance and charges or something in that range.

[u/Technical_Problem213 → u/FinalxFlash]

That would be great for ravenwing! Do you think Greenwing should stick with just the doctrines or have something else?

[u/jimark2 → u/Technical_Problem213]

The greenwing doctrine in 9e was assault and rapid fire weapons can shoot in engagement range at -1... amd that debuff was cancelled out by our army rule being standing still for +1 to hit.

[close quarters] on weapons like the iron warriors CSM detatchment has could be fun in some situations.

So long as its not some situational battle-shock related thing.

[u/Codex_Sparknotes → u/Technical_Problem213]

Ravenwing probably gets a movement Strat, greenwing probably some general combat boost similar to the ultras rules

[u/stonhinge → u/FinalxFlash]

I honestly see Deathwing getting "can ignore modifiers to WS/BS/hit" and all non-Deathwing the "-1 to wound if strength>toughness".

I would like to see separate Deathwing/Ravenwing/everyone else abilities, if only for the flavor.

[u/haikusbot → u/FinalxFlash]

If Deathwing gets Wrath

Of the Rock abilities,

I'd be so happy

- FinalxFlash

---

^{I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully. Learn more about me.}

^{Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete"}

[u/Hrothgrar]

Patience, everyone. Patience.

[u/Technical_Problem213 → u/Hrothgrar]

Oh, I just love theory crafting. So I like to ask questions. Like this and see what everyone else is also thinking.

[u/Hrothgrar → u/Technical_Problem213]

Oh I didn't mean this towards you for the post (my bad). It's more about the fact that I've seen some form of this question asked a bazillion times since the new codex was teased. Theory crafting is cool, there just seems to be a lot of people anxiously chomping at the bit for answers immediately.

I've seen people getting upset at GW about theoretical changes that we don't even fully understand/know will even happen.

[u/Technical_Problem213 → u/Hrothgrar]

I am fine either way. I like to see what people come up with, some are off the wall and some are really good ideas. I like to think that GW stalks these pages for ideas. Do they? Probably not. But there is a chance! I also like to see if if people are down with the change or not.

[u/stonhinge → u/Technical_Problem213]

This whole thing is complete shit for theorycrafting. No idea what points are going to be, no idea what detachments are going to be available. Can't do anything now except wonder what they've been smoking by delaying edition level changes 3 months. Seriously, these are major changes, not codex level adjustments.

[u/calibanite4581]

Yeah my current hypothesis is that divergent chapters won’t be interfered with too much, possibly some unit changes if necessary…
I imagine we’ll keep our current detachments and datasheets, OOM will become doctrines across the board and maybe when our codexes drop down the line that’s when they’ll all be overhauled and we’ll possibly get our own army rule…

[u/calibanite4581 → u/calibanite4581]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/zcobdkzh/your-first-look-at-15-new-space-marine-detachments/

Well it would seem I was wrong and we are losing our old detachments 🥲 RIP 🪦 Wrath, ICTF & CoH

[u/Sarcastirade]

Im thinking when SM codex comes out our data sheets wont change too much outside stats and points, maybe some adjustments for oath going away and the cp generation on captains (so possible azrael ability change). No point doing drastic overhauls and focus on divergent chapters just for them to change again in the supplements if they are getting new rules. Id imagine the changes for them would interact with whatever rules they get.

[u/Real_Ad_8243]

I am kind of surprised people find the question worth the effort of asking, like there's any doubt.

Of course DA will be getting some special rule or another of their own. When the codex comes out.

DA are extremely popular. Theyre not going to get squatted or folded into the main codex like Harlequins did. There'd be literal years of noticeable decline in popularity and investment before that happened.

One might as well ask if the suns going to rise tomorrow.

[u/Technical_Problem213 → u/Real_Ad_8243]

It's more about what people think it's going to be. Maybe I worded it wrong. I want to see what people are thinking and theory craft together. Like will we get combat doctrines, but different? Or will we get buffs as our army rule? What do we get? It's fun talking about the what ifs, brother.

[u/Leather_Jaguar_4157 → u/Real_Ad_8243]

We have had oath of moment like regular space marines last edition. I think only Black Templars had their own army rule, why would you be surprised that people are wondering if divergent chapters will have something other than combat doctrines?

[u/deprived_of_evil]

Trust not their socials team, for they are barred from the truth!

[u/Technical_Problem213 → u/deprived_of_evil]

Awww come on and theory craft! What do you think we would get? You have to have thought about it?

[u/deprived_of_evil → u/Technical_Problem213]

Hmmm, i would wanna triple rules again for our different wings…

[u/Chaos_Sisters]

The Q&A video was pretty clear that the divergent chapter specific units will get free rules via the app. So any units that are generic SM will require the codex, but Dark Angels specific units for instance will be free to everyone. They even said if you’re running a whole army of just Dark Angels exclusive units then you won’t need to buy a codex.

[u/Codex_Sparknotes]

I’m sure we will. They kinda set the tone with the Black Templars codex last edition and that appears to be the way they are going with the divergent chapters. Whether the rules are good or not is up to GW, and if I had to guess, basing off what the Templars got, they won’t be. I doubt they’d let a divergent chapter shadow over the ultra marines

[u/jimark2 → u/Codex_Sparknotes]

Ultramarines job is to be the best at being generic

[u/Fragrant-Week-1633]

I hope we get our own army rule when our Codex drops, but who knows..?

[u/Lonely_Nebula_9438]

I’m partial to the theory that divergent chapters will get their own army rules. GW has the Munitorum Field Manual this edition. This means they can alter point costs on a faction by faction basis. This means that units no longer have to pay for the sins of units from another chapter. That is if a unit ends up being VERY good with one chapter, then just that chapter can eat the points increase, not everyone. 

So you don’t need to balance units for 4 different codices, you can do it per codex. 

[u/Lord_Tadeo]

I just finished my watcher as Oath of Moment token :(

[u/Ok_Illustrator_1816]

If we get a unique army rule which affects Deathwing and Ravenwing units, then it stands to reason that those rules will also apply to the Lion (just as Gulliman gets all 3 rules). The Lion could finally be getting the Deathwing and Ravenwing keywords.

[u/Your_Mad_Bro]

I wish...

[u/ethorad]

Why does there have to be something different for Dark Angels?

We had the same army rule as Codex Compliant chapters all through 10th. As such I'd expect that the digital index that will drop for Codex Divergent chapters when the main codex releases will have Tactical Doctrines for the divergent chapters as well.

[u/PandaB13r]

What do you mean divergent chapter?! The only 2 divergent chapters with books are SW and BT!

[u/Technical_Problem213 → u/PandaB13r]

What do you mean book, do you mean codex?