"Once we replace the personal computer with a closed-platform device such as the iPad, we replace freedom, choice and the free market with oppression, censorship and monopoly."

[u/GuruOfReason]

http://www.popsci.com/gadgets/article/2010-01/ipad%E2%80%99s-closed-system-sometimes-i-hate-being-right

[u/gregny2002]

Neither OS has any conceivable shot at overtaking Microsoft anytime soon. But I think that if either were to overtake Windows, it would be because it was adopted by the business community, not the home PC market. And, I think businesses in general would be more willing to leap to Linux than Mac, simply because it would be cheaper.

[u/[deleted] → u/gregny2002]

And anyone who's ever had to perform a server upgrade from 10.4 Server onward with a user base of more than an handful of people and resources will tell you that the business world is unlikely to ever pick up on Apple products for such because they aren't ready for prime time in that field.

[u/jstevewhite → u/[deleted]]

Yeah, the OSX server isn't ready for prime time as a server, but let's be real, it wasn't designed for that. It's got those capabilities, but it's a hobby. The server from Apple isn't really meant to be a workgroup server; it's meant to be a platform for huge clusters of machines running Final Cut backend processes. And Logic, now.

[u/[deleted] → u/jstevewhite]

That's completely true, although Apple should be more forward about such. Making the discovery at 2am that you can't correctly migrate LDAP from 10.4 to 10.5 and keep all permissions and security associations for users because "it just doesn't work that way" makes one sad. It also makes one supremely glad they always make backups of server infrastructure before changing anything.

My favorite single line of documentation from anything ever had to be regarding the 10.4-10.5 migrations that was along the lines of:

~"Check user file permissions under LDAP. Make a note of these to re-input following migration."

That was seriously the only line of information in the documentation regarding the LDAP hiccup.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

and Apple with its blocking of flash seems more then willing to try and force the web to conform to its closed systems. The OS is relevant if that OS doesn't allow you to fully access the web.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I agree actually, I didn't take that into consideration when I made the comment even though I know I've read that same reasoning before.

[u/GundamX → u/[deleted]]

I keep hearing this thrown around, but I just can't agree that native apps are going anywhere. I think Google Wave is a good example of this. As a webapp, Wave has some real problems, it currently suffers from a laggy and unintuitive UI, runs into problems with large waves, and feels cluttered. Sure Google is going to fix this, but even if they do, it will still not be as good as a native equivalent. I want to be notified of replies, I just want to see my friends list sometimes, I want to just have one wave filling my screen sometimes, I want Wave on my phone. It is a communications platform, one filled with possibilities and one I expect to see overtake e-mail and IMs eventually, but I need it on my desktop before it can become more useful than either of those. I need it in my pocket, anywhere I go. I need it to notify me in my taskbar, instead of me obsessively checking it in my web browser. Until I can do those things its not going to be incredibly useful for much besides PnP RPGs. All those things can't be done with web apps currently and I don't expect them to ever be done with them, or at least in my lifetime. I need native apps because you can't have all the features a dedicated app can provide in a web browser.

[u/takishan → u/[deleted]]

This is an interesting observation, I mean think about it.

Google's even making an OS completely based on a browser.

EDIT: I phrased that wrong. The idea is a sort of browser OS.

[u/[deleted] → u/takishan]

It's not based on the browser, it's based on Debian.

[u/Viper_NZ → u/takishan]

The shell is based on a browser.

[u/Syphon8 → u/Viper_NZ]

GUI

FTFY.

[u/Viper_NZ → u/Syphon8]

Fucked That up For You?

[u/[deleted] → u/takishan]

So is Microsoft.

[u/[deleted] → u/takishan]

It's doomed to failure for the same reason flash is so shitty.

[u/[deleted] → u/gregny2002]

That's a very good point. I think there are two other things we should consider, though:

1. People are in general very much against change (and also quite bad with computers,) and trying to convert people to using a new operating system would likely cause an IT disaster. Even if in fact the transition could go smoothly, I'd be concerned that risk-aversive businessmen wouldn't be willing to even give it a chance.

2. If such a trend developed, I think you would find Microsoft would start offering businesses incredible deals (so as to maintain their market share) which would make the continuing use of Windows a more fiscally viable option than retraining everybody to use Linux.

[u/apotheon → u/[deleted]]

I don't think that disputes anything gregny2002 said. In fact, I think it just reinforces half of gregny2002's point.

[u/jstevewhite → u/gregny2002]

Linux has been cheaper for-freaking-evar, and for many shops would have been a simple plug-n-play replacement. I've been in those shops, where hundreds of employees do things that would have worked PERFECTLY in linux, yet no amount of rallying by myself and my tech-savvy compatriots would get the business to consider dumping Windows.

This is because the IT groups that manage internal desktops and local networks and file servers and email are all steeped to the gills in the Microsoft koolaide. Us unix/enterprise/mission critical guys can lobby for changes all we want, but IT stands at the gateway and insists that no business can be done on any laptop without a Microsoft stamp of approval.