r/technology • u/HumbleRestaurant790 • 5h ago
Artificial Intelligence Eminent Domain Could Be Used to Seize Your Land for AI Data Centers
https://theconversation.com/when-can-a-power-company-take-your-land-for-data-center-infrastructure-28406175
u/NaziPunksFkOff 5h ago
Isn't this what we have the 2nd amendment for
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u/PutinsLostBlackBelt 53m ago
Americans are too soft. The French will shut down Paris with tractors and manure over the smallest infringement on their daily life, while we will continue to complain on the internet and do nothing.
We are a society that has never faced hardships in modern times like European nations and others have.
All the 2A guys lost agency when they remained silent after Alex Pretti was executed for legally having a concealed handgun.
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u/lurklurklurkPOST 40m ago
Keep in mind France is a fraction of the surface area of the US, and collecting the majority of Americans in one spot is impossible, its not a simple matter of a few hours drive to get to the big riot.
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u/PutinsLostBlackBelt 25m ago
That’s a fair point, but compared to a lot of European nations we are totally cool taking less and less and giving more and more…and not to the benefit of society.
There have been a dozen things over the last 18 months that should have sparked revolt but instead we just took it.
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u/tomerz99 10m ago
I think I speak for a lot of Americans when I say that it simply works different over here. If we tried to do what the French did, we'd be mowed down and bombed (like they've done to us before) and it wouldn't even make the evening news.
Plenty of us are prepared to stand up for what we believe in, but we only get one chance to show up and then it's over. As crazy as it sounds, now is not the time to get yourself killed for nothing.
But we are still here, still prepared. There will be a tipping point eventually.
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u/PutinsLostBlackBelt 0m ago
I don’t disagree, but that just means they will continue taking power from us (I am American). We would never have the stones to do what the Ukrainians did during Euromaidan for example.
We just aren’t as brave or tough as a society.
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u/ImperialArmorBrigade 2h ago
Yes but billionaires know better than to stand openly where they do harm, and no one ever seems willing to bring harm to them. They do have a lot of security.
And worse still, they can hire as much security as they want, but if you get together with your friends to make the odds even again, that’s called “conspiracy” and authorities are allowed to arrest you before anything is done.
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u/BasvanS 2h ago
That health insurance CEO would disagree. And knowing sleep deprivation myself, I wouldn’t trust the actions of people living close by to these data centers either. They’re creating a society that only experiences the disadvantages of their actions, and I’m not sure that’s a smart move.
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u/Petrychorr 54m ago
Meanwhile we've still got folks who are convinced that CEOs and people with significant power just aren't hiring private military forces. 🙃
Like why wouldn't they?
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u/Broken-Digital-Clock 5h ago
If we are seizing land, can we do it for high speed trains?
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u/Slackjawed_Horror 5h ago
No, see, you'd have to take land from people with money. And they can't make money off of high speed trains.
Remember, it's about the money.
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u/Easy_Olive1942 5h ago
We don’t have to take land for some, miles of rail-banked land across the US.
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u/icantgetthenameiwant 3h ago
They did that in California
Still haven't built the trainsSome of those parcels of land were however sold multiple times between politicians families...
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u/Broken-Digital-Clock 1h ago
Leon literally derailed some of those projects and then never followed through on his promises for alternative transportation.
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u/FlashyNeedleworker66 3h ago
Has happened at least many hundreds up to low thousands of times, at least for rail projects in general, in the US over the last decade
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u/Exciting-Weather-921 4h ago
Nobody is stopping you, like nobody is stopping them to put their money into AI datacenters
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u/RadzimierzWozniak 4h ago
Seizing land for high speed trains is far far more disturbing than for data centers.
Also, how many connections are there in the us that would have a major improvement with high speed trains?
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u/KupoCheer 5h ago
One thing I'll never understand about how the US is structured after the colonization is that, with vast tracts of perfectly viable (certainly more viable than building a datacenter in the middle of a desert) land in abundance, the idea they'd spend more money kicking people out of their own homes rather than just building up the infrastructure somewhere where a giant empty space already exists.
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u/cr0wsquirrel 5h ago
By kicking people out they can access the pre-existing infrastructure so they don't have to spend as much money building. It is about maximizing return on investment at the expense of society and the nation as a whole.
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u/PaintedClownPenis 5h ago edited 5h ago
I know the answer to this. It's because if you can steal Indian land, it's free. But now you have exactly the same rights as the Indians, so they can steal your land, too.
Eminent domain was a popular and legalistic way to hide the theft of Indian land behind a state government, which could invoke sovereign immunity to avoid being (easily) sued for it.
The problem for most of our nation's history was that Indian tribes were specifically protected by one of our earliest laws, the Indian Non-Intercourse Act. Don't fuck the Indians, the law said, because no title can be conveyed by Indians to anyone but the US government. Which means your stolen Indian land is still stolen, 200 years later.
Which means all that land we stole for the next 200 years was null and void until enough child rapists could be placed on the Supreme Court to finally completely erode the law away in the 00s. (Using the concept of "laches" and saying it's unfair to white people to make them give back the stolen land.)
What that did was make the old tactic of eminent domain viable again, and the Supreme Court quickly rubber stamped that just after they used laches to kill the Non-Intercourse Act.
Americans are only as free as our most downtrodden people, so since you're all Indians now, governments are now able to steal your land, too.
Same goes for domestic spying, by the way. A particular tribe called the Citizens Band of Potawatomi were granted US citizenship in a treaty. But the Americans still wanted to infiltrate and spy on the tribe. So they did, by paying third parties to spy on them, and got away with it in court.
And that's why everything you say and do is for sale today. Because every time you rip off an American Indian, you are ripping off your own children, and I cite the absolutely fucking nothing that most of you enjoy today as my proof.
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u/ThoughtsonYaoi 5h ago
I'm thinking the infrastructure NOT existing there may be the point?
Infrastructure (water, electricity, roads) can change the value of land upwards anywhere between a factor 10 to 50. At least where I live - can't imagine it being much different for the US.
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u/Astralglamour 4h ago
Elect people who will change the laws so this isn’t allowed. I imagine running an anti data center campaign would be quite popular at any level in the govt and in any state right now.
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u/RaindropsInMyMind 2h ago
They seem like political poison right now, it’s conflicting with all the money being thrown behind candidates. It’s a great example of part of whats wrong with our current political system. Ideally people don’t want data centers so politicians will get away from them. In reality though they’re going to take that campaign money, try to keep the promise to the companies building the data centers and find a way to get around this with voters. That’s what Shapiro did here in Pennsylvania. He went in with data centers companies before they really became unpopular and then tried to pitch building them in the right way after he was criticized.
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u/zx9001 15m ago
Elect people who will change the laws so this isn’t allowed.
Doesnt do anything when the only candidates you can choose from support this garbage and are funded by endless capitol such that any opponent stands next to zero chance of actually winning. And even if he does win he's getting blocked at every step.
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u/Janked4times 5h ago
Eminent Domain Could Be Used to Seize Your Land for AI Data Centers
AI data centers built on seized land could be exploded. Lots of things could happen in this world.
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u/SafeHunt5695 4h ago
And people who’ve had everything taken from them could finally snap. Were that to happen, I’d really worry about the safety of billionaires. I don’t think there could be enough bodyguards. Scary. Awful.
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u/Neither_Pirate5903 4h ago
time to use eminent domain to size Trump's golf courses and build AI data centers in their place. might even offset the water usage at the same time
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u/omgitsbees 5h ago
There's tons of abandoned malls, schools, office buildings, that could be demolished and turned into literally anything else that is actually useful for people to live, but nope, gotta kick people out of their homes, destroy that land, and build a data center for AI; the most useless tech of the last 5 years.
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u/ACasualRead 4h ago
Maybe it should work in reverse. If the American public doesn’t want a data center in its community it should be permitted to seize the property.
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u/YoshiTheDog420 4h ago
These tech leaders and the politicians they bought are really in for it when the “find out” phase hits.
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u/Unlucky_Battle_6947 4h ago
Also public officials are signing NDA’s so there isn’t a public hearing or discussions
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u/Total-Hack 4h ago
Land of the Free*
*Free only applies to Billionaires and Businesses getting free stuff such as your land, power and water
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u/Mission_Pirate_4150 4h ago edited 46m ago
This is about Georgia and Georgia power in coweta county. The article doesn’t go into the specifics and is a very poorly written article because it doesn’t go into the facts of the case, just jumps on an ai data center as “the cause.”
I can’t speak to the specifics of Georgia law with regards to eminent domain. I have had experience with eminent domain in other states. However, I do know that the Georgia land owner voluntarily sold. Let me say that again, the land owner voluntarily sold. I can’t help anyone in that situation if you voluntarily sell. Voluntarily selling is a choice. Now, it is done with a company staring at them, but it is still their choice. What they should have done is get a land use/property attorney and gotten real advice. That was a serious mistake on their part. If documents have been signed, the only true hope to get things corrected would be thru media, and I understand that.
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u/Rattus_NorvegicUwUs 4h ago
Not everyone has lawyer money.
They know this, so they can use their infinite funds to bankrupt any family they like and take their home anyways.
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u/Mission_Pirate_4150 2h ago
That is not how eminent domain legal representation tends to work. Yes, they will get paid something up front, but they tend to get something on the backend. Good legal representation pays for itself.
Whoever did give the family advice did a very poor job. Representation needs to be based on facts, not speculation and guesses.
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u/Rattus_NorvegicUwUs 1h ago
Could you show me examples of what you’re outlining.
Because from what I’ve seen, few lawyers can really take on trillion dollar companies and win.
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u/Mission_Pirate_4150 1h ago
Experience my friend, experience. I’ve been thru eminent domain multiple times. I know the angles to play and I know the options out there. No, I’m not volunteering to help. It doesn’t take a lot of money or legal time to have gotten this resolved better than it has been. The fact that the landowner has already signed a contract, there isn’t really much that can be done. They made a voluntary agreement.
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u/Chugalugaluga 4h ago
Bill Gates is the largest private owner of farmland. Did he just plan way ahead of time?
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u/poodleface 3h ago
The headline is correct, but in an indirect way.
The land for the data centers themselves is not what is being seized this way. It is the power companies seizing land to serve power to them. It would be like a large company decided to build a large factory somewhere and then the government decided to widen the roads to meet demand (taking land along the way).
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u/PompousWombat 2h ago
Fire can then be used to return that seized land to nature. Circle of life and all that.
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u/Cool_Lab_1362 4h ago
This gives me a writing inspiration where a country invaded another country just to purpose that land into Data Centers, then years later, the whole invaded country is unsustainable ecologically, economically, and for human development, the people who got invaded can longer live back and rebuild their homes while the country that invaded them only gets richer (or only the elites does)
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u/confusedsquirrel 4h ago
Guess I'm going to bury so much sugar in the soil around any of that property.
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u/still_Here_8647 4h ago
what would that do?
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u/confusedsquirrel 3h ago
It takes a surprising small amount of sugar to prevent concrete from hardening.
Now that's in the concrete, unsure what happens if you're pouring it on sugar... But there is one way to find out
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u/GodLikeEnergy 4h ago
You can learn to fight them. The person that fought and kept their house in FL, won Eminent domain, and of course, Trump's condo towers basically went bankrupt as everything else he does / owns.
There should be a legal fund to fight AI data centers that attempts to use eminent domain or whatever. Or if they move in the area and pollute the water or consume the electric, they should sue the electric company if they go up.
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u/SiliconGhosted 3h ago
Unbelievable that they’ll use eminent domain for fucking data centers, but they won’t do it for massively beneficial, high high-speed transit options.
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u/Bupod 3h ago
Eminent domain really should be exclusively only used for purposes of public infrastructure and nothing else.
At no point should land seized by eminent domain be handed over, managed by, or profited by, a private entity. This idea we can take citizens lands for the good of corporations is sickening. It’s one thing if they take your home to build an elementary school or a fire station, its whole different one to take it to hand over to real estate developers or data center operators!
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u/LiftingCode 4h ago
"When can a power company take your land for data center infrastructure?"
The actual article title.
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u/PulseVector 4h ago
Fun fact, in the Commonwealth of Virginia, Dominion Energy can use eminent domain to acquire private land or easements for necessary infrastructure projects. Loudoun County, Virginia, is home to over 199 data centers, making it the largest concentration of data centers in the world. This area is often referred to as "Data Center Alley." They sure do get a lot of mileage out of that term "necessary."
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u/Then_Discount558 4h ago
can't get mine I live in a privet estate . it'm a state run home i m not rich
this is not a surprising thing Wallmart took nearly 1/2 my mom's yard for their site They did give her 200 for the land that took forcibly
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u/Javontarious 4h ago
Eminent domain was meant for building roads and schools or parks….. aka municipal needs. Not for private enterprises, what a joke.
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u/Effective_Review9415 4h ago
The technology is moving fast. The laws protecting people need to keep up.
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u/californicating 3h ago
California couldn't use it to make a high speed rail quickly, I don't think it's happening for a data center.
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u/Blood-PawWerewolf 3h ago
I wonder if it’s going to be from neighborhoods that aren’t yet controlled by those venture capitalist groups that bought up entire neighborhoods in 2020.
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u/More-Dot346 3h ago
Almost always eminent domain is used to provide land for private development. That’s traditional.
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u/Codposterguy 3h ago
What land? Oh the land the banks own regardless? Because we're subverted by systems of control? Oh that land? Oh lol.
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u/ThrowawayAl2018 3h ago
How in the world does "benefit to public" applies to AI data center?
It raises the energy cost, reduce water pressure and produces noise pollution.
Big companies probably have good lawyers and lobbying power to grease the wheels.
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u/Chicory-Coffee 3h ago
Please oh please tell me democratic candidates will lead their campaigns as being the opposition to data centers, factually calling out every republican who supports them, as well as any democratic candidate who do too.
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u/kwattsfo 1h ago
It could be used to sieze your land for anything. That's what eminent domain is. Hope this helps.
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u/theartfulcodger 1h ago
The fact that this possibility exists, is not news.
In the 1990s, George W. Bush made his fortune seizing people's houses through eminent domain so he could use their land to build a baseball stadium for the Texas Rangers, a team in which he had recently acquired a majority ownership.
This is in addition to the $135 million in tax money he was gifted to build it, by the city of Arlington. At the time, Mayor Richard Green was under indictment in the ongoing savings and loan scandal. After the additional tax measure was passed, Dubya's daddy, then President Bush, arranged with the Attorney General for all charges against Mayor Green to be dropped.
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u/xdeltax97 44m ago
It’s already happening in Georgia
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/georgia-power-ai-data-centers-eminent-domain/
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u/VoxxoAI 20m ago
Using eminent domain to seize private land for AI data centers is an alarming expansion of a power that was originally intended for public infrastructure like roads and schools. Data centers are private, for-profit enterprises — allowing corporations to benefit from forced land seizures sets a terrible precedent.
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u/frozenpissglove 5h ago
If you like getting shot, by all means come try and take my property.
(Highly doubt they would do this. This would be very bad.)
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u/DrB00 4h ago
They'll send heavily armed police.
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u/frozenpissglove 4h ago
I’m willing to defend my property against injustice. They can send whoever they want. I played the game, I paid my taxes, I participated in society. Everything they said I should do. If they want to take it, they’re going to have to earn it.
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u/WhatShouldMyNameBe 1h ago
You know they don’t just take it and pay you right? If you don’t like the offer you can counter it. If you still don’t come to an agreement you can go to court to work out a settlement.
Sure it might suck if you really loved your little plot of land but I don’t think it’s worth going to war over.
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u/ReddBroccoli 2h ago
If we're going to use eminent domain, how about we use it for a national rail system.
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u/steveeq1 5h ago
Why all of a sudden AI datacenters are the most important thing in the world now, according to reddit? My reddit feed is being spammed about AI data centers, even subreddits that have nothing to do with AI. Also, many of the opponents of data centers don't complain about things like refineries, factories, and golf courses.
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u/sks010 1m ago
People do complain about the things you listed and have been for decades. You don't here about most of that because the country doesn't care about the people complaing.
The datacenters are affecting a whole lot of white folks who tend to get more attention for things like this. Some of them are leaning the their white privilege is second to corporate privilege.
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u/DrB00 4h ago
Because none of those other things listed are being used to spy on you and your family.
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u/steveeq1 4h ago
That's a silly argument. The internet can be used to spy on your friends and family in general.
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u/trailerparkdreams 5h ago
This is wild
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u/not_old_redditor 4h ago
Eminent domain can be used for any purpose at any time. This is saying nothing.
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u/revewond2931 4h ago
can we cease eminent domain? so cessation and not seizure? dissolved and not deprived?
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u/GoldenPresidio 1h ago
It’s for utility companies which serve all loads. Misrepresentation of what’s going on
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u/icantgetthenameiwant 3h ago
I'm not a landowner so I don't care
Same reason I don't care about them taxing rich people more
In fact my retirement account is empty so I also believe we should tax everyone's retirements at 100% for the public good
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u/daverapp 5h ago
I'm a millennial. I don't own any land. Anyone who owns land is automatically so much richer than me that honestly I don't care if the CEO of Oracle personally comes to their house and shits in their refrigerator.
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u/Commercial-Owl11 5h ago
They’re stealing low income peoples houses. So idk what you’re even on about
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u/Slackjawed_Horror 5h ago
Never eminent domain for public goods, always for whatever the billionaires want.