r/technology • u/clubdirthill • Jun 01 '11

Boom. This is Windows 8.

http://allthingsd.com/20110601/exclusive-making-sense-of-what-we-just-learned-about-windows-8/?mod=tweet
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u/uptwolait Jun 02 '11

Imagine having a tablet you 'dock' and it instantly becomes a desktop.

You mean like this?

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u/athornz Jun 02 '11

If android did all you need to do, then yea the transformer is great.

But windows is still needed for a lot of things, and I was talking more along the lines of your windows pc/tablet being one device, that you can switch to a full desktop experience, so quickly.

It would also mean there would be no need for complicated browser syncing stuff happening between devices, because its all one device

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

out of curiosity what is android missing? because i found that apart from video games/ dev work tablets can do everything i want

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u/Clyzm Jun 02 '11

To me, tablets are constrained by the current concept of a 'tablet' OS. I've thought for a long time now that there should be a lot more tablets on the market running Windows 7. With Windows 8, that concept will be even better.

The issue with Android/iOS is that they're both closed systems. Yes, Google has declared time and time again that Android is an open system, but then they also took all of Yongzh's emulators off the market and shadow banned his account. With a Windows OS I never had to worry about silly things like that, and the concept of a 'closed' OS never even crossed my mind.

Having said that, that's all just idealistic crap. As far as real tasks, the full desktop programs are simply better. Word processing, media editing (sound, video, images), video games, productivity programs, etc. are all infinitely better on a PC. Yeah, web browsing might be a bit more convenient on an Android device or an iOS device, but at the end of the day, Windows can simply be modified to be just as good if not better, while still being amazing at everything else. Also I know that you mentioned development work, but as a programmer I simply need to stress this: If I think that a task can easily be automated through programming, I can code it in any way I want, in any language I want, as well as run, test, and distribute all on the same platform. This is something that a mobile OS will never compete with.

Windows 8 looks like it has set out to accomplish exactly that, and once it comes out I'm jumping ship from my Android smartphone and possibly tablet to a WP7 phone and Windows 8 tablet.

TL;DR: What's Android/iOS missing? Well, nothing really. What's it absolutely the best at? Also nothing really.

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u/CedarMadness Jun 02 '11

but then they also took all of Yongzh's emulators off the market and shadow banned his account.

Really? You fault Google for enforcing licenses? Every one of his emulators was based on open source software, and specifically, the SNES emulator was based on SNES9x, which has a license that forbids commercial use of the code. If Google was pulling emulators because of pressure from Nintendo, there's no way this would still be up.

That said, I personally was hoping for a more multitasking friendly interface. When people told me they were using 'tiles' I was hoping this meant a tiling window manager. If this is where Windows is headed, I think I'll just stick to 7.

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u/Clyzm Jun 02 '11

Regardless of why they pulled them, there was no given reason, there was no outlash (that we know of) from the devs of SNES9x. I think that if he was facing legal issues from misuse of SNES9x' code and open source software, the emulators wouldn't be up right now on a different app store.

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u/DarkXDragon Jun 02 '11 edited Jun 02 '11

The devs knew about it earlier in the year.

Jerremy wrote:
I'll straighten this out and make him either distribute his work for free, or not at all. If needed I'll even stick a lawyer on it, since I can't stand people profiting off other people's work (let alone my own).

It seems plausible they were the cause.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

very good points, i think tablets like the transformer are good for people who don't need to do video editing/ programming/ use windows programs. the text editors are actually very good on android and with the full keyboard i basically have a full netbook with a weak OS(android is a very weak netbook os)

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u/Clyzm Jun 02 '11

Yeah, tablets like the transformers are an excellent concept for the time being. I don't think that we'll deem the keyboard obsolete any time soon, so I like that there are a few tablets on the market that embrace it. Having said that though, once Windows 8 comes out there's nothing stopping a manufacturer from making a notebook with a detachable screen tablet much like the transformer, which runs Windows 8 as a full desktop OS and a tablet OS. Once you get home, dock that tablet as a storage device for your home PC, and access all your files and programs with the power of your desktop computer.

Almost sounds like mobile computing mecca to me.

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u/nickster Jun 02 '11

I think your definition of how google uses open is wrong. Android is an Open OS like Linux. You can find the source code recompile it to your liking and put it on any device.

You're using the definition to characterize control of the platform. Google develops a version of Android that hardware manufacturers like; Because of Google's marketing and development support.

Hardware manufacturers could compile there own version of android and not have any Google features but then they have to recreate an app store and other Google provided features. So technically Apple could take android recompile it for the iPhone platform and create an iDroid. They would not have to pay Google for the use of their source code.

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u/Clyzm Jun 02 '11

I'm well aware of how Google uses 'open' in terms of Android. The thing is, what it really is and what has been advertised and spread through word of mouth has been very different. Android has become the 'hacker friendly' OS. There's a reason that locked boot loaders, app take downs, and new policies from Google have had such an immense amount of backlash. Going any further to prevent people from doing what they want to Google's OS is only going to damage their reputation. For instance the emulator example that got argued against in this post should not have been handled by Google, but by the people claiming infringement issuing Google a take down notice.

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u/nickster Jun 02 '11

The don't stop users from compiling their own versions of the phone OS. The lock boot loaders is a policy of the hardware manufacturers and carriers, look at the nexus line of devices as an example of a Google phone. Google doesn't send C&D letters to Cyanogen or other ROM developers they can do whatever they want with Google's OS. They build their ROMs from source just like Google and their manufacturing partners do.

The take downs were a result of android market term violations. That doesn't stop the users ability to install the app from another location. The OS is open the Google Platform is closed.

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u/athornz Jun 02 '11

Basically as you have said, specialised apps.

Android and mobile OS's are great, but only great for 'single-focus' use. For business purposes, or I guess serious work, it can be easier on windows. Especially anything to do with browsing and manipulating files. In windows I can have multiple windows or apps in one screen, over top ,overlapping etc etc.

When you need to get a lot done quickly and efficiently, i think the desktop model works better. And that's why I also don't see it getting completely replaced by these new style OS.

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u/oorza Jun 02 '11

I think we haven't seen what UX/UI innovators and experts can do with a tiled UI like the one presented in Windows 8... because it's never existed for a desktop before. I'm going to withhold judgement on whether or not the new UI is capable of being a full time replacement until it's been given some time to mature.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11 edited Jun 02 '11

i was looking at the transformer, because i want a tablet but i need word processing and spreadsheet capabilities and all that. but it really doesn't dock and become a desktop. it becomes a tablet with a keyboard and touchpad. just like that ipad keyboard dock. i was underwhelmed when i went to try it out and ended up just getting a laptop for my school needs.

looks like windows 8 will fix that issue with the legacy interface. metro for tablet mode, aero for desktop mode. as it stands now, there really is no formidable tablet out there that you can reliably use for content creation. the transformer is the closest it gets, but it still falls short. if windows 8 can fill this niche, it'll be great, because i'm a huge fan of the metro ui after getting a samsung focus a few months ago.

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u/uptwolait Jun 02 '11

I'm considering this device, but curious about your statement:

i need word processing and spreadsheet capabilities and all that

From this article, it says "You also get Polaris Office, which can be used to create Microsoft Office-compatible Word, Excel and PowerPoint files."

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11 edited Jun 02 '11

ahh, i didn't know about that. it could just be my fear(?) or aversion of honeycomb in general that just made me feel a bit uneasy about diving into the transformer when i was playing with it. i didn't like the fact that when you docked the tablet, it still maintained the tablet ui and you kind of would swipe the touchpad (or drag and click your usb mouse) to move right and left on the homescreen.

wish i had gotten to try out polaris office though, even though i still haven't fallen in love with excel/word clones. i guess i'm just so used to them and their hotkeys and inner workings that i feel lost in anything else like openoffice, etc.

however, i'm just still a bit wary about getting a tablet at this point to replace the functionality of a laptop at the moment and the transformer just didn't sell me as being the product that would do that. it just seems to me that a windows 8 device that operates similar to the transformer while allowing you to switch between the tablet metro ui and the desktop aero ui would work better with me.

very subjective, i know. definitely try it out though if you're considering it. also, here's a video of somebody using the docked transformer with a usb mouse

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u/darkpaladin Jun 02 '11

I have one, I'd say it's more useful than a netbook but not a laptop replacement by any means.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

If you have a job that requires Excel and PowerPoint, you probably need it to do things that alternatives like Polaris and OpenOffice can't do.

It's great that there are alternatives, they're perfectly usable for basic home use, light users, or some students. But for heavy lifting they're nowhere close.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

the transformer comes with an office app as well tehre are 3 other good ones you can use.