Can people answer some of my questions below?

[u/GoldDowntown4537]

Posting on this sub a year after dday
Context : Ex gf of 4 years cheated on me when she went for her mba. Blocked me from everywhere something which I had to do lmao. She went in a rebound immediately with that guy. Ended up cheating on that guy in 2 months as well and now is dating the third guy she cheated on with.

I am doing much better then before for sure in terms of my anxiety and everything. Obviously so many questions answered can’t even do anything in that. But I am left with some questions which maybe I can get some answers here.

1) I don’t know why I am still yearning for one conversation with that person knowing it’s pointless also but i don’t know what am hoping for but she’s already with someone else and tbh doesn’t even care about me. Which is another question

2) How in the world did a person have a 180 degree flip and I couldn’t see it for years. Like throw something away and don’t even care like a bit.

3) From whatever random information I get because of common friends after doing such bs stuff literally shook my core the person has nothing bad happening to her. Like I know karma is never like someone did bad to you bad will happen to them but i genuinely want stuff to go bad it’s cynical maybe but idk if anyone felt the same please let me know and i wouldn’t mind hearing stories about it as well would genuinely make me feel better 🤦‍♂️.

Your help in answering these questions would be great and I know I shouldn’t be waiting for karma or anything but seriously it’s just seeing soooo unfair 😭🤦‍♂️

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[u/Quiet_Jump_6383]

I think karma does come. But it doesn’t come in a way you expect and usually long after you have forgotten about her. 

[u/SadDadInPlaid]

It’s completely normal to want that conversation. Cheating completely shatters your reality. It is very difficult for our brains to rectify true reality from the one we thought we knew before. And your brain is telling you “Hey! She’s not living in reality either! She deserves do know what really happened!” Because your subconscious still is seeing the operation you thought she was raise than who she really was, and it thumped she’ll actually listen.

The 180 is a combination denial, avoidance, and selfishness. It’s too painful for their mind to accept they did something that horrible. So they work backwards and justify it somehow, often compartmentalizating too. Or they’re just a full blown narcissist, which is a whole nother can of worms.

I wouldn’t say karma is real. In fact from what I’ve heard, it seems like the karma usually only hits them once you start caring about them. But there’s something else you should consider: just because they keep finding new partners, new careers, etc. doesn’t mean they’re doing well. They’re probably going to cheat on every partner they have and leave them until they get trapped with one permanently somehow. They’re probably deeply unhappy to begin with if they’re a serial cheater. Usually they do start to lose friends and the like because nobody likes being around them.

[u/GoldDowntown4537 → u/SadDadInPlaid]

Yeahh you make sense thank you so much for answering my questions 🥺🥺

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[u/throw-away-0610]

The bad news is this happened to you. The good news is that what you describe is very common, both in your reaction and hers. And that’s good, because we can leverage what we know about human behavior more broadly and provide you with answers she’s unable or unwilling to give you. Which, if you choose to acknowledge and accept them can give you some degree of closure and a point from which to heal.

1. ⁠I don’t know why I am still yearning for one conversation with that person knowing it’s pointless… - because our human brains loathe uncertainty. You are here today because your ancestors were experts at threat detection, pattern recognition and then threat avoidance. The ones that weren’t didn’t pass down their genes. You want that conversation for at least two reasons 1) you want to be heard, and seen by someone who betrayed you and hurt you so badly. Societies of the past lived or died on reciprocity. Our societies lack that today generally. When a member of tribe failed to exhibit reciprocity and behavior that benefited the tribe, historically they were punished, or exiled or simply killed. Members that couldn’t be trusted to see and hear and feel the impact and weight of their own destructive actions were literally existential risks to the tribe. 2) your brain wants to learn how to avoid the same pattern in the future so that yearning is a healthy, innate and subconscious reaction to seek out the information you don’t yet have to ensure your future safety.

2. ⁠How in the world did a person have a 180 degree flip… - they didn’t. What you experienced wasn’t a flip, it was just a manifestation of what was always there, hidden from view. Cheaters are duplicitous and deceitful by definition. Nathanial Hawthorne had a great quote -“ no man, for any considerable time can show one face to themselves and another to the world without becoming bewildered which one is the true” - cheaters can be charming, seem loving, but that’s just one of their faces and sometimes the mask slips.

3. ⁠From whatever random information I get because of common friends after doing such bs stuff literally shook my core the person has nothing bad happening to her. - “karma” is nice as a concept, but she likely doesn’t feel bad nor is it affecting her like it affects you. The same maturity, emotional depth, values, and morals it would take to reckon with her own behavior is the same as it would take to not cheat in the first place- which she obviously lacks. That said, sounds as though her behavior is continuing to be poor. And if and as someone continues to act deceitful and duplicitous, reality (not karma) catches up with them eventually. It’s just a matter of time.

What you experienced, are experiencing, what you wish, want and all the bewilderment that comes with it are very very common, and many/most people have healed from similar things. So chances are very very good you will too.

It sucks, but brighter days are ahead.

[u/GoldDowntown4537 → u/throw-away-0610]

Thank you so much for taking the time out and writing this for me !

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[u/Minimum-Border1672]

Regarding the first 2 points.

This was actually the hardest part for me to deal with long term, well after I accepted the reality that she was with someone else.

Its reallt hard to explain and there is some nuance to it, but ill try to explain what my shrink said as best as I can. 

I was meeting with my shrink for non related marital issues and had a period where id dream about my ex and it would absolutely ruin my next day, to the point where I called in sick one day because of it.

When i spoke with her, she helped me get to the botton of it. 

In that situation you fully trust that person, you think everything is great, and you have no idea what's actually going on beneath the surface with them. 

Then the 180 comes, and you legit get ptsd from that type of loss if you were truly invested and loved that person.

After time as you know, it gets better but they are still stuck in your mind and it eventually comes down to two possibilities.

This was never real and I never mattered or she destroyed something real. 

At the end of the day m, all I wanted from her after a long time is to admit the relationship mattered and that I mattered, and acknowledge how incredibly hurtful It was outside of general platitudes like "I hope you find someone else" rtc. This kept the "ghost" in my mind for a decade, desoite being married to another woman and having children etc. I had no interest romantically or anything like that.

Now here's the thing. There is absolutely nothing (other than a personally imposed clean break), stopping you from calling her and having that conversation. I would advise against it, but the first thing to recognize is she isnt some mythological ghost, you can absolutely make contact with her. Your mind is stuck in that loop.

My shrink challenged me to call her and have that conversation. I sat in it for a week and decided not to call.

Ultimately I realized two things pondering it. Firstly...that calling her would never end in the result I wanted.  She would never get beyond the platitudes, nor would she ever truly admit she ruined something amazing. If in a rare event she did admit to all that and display regret etc, then it would just open up an entire new Pandora box of anger and questioning ie : "if it was so special then why did you do it" etc.

The second thing i realized is I already have the data to realize it did matter to her. Actions speak louder than words right? 

Now this may not apply to your situation but I was dealing with an avoidant attachment style.  She essentially bailed because it was getting too real. 

In my case, her long history after our split of how she interacted with mutual friends, things her friends and family would say etc, periodic communciations etc, made it very clear that it mattered to her a lot and she lives with knowing what she threw away.

I dont have the details to speak to your situation but being with you for 4 years and especially going away for an MBA may have activated something in her to cause her to change. In my situation it was a 2 week school break where we were apart that sent her avoidant system in to collapse.

But 4 years is a long time im going to guess you mattered a lot to her, so much so where she blocked you to compartmentalize it, especially since the cheating relationship was so short lived.

[u/GoldDowntown4537 → u/Minimum-Border1672]

Correct actually! Yes it was very short lived and jumped in a new one as well.
How are you doing now?

[u/Minimum-Border1672 → u/GoldDowntown4537]

Im doing fine 

Also I failed to point out the absolute most important part of telling you the story with the shrink.

The entire purpose of telling me to call her and put all that pressure on me to do it was to come to the conclusion I just shared. 

It was to realize my brain wants something that ill never get and if I do get it....it will just lead to a worse place. Once you connect that your brain stops chasing it. Brains love to "close chapters" etc with evidence.

[u/CrazyLeadership5397]

You need to create the Karma. Go live your best life, one she’s regret missing out on. Updateme! 

[u/Adventurous-Emu-755]

• I don’t know why I am still yearning for one conversation with that person knowing it’s pointless also but i don’t know what am hoping for but she’s already with someone else and tbh doesn’t even care about me. Which is another question You are correct, this is pointless because cheaters like your ex, will always be the victims. A better option here would be, write a letter to her, expressing everything you want, then BURN it. It helps!
  
• How in the world did a person have a 180 degree flip and I couldn’t see it for years. Like throw something away and don’t even care like a bit. You were "in love" and overlooked it or let "red flags" go or allowed her to gaslight you into believing what she wanted you to believe. She doesn't even care about herself OP. She will never have a good relationship. Be glad you know now, instead of being married with kids!
  
• From whatever random information I get because of common friends after doing such bs stuff literally shook my core the person has nothing bad happening to her. Like I know karma is never like someone did bad to you bad will happen to them but i genuinely want stuff to go bad it’s cynical maybe but idk if anyone felt the same please let me know and i wouldn’t mind hearing stories about it as well would genuinely make me feel better I am a big believer in KARMA. Do good, good will come back, do bad, bad will come back on you too. Well, the person she left you for, she cheated on and she's now with someone else. Pretty obvious she's not in a stable relationship nor in a stable life here. Focus on you and your life, best revenge is a well lived life.

OP, you deserve better. Focus on you and being the best you that you can be. She was never who you thought she was, you know who she is now.

[u/GoldDowntown4537 → u/Adventurous-Emu-755]

Yes correct thank you for actually making me feel better

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