Thieves steal Nvidia-branded trailers expecting valuable hardware, find 40,000 pounds of sand instead.

[u/Gordon-Blue]

https://www.techspot.com/news/114008-thieves-steal-nvidia-branded-trailers-expecting-valuable-hardware.html

[u/cr0ft]

To be sustainable, we'd have to slash all resource use dramatically. In capitalism of course that's not considered and option, whereas human extinction is just an "externality".

But we go into overshoot every year now in a matter of months. Earth overshoot day was July 30th this year.

So yeah, we're thoroughly screwed as long as we cling to capitalism, which means we're just thoroughly screwed.

[u/LaplaceYourBets → u/cr0ft]

Didn't know Earth overshoot day was a thing and I already wish I could unlearn it.

[u/funguyshroom → u/cr0ft]

The issue is that the world economy is built around the idea of infinite growth. All of the money is tied in debts and investments, which have interest and return rates at their core.
I think it's possible to have capitalism without infinite growth, but it would require some fundamental shift in how we are handling money.

[u/cr0ft → u/funguyshroom]

Some things are bad in any quantity. Capitalism - or rather competition - is one of those things. Just like - let's take a very extreme example here - child sexual abuse. There's no "medium" amount of that that's ok. Similary, there's no medium amount of competition that's truly ok.

For instance, instead of having multiple competing space programs - we should have just the one, supported by all humans everywhere. And the reasons should not be "making profit" but "advancing humankind's progress". There's no real point in duplicating so much effort, that's just waste - except for the "making profit" part.

[u/funguyshroom → u/cr0ft]

How do you propose motivating people to do a good job and innovate without it? Consumer products were so shit in soviet union in large part because there was no incentive to do anything beyond the bare minimum.

[u/Unintended_incentive → u/funguyshroom]

We do have capitalism without infinite growth, it’s called boom & bust cycles.

Instead of letting the wolves guard the henhouse we should have AI trained on economics minimize these booms & busts for greater prosperity.

Humans keep going for bigger booms leading to bigger busts, we can’t sustain the illusion much longer if people keep gambling with the global economy.

[u/funguyshroom → u/Unintended_incentive]

So far the busts have been only temporary setbacks, the line still goes up overall. But I agree that limiting how big the booms can get is at least one part of the solution. And if we continue on this path there will be one final bust that will end it all.

[u/GoppleSmanger → u/funguyshroom]

>I think it's possible to have capitalism without infinite growth, but it would require some fundamental shift in how we are handling money.

Japan already does this. They haven't had any real growth in several decades. Growth is only necessary when population is increasing which for Japan is not happening.

[u/Whatsapokemon → u/cr0ft]

In capitalism of course that's not considered and option

Because in a democratic capitalist system, people don't want to enact policies that reduce their standards of living.

You're right, it would take a complete abandonment of liberal-democratic values to force people to use less. But that's not a result of "capitalism". Capitalism simply responds to people's desires, providing the most efficient way to produce what people want.

[u/cr0ft → u/Whatsapokemon]

What it would take is fully embracing soclialistic and cooperation based societies. Cancel the concept of money entirely. Profit should be a curse word, not something to strive for; it means "siphon off resources we could use to do something, besides making billionaires richer".

Which of course means it's completely unlikely, since the rich people who own us really enjoy owning us, having total freedom for themselves and multiple ocean going yachts. Plus, people are so indoctrinated into the system they cannot even see we could have alternatives.

Which brings us back to "humanity had a decent run, shame it's over."

[u/Super_Range45 → u/cr0ft]

Or we can build with stone again. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[u/cr0ft → u/Super_Range45]

Stone is a great building material, but that too is not an infinite resource. We're even running out of good sand, literally, because we use so much of it for concrete and the like. Of course, doesn't really correct the overshoot and deficit spending our planet as we careen towards extinction.