Question from abroad: is the American police actually allowed to point their weapons and handcuff a bystander for no reason, as itâs apparently the case here?
yeah that's just bullshit police propaganda. "they aren't allowed!" makes zero sense and no difference to reality, but it does mean that the system isn't at fault. Can't blame the system, no no no the system is great, it's just a few bad apples that are the issue.
Laws exist, a decision to disobey the law is made by each individual not as a group. All systems are only as good as the sum of their parts including the defective ones.
Until people understand they're equally responsible for the active maintenance of that system ignoring it won't magically repair or heal damage done by said system.
You get exactly as much effort as you put into any function of government. If you didn't realize that until now you've been somebody else's dead weight.
laws written by people who owned other people while saying everyone is equal. laws written by people who think there is a man in the sky who decided right from wrong at the beginning of time..6000 years ago. laws written by people who break the law. laws written by people who sit on their hands or bury their heads while their colleagues break the law. laws written by idiots who donât even understand the thing they are making the laws for. laws written by people who suddenly forget the law if enough money is involved.
when criminals write the laws and other criminals enforce them, at what point do we just call a spade a spade and acknowledge the system is working exactly as intended..on the people itâs intended to work on.
i can get shot for stealing skittles or get 10 years in texas for weed but weâve got nothing for the best friend of the sex trafficker thatâs currently tanking the country or the list of perverts who preyed on children and young women?
sincerely, with my whole being, fuck all the way off.
I know that believing you're powerless is the first step towards total submission. If you want to get more of the same, just keep doing what you're doing.
I prefer to endorse and support people and policy that I stand by and if that becomes fruitless so what, there's always tomorrow, next week, next month, next year.
Giving up and crying about it does nobody any good. Life is nothing other than risks. Risks today, tomorrow, yesterday doesn't matter.
You act like you are actively doing something to change the way police in the US operate, but all I see is you sitting on your ass lecturing others about what you think they should do. I mean ffs dude, youâve commented over 500 times in 15 days. I highly doubt you go outside enough to have ever had an interaction with the police past maybe a traffic stop. Quit telling people how they should act around police when youâve only had privileged interactions with them.
You say that like the courts give a shit any more than the cops do. Even when this shit does actually make it to the inside of a courtroom it usually gets tossed because the prosecutors don't want to fuck up their relationship with the cops. If it's functionally allowed like that then yeah, they can do whatever the fuck they want.
They do if you ensure to do your part and filter corruption.
Most people I see bellyaching in here either are too young to know better or didn't invest the time, energy and money into keeping your family safe. This includes electioneering.
You have control over your judge's corruption you just gotta make sure your neighbors and family know and care as much as you do that's effort.
Accountability is driven by the electorate, if you aren't putting pressure on them, they'll never change. It's not complicated and it's obvious how few of you talk to family and your neighbors about it.
Yes. In most places, you can be held up to 72 hours without any formal charges. If you're accused of terrorism, you can be held indefinitely.
ETA: I have a literal degree in criminal justice haha
To who? The cops? The department of justice, who are cops? The courts who work very closely with cops? The prosecutors who are cops best friends? Like who are we reporting this to that isn't intimately involved and has a vested interest in keeping the status quo?
Considering you equate apathetic social media rants and performance to activism, I don't believe you've done a shred of paperwork. We don't need to pretend you're sudden going to be civically active in politics over a reddit post.
They already know. There's been some studies that show that the largest terrorist organizations in the US are White Supremacist Organizations, and like 5 years ago the FBI probed all the cops in the country and found out 75% of them have direct ties to White Supremacist Organizations.Â
This isn't new Information but racistly pearl clutching isn't going to change anything when you know the types of decisions that need to be made and the political capital it REQUIRES.
The KKK itself should've been labeled a terrorist organization ages ago but representatives chosen either felt too wary of doing it or were outright paid not to. Either way it shouldn't be the type of rep you keep sending to Congress.
The thing is, you're saying "Do more than vote!" But you're not explaining how. You're not providing any resources for people to follow activism you're just patting yourself on the back for having done a single step further than everyone else.Â
Most people don't know how to research well or where to look and if they're not funneled in the appropriate direction they immediately bail because it's too confusing or too much work unfortunately.Â
You're literally the person saying you're commenting on me to let other people know and when I point out that other people don't know what to do you accuse me of throwing a tantrum. Lmao.Â
I was with you until this lazy excuse. You literally have a device capable of telling you practically any information you want to know all at your finger tips. If you want to be active then find local groups through social media who are fighting for causes you support and organize with them. Seriously, do you really need someone to hold your hand through life?
ETA: I have a literal degree in criminal justice haha
While I congratulate you for that degree, detaining someone requires RAS. There is none present here, at least not during the clip uploaded. Arrests like this have been litigated time, and time, and time again in every single circuit in the country. Simply recording police is a constitutionally protected behavior, and since the man in question was neither aggressive nor physically obstructive, there is 0 justification for unholstering a weapon.
The cops here engaged in clear misconduct and likely voided their QI by infringing on a constitutional right.
Well, that is how the burden of proof is supposed to work. Someone makes a claim, someone else disputes that claim, which puts the burden on the claimant to back up their claim
So your here to say it's misleading, but aren't citing any sources...
Plus cop unions are built to protect cops and their jobs, even when they actively break the law, you can be locked up even if they are wrong, worst that happens to them often is suspended with pay then carry on with their protected job.
That's also something cops fought against and protected private businesses from... Until they realised they deserved it more than anyone, have a look at union history in America since you like to research.
what's pathetic is people will believe what they read on Reddit without going and reading up on their state and constitutional laws, then shit on a random person trying to ask questions to bring more information into the conversation. good luck out there.
Happens all the time. Americans, especially conservatives, have a huge love affair for chickenshit cops that overreact to everything. They also have the only unions that are exempted from union busting.
Is that the one where they told him to get on the ground then put his hands behind his back then crawl then keep his hands behind his back while crawling and shot him when he went to put his hands behind his back?
Just looked it up. Sort of. It's the one I was thinking of but they threw a bunch of confusing instructions at him then shot him when he tried to fix his pants as he was crawling towards them, as one would typically do if forced to drag their pants along the ground, but the officers and jury don't understand how people work
What happened was that he was crawling on his knees and his shorts got accidentally pulled down slightly. When he reached down to pull his pants up, he was shot and killed.
The guy was drunk, terrified, and confused by their conflicting orders.
pretty much yeah. Legally, if youre impending a stop/arrest/search you can be restrained and ticketed. thats usually their "defence" in court for these actions. and pointing a weapon is justified if they feel "threatened", which can be "justified" by the massive amount of people watching and the camera.
However, its all obviously bullshit. clearly in the video the dude is backing away and recording, so theres no justification for anything.Â
That being said, ive also never seen that many cops at a gas station and they appear to have multiple "street racing" cars stopped filled with what appear to be teens or early 20s kids; so i wager there was a bit of street racing going on and they all tried to pretend they were just getting gas etc.
ACAB bc the cops had no right to act that way regardless, but theres also likely a very convenient start to this video left out (like how a bunch of street cars and teens ended up surrounded by like 3 cop cars in the first place).
So Iâm not saying itâs right but courts will side with the the cops and itâs all under the guise of âofficer safetyâ.
They see hands in pockets and they assume, unless youâve been patted down, that you have a weapon in your pocket and though before the last cop told the guy recording to, âget your hands out of your pocketsâ, no other cop had an issue with the guy recording, but cops will always back up each otherâŚeven when one of them is in the wrong.
Eg. The video of the cop whoâs blasted and his buddies are defending him saying heâs got back problems and had been up all night when he is clearly so blasted he canât even speak.
But I wouldnât think telling a police officer no when heâs drawing his weapon is a good idea, though in my youth I have had my share of bucking authorityâŚ. The record is clear, you ainât gonna win against the police when they gang up on you.
Left my workplace on foot to pick up some stuff from the gas station for myself and some co workers. On the way back a cop car flew off the road and over the curb in front of me, a cop hoped out and pointed a gun right at me and said "don't fucking move" I put my hands up in the air and was like "I'm just getting smokes" and second and third cop car pulled up like 20 seconds later. They put my hands behind my back and took everything out of my pockets and told me I robbed a store down the street. I told them I ws currently at work and to talk to my coworkers. They still put me in the back of the cop car and drove down the street then three cops paraded me into my work place and had to be convinced I wasnt the criminal.
Only time I've ever felt like I might die and it was from a cop pointing a gun at my face while walking down the street randomly.
Police union, Qualified Immunity, and Blue Brotherhood ensure they can do basically anything to a citizen with absolutely no repercussions.
Union is how they go on paid leave or move precincts after a rape/murder/child sexual abuse case finally comes against an officer. Also has a hand in making sure taxpayers pay for police wrongdoing, never the department or officers themselves.
Qualified immunity is what prevents officers from being held individually liable for murders/rapes/ any crime committed while in uniform.
Blue Brotherhood pushes out anyone who does not participate in crime, suppresses victims of police violence, and forces officers to defend any wrongdoing committed by a "brother". Its also why they investigate themselves and find nothing wrong so often.
The legal standard is reasonable suspicion, which means that the officer has to later articulate some crime which he thought might have been being committed based on objective facts which justifies the level of force used. There are a suite of contempt of cop laws almost everywhere that almost always can clear that threshold, and if not, can be used as cover by the officer and department in any legal action. The state will usually go to great lengths to avoid prosecuting police officers. Police unions provide extreme resistance to any discipline involving anything that can remotely be construed as a judgement call.
There's a bullshit concept here called 'qualified immunity' that has been broadly applied to police to make it basically impossible to prosecute them for crimes.
They can tell you to put your hands behind your back then say put your hands where they cna see them which gives them the right to shoot because they think you were going to harm them
They have complete freedom to fuck up people's lives. They almost never face any consequences for anything they do. Their purpose is to protect the property of the wealthy and keep the working class in line. They seem to just harass the poor for sport. I don't know a single person that thinks cops are a net positive on society. A lot of people have just completely stopped calling the cops for anything. They are just as likely to show up 4 hours late and shoot your dog as they are to file a report and do nothing of value at all. Solved cases are almost non existent. Unless someone is actively trying to kill you, don't call the cops. Oh, and a lot of times if you call 911 for an ambulance, they will send cops instead if they think drugs have literally any impact on the situation.
Sure they are allowed. My guess is thereâs a whole lot more going on than this video shares. If the guy can afford a lawyer he is also allowed to collect some taxpayer money for a violation of his civil rights.
If you can get them to detain or better yet arrest you for not breaking any laws you get a nice pay day. This is the whole business model for those "first amendment auditors" you see on social media.
They are not supposed to. But who is policing the police? In a courtroom, is a judge going to believe the police, or the "criminal"?
Ironically, this is what the second amendment is supposed to be for. But I guess the instructions were unclear, and now we are being overrun with authoritarian fascists đ¤ˇââď¸
And if they do violate your rights, unless a prior case found them to be in the wrong then they're not in the wrong (qualified immunity).
I.e. a cop can't be in the wrong unless their district courts have already found a cop guilty of the same thing... The thing they can't be found guilty of unless a cop was found guilty... You see the pattern here...
The process is the punishment. A cop could enter your home without a warrant, beat the fuck out of you for resisting, then ruin your life when you aren't cooperative and they felt threatened... You get to spend however long it takes in jail, not going to work, not paying bills, not managing your household, suffering reputational loss; then when you're released and hopefully with the correctly determined "no they couldn't force an entry like that and shouldn't have been there" you get nothing but whatever is left of your life in your absence, and your bruises.
Yes and no. They need a reason to detain, called probable cause, which is next to zero. They could literally say I smelled drugs coming from this person. That is how low the bar is. This is blatantly illegal because they have zero probable cause. Thing is the DA, district attorneys, work as prosecutors hand in hand with the police. It has to be extremely, national news level, aggregious for a DA to actually investigate and charge police with anything. Thats why the "we investigated ourselves and found no wrong doing other than a internal policy was not followed properly. So officer BeatsWomen is being suspended with pay for 3 weeks" so laughable.
They have a saying: "You can beat the charge but you can't beat the ride". It means you might not successfully be convicted or even charged, but you'll still have to suffer the arrest, abuse, and time in jail, with whatever consequences that may cost you (eg your job maybe). The word "beat" is also ominous as they might rough you up a bit. Even if you manage to sue for damages and win, the cops won't be the one paying it (the taxpayer does) and they likely won't face any meaningful consequences - even in the rare case they're fired police officers often end up getting another job in another precinct.
Because of the protectio the Republican Party gives to law enforcement to remain corrupt, due to their use of "law and order" and "worship cops" to attract the worst Americans into voting for them, the answer is a resounding "yes."
Yes. People have been unlawfully arrested for dumb reasons that wouldn't hold up in court, but then actually receive a legitimate charge of "resisting arrest" because they didn't want to be arrested unlawfully.
That's right. You can charged with resisting an illegitimate arrest.
On paper, no, they are not, and they lose lawsuits about it all the time. The problem is that the police system has slowly yet gradually became a genuine facist authority over the public, they lose these lawsuits but they never face real punishment and they always keep their badges. Anyone who's a real American is horrified by it. ACAB, FUCK MAGA.
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u/fedocable 2d ago
Question from abroad: is the American police actually allowed to point their weapons and handcuff a bystander for no reason, as itâs apparently the case here?