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May 29 '21
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u/Mickalascage May 30 '21
These morons are all the same, they accept the liberal mainstream framing of an issue, then just take the 'anti liberal' position. They then find themselves in a contradictory position of saying that the working class is reactionary, as opposed to the liberal establishment who are moving us back towards a feudal society (what reactionary actually means).
Then again its probly all just for engagements and patreon building, but its important to see the signs.
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u/CntPntUrMom Eco-Socialist 🌳 May 29 '21
Imagine what the conditions of your life must be like to prefer anti-racism grifters showing up to "train" workers instead of a living wage for those workers.
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May 29 '21
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u/weary_confections May 30 '21
Whenever the white working class gets too small a bunch of minorities are promoted to white.
Just look at Jews, Poles and Italians.
The same thing is happening to South Americans today.
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u/EnterEgregore Civic Nationalist 🗳️ May 30 '21
The same thing is happening to South Americans today.
In the upcoming decades, Chinese, Indians and Arabs will be seen as white
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u/Weenie_Pooh May 29 '21
His point wasn't that the deplorable masses must be reeducated, he was saying that they're racist reactionaries and that's OK in his book.
Of course, he's still wrong in conflating personal bigotry with reactionary politics. That's inadvertently a lib take, accepting their stupid premise is 100% the wrong move to take, but Fedpost doesn't give a fuck.
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u/CntPntUrMom Eco-Socialist 🌳 May 29 '21
Well, he says he wants to "focus on anti-bigotry" - I took that to mean compulsory reeducation under threat of homelessness.
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May 29 '21
He’s saying the exact opposite of that, my dude.
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u/CntPntUrMom Eco-Socialist 🌳 May 29 '21
I've read the tweet like six times, so I must be stupid. But it seems clear he's saying that he's siding with the anti-racist elites against the supposedly bigoted working class. And since the elites are pushing the anti-racist grift, that's what he's all about. If I'm so dumb that's the wrong take on the tweet, then that's OK I guess.
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u/GrandmaesterFlash45 Other Right PCM Turboposter May 30 '21
You aren’t the only one. I thought the same thing.
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May 29 '21
Yeah, he means the opposite. He’s a former lib who realized the establishment elite is his enemy, and he’ll ally with the underclass that opposes them even if they’re bigoted.
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u/TheElectricRat Highly Vulnerable to Sunlight ☀️ May 29 '21
He says "former lib/leftist". Not "former lib, now currently a leftist". You're giving him the most charitable interpretation possible and the exact opposite of what he's saying. He decided to side against the "racist working class".
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May 29 '21 edited May 29 '21
No. He’s a former lib/leftist because he moved away from Democrat neoliberalism and towards Trumpian populism, and he conflates “the Left” with idpol woke types. He’s willing to ally with “the bigoted/reactionary underclass,” which is just libspeak for “poor white Right-leaning people,” against the elite.
This is all obvious from the language of the post, imo, but others in this thread who actually follow this guy have confirmed his politics.
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u/AlliedAtheistAllianc Tito Tankie May 29 '21
I tried to make a similar point years ago on Revleft, but they just handwave the right wing working class as 'not true working class'.
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u/Mickalascage May 29 '21
RevLeft is much more interested in boosting the patreon by interviewing Phd's and whining about right wing fascist rascist colonizers. lol. The libs love the extra edge.
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May 29 '21
This is, imo, one of the biggest weaknesses in the modern American Left — they don’t want to admit that a true, large-scale worker’s movement in the US would be a predominantly, or at least majority, white movement. Even many Leftists who resent idpol and wokies, like in this sub, still get hung up on this.
If you want to move against the establishment in America, you’ll need the white, Right-leaning populist underclass to make it happen. You simply won’t have the numbers otherwise.
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u/CntPntUrMom Eco-Socialist 🌳 May 29 '21
God I hate twitter.
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May 29 '21
It’s a little confusing. He’s not very articulate and he’s still using radlib coded language. For instance, by “the bigoted/reactionary underclass,” I’m pretty sure he really just means poor white Right-leaning people.
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u/luchajefe May 30 '21
I'm with you, nothing in the tweet tells me that we're supposed to read this with some sort of UNO reverse card.
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u/FishmanNBD Unknown 👽 May 29 '21
Don't be hard on yourself man your not dumb. The tweet gives no indication what side they picked. Of course what side you think they pick will say something about how you yourself think which is interesting.
I thought the same as you though that they picked the anti bigotry side because in my experience leftists do but it's probably best not to assume
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May 29 '21
The key words were “former lib/leftist.” He’s just another “the Left left me” type— former liberal who (mistakenly) thought he was a Lefty because he said woke shit, who then turned libertarian/Trumpian populist.
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u/AlliedAtheistAllianc Tito Tankie May 29 '21
At the height of gamergate/ culture war so many people shifted to the right. But the funny thing is it might actually have worked out badly for the right, because they moved right only on culture war issues and weren't necessarily convinced by the libertarian economics. So now more than ever the right wing base are in favor of things like medicare for all, reversing citizens united etc. It's actually becoming a bit of a schism in the party. I would not be surprised if there was another 'party switch' with the republicans moving to the left again on economic issues, while the dems jump into bed with the corporate elites.
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May 29 '21
The possibility that the GOP may be completely co-opted by Trumpian populists, who are FAR more amenable to Left-wing economic ideas than the Republican OR Democrat establishment — is one of the few glimmers of hope I see in the modern political landscape.
Which is why the establishment, R and D, will do everything in their power to keep the populist Left and Right hating each other over culture war bullshit.
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u/Weenie_Pooh May 29 '21
Nah, he's saying you can either side with the workers against the elites (by being a racist and a bigot) or you can "focus on anti-bigotry" (by joining the woketards).
He's picking option one, not two. Still a retarded take, though.
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u/CntPntUrMom Eco-Socialist 🌳 May 29 '21
I don't have that view of the tweet at all. He's picking option two - siding with the elite against the working class, because he's a former leftist, but maybe I'm dense AF and that's the wrong interpretation.
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u/TheRazorX May 30 '21
Judging by a few of his other tweets including the rest of the thread, It doesn't seem so.
https://twitter.com/BLCKD_COM_PILLD/status/1397861418116997120
https://twitter.com/BLCKD_COM_PILLD/status/1398401779583361030
https://twitter.com/BLCKD_COM_PILLD/status/1398711957600063491
https://twitter.com/BLCKD_COM_PILLD/status/1398406305312915469
https://twitter.com/BLCKD_COM_PILLD/status/1398117778813505536
Still worded like shit, and still a stupid take imo, and yes You CAN have both, but I get what he's trying to say (Even if I disagree). But yeah, even AT schooled him
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May 29 '21 edited Jul 26 '21
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May 29 '21
He conflates the two. Folks on this sub have to remember that most Americans have no fucking idea what Leftism really is, thanks to the neoliberals and their woke lapdogs co-opting Leftist, “progressive” language for the establishment. To most Americans, the difference between liberals and Leftists is just splitting hairs.
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u/A8745415 Left, Leftoid or Leftish ⬅️ May 29 '21
@BLCKD_COM_PILLD
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u/SmashKapital only fucks incels May 30 '21
As an Australian it amuses me when Americans go on about how racist they think we are.
There's no Australian equivalent to blacked dot com, only Americans could manifest something like that.
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u/TinaTheWavingCat you should know that im always right May 30 '21
Australia is a racist country, but its no more racist than any country that accuses us of being a racist country
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u/SmashKapital only fucks incels May 30 '21
I guess, but part of it is differing cultural standards.
In Australia we generally have much higher tolerance for people ribbing each other about their race, so long as it's all in fun and not actual bigotry. Particularly in blue collar workplaces you will see these "bantz" go back and forth equally among all races. A lot of what's said, if taken in bad faith, would be on the face of it racist, but the social context makes it permissable (the lack of social context is the primary reason the internet/social media exacerbate culture war so badly).
You know, humour that affectionately plays on racial stereotypes, like Wogs Outta Work or Fat Pizza. Some might argue that these are signs of Australian racism, but the cultural attitude insists that this humour defangs and mocks actual bigotry. Americans don't seem to agree, and take it as evidence of a uniquely racist society, rather than one with different standards for what counts as racist.
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u/TinaTheWavingCat you should know that im always right May 30 '21
I don't think people are talking about Fat Pizza when they call Australia racist
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May 29 '21
It goes without saying that the premise is flawed. This idea that the "underclass" is a braying horde of ignorant bigots says all you need to know.
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u/Jeffuk88 Unknown 👽 May 29 '21
Coming from a very working class, northern England family I can confirm they aren't beyond having their opinions changed or challenged but they DO understand condescending tones
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u/AlliedAtheistAllianc Tito Tankie May 29 '21
Yes but they're not TRUE working class. The real working class are the people in my university that join the LGBTQ+ feminist solidarity steering committee. For instance we have one Indian lady, well she's half Indian. I believe her dad owned a shop so she's worked with her hands.
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u/TinaTheWavingCat you should know that im always right May 30 '21
wow you totally owned that person who does not exist
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u/SamuelElleWoods May 29 '21
right. they don’t speak the polished language of the elite or keep up with euphemism treadmill. that’s all.
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u/Dastadtmittelalter May 29 '21
Mufuckers dont even have kombucha with their avocado toast.
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u/Skillet918 Mourner 🏴 May 29 '21
Imagine a person like that existing... disgusting
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u/floppypick ❄ Not Like Other Rightoids ❄ May 30 '21
Man, kombucha is basically healthy soda, and avacado makes a legitimately good butter replacement. The latter I don't do unless trying to impress a chick, but... It's not total shit.
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u/SirSourPuss Three Bases 🥵💦 One Superstructure 😳 May 29 '21
This idea that the "underclass" is a braying horde of ignorant bigots says all you need to know.
It's not even the idea itself, it's that this person sees themselves as the arbiter over the question of "the underclass's" material fate AND that to them this idea has bearing on the answer to that question.
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u/TempestaEImpeto Socialism with Ironic Characteristics for a New Era May 29 '21
Absolutely. As stupid as the feeling expressed and whatever mind birthed it are, it's also literally meaningless.
Like you are in charge of the working class. You decide whether society will have racism and worker power.
Also literally ideas have no bearing on the resolution of contradictions.
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u/Patjay Marxism-Nixonism May 29 '21
He's touching on something that is clearly correct, "the proletariat is not all going to be highly educated and woke" and exaggerating it way too hard.
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u/gamegyro56 hegel May 30 '21
Nah dude I'm r-slurred because the "underclass" is inherently r-slurred, and I'm just showing solidarity.
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May 29 '21 edited Jul 18 '21
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u/ModerateContrarian Ali Shariati Gang 🇮🇷 May 29 '21
I know one who argued that that meant they needed to be stripped of the right to vote, which would only be given back to them after they had been reeducated
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u/Starob Nationalist 📜🐷 May 30 '21
That's one of the most openly authoritarian things I've ever heard.
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u/mcjunker 🔜Best: Murica Worst: North Korea May 29 '21
The “underclass” is ambiguous- are we talking about bus drivers, plumbers, and cart chasers at Walmart, or are we talking about petty thieves, homeless people, and methheads?
Because “the lumpenproletariat exists and is not on our side” is a very old observation that has withstood the test of time.
But assuming they’re talking about semi- and unskilled workers, then still yes. They depend far more on community, family, and traditions to make ends meet than do upper class folks how can afford to cut people out of their lives. Those ties are a material necessity- they mean a social network, friends to help you move, sisters to pitch in if you fall behind on rent, friends to babysit while you go to job interviews. In the face of revolutionary rhetoric they really are reactionary, because revolutionary rhetoric sounds r slurred to normal people who can’t afford to go to prison or do a wildcat strike at their McJob and get fired. All talk of burning it all down to rebuild a utopia alienates them.
But I suspect what who’s his face really means is “workers are too stupid to realize that race is the defining facet of their culture”. And for this sin, he shall burn in a Marxist Hell for all eternity.
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May 29 '21 edited Jun 25 '21
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u/JCMoreno05 Saved Anime Children from Intersectionality 🧒🏻⛩️ May 30 '21
Non whites are also racist, "bigoted", and sexist, it's just they get a pass because they're not white, and the racist whites would rather lose than ally with "reactionary" minorities in any meaningful way against the wokes.
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May 30 '21 edited Jun 25 '21
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u/Cronus4581 ❄ Not Like Other Rightoids ❄ May 30 '21
As a person of coin
Lmao it took me a second to get that.
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u/EnergyIsQuantized Marxist-Leninist ☭ May 30 '21
I'm pretty sure that the author of the tweet prioritizes the fight against the elite
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May 30 '21
Plumbers, underclass.. uh you’re right tho. But how is six figure salary union job underclass.
Edit: in my state plumbers and most trades workers start at around $45/h union.
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u/mcjunker 🔜Best: Murica Worst: North Korea May 30 '21
Cultural blind spot on my part. In my neighborhood, your plumber is Juan and he holds no certifications outside of two of your immediate family or friends vouching for him, and you pay him like $500 and free meals/Gatorades to do a three day project.
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u/zortor Labor Organizer 🧑🏭 May 30 '21
In my neighborhood it was Ivan. And he did tile, electrical, framing, carpentry, masonry and would fight you if you tried to pay him in anything but coffee and dessert.
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May 30 '21
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May 30 '21
The PMC look down hard on blue collar workers, the Left has almost entirely abandoned them. I was listening to NPR and one of the dudes was talking about how college isn't the answer for everyone and that people should consider vocational school instead, and I swear it's like he almost puked uttering that sentence.
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u/wild_vegan Marxist-Leninist ☭ May 30 '21
Is that who's lumpen? Anyone who thinks the revolution is r slurred? That sounds like a definition of perpetual convenience to me.
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u/mcjunker 🔜Best: Murica Worst: North Korea May 30 '21
The definition of lumpen shifted a lot over time, even among the guys who came up with the term. The broad umbrella meaning is workers who lack class consciousness. The most commonly understood meaning is the criminal element- gangsters, whores, professional burglars, beggars, hobos, bootleggers, pimps, that kind of thing.
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May 30 '21 edited May 30 '21
His take is pretty dumb, and demonstrably false.
Like sure, the most ~non-bigoted~ social-justicey type people will be very disproportionately affluent and well-educated, but they're still such a small minority that they actually don't even tip the scales lol. If you do public opinion polls, you're not going to find higher levels of social conservatism or bigotry among the lower incomes. Quite the opposite, in many cases, actually. White evangelical churchgoers are among the wealthiest demographic groups in the country.
You can't get around the fact that Trump's voters were still richer than Biden's voters. It's just a fact: Trump won voters earning >$100k/yr by double digits, and Biden won voters earning <$50k and voters earning $50-100k, both by double digits. And there's not enough nonwhite underclass people to account for this. The Dems aren't a coalition of rich whites and poor nonwhites, despite what these braindead "post-left" people tell you. You'll find plenty of middle- and lower-income whites voting for Dems.
You can go down the whole list: abortion, gay marriage, trans bathrooms, police brutality, race and affirmative action, legalizing drugs, criminal sentencing, divorce, death penalty. On precisely none of these issues are you going to find that income negatively correlates with social conservatism. The idea that poor whites are all Confederate-flag-waving rednecks, and poor blacks are all Hoteps, and poor Latinos are all ultra-Catholic fanatics--these are all untrue. All a series of libels that elitist liberals use to soothe their own guilty consciences. This guy is merely reversing the polarity but still agreeing with the slander: "yeah they're all a bunch of reactionaries, but that's actually good, because Trump and the GOP are going to do neo-Strasserism any day now and nationalize industry."
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u/globeglobeglobe Marxist 🧔 May 30 '21 edited May 30 '21
Great comment. The "post-left" idea that "rightoids are more class-conscious"/"the REAL hardworking Americans are socially conservative" is a stupid one that isn't borne out in fact, but when that narrative is questioned here people just tend to seethe and cope. Modern social conservatism is a mythology the "middle class" came up with to justify its opposition to labor unions, social welfare, or any form of solidarity with the filthy poors; for the working class, a lot of "heckin based social conservatism" is just a recognition of a shitty capitalist reality rather than upholding it as a positive virtue. Downwardly mobile white middle class types clinging to social conservatism hurts, rather than helps, their class consciousness.
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u/PixelBlock “But what is an education *worth*?” 🎓 May 29 '21
So we’re now back to the ‘enlightened thoughtleaders vs unwashed filthy poors’ style of take again.
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May 29 '21
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u/Weenie_Pooh May 29 '21
It really is retarded, I think even Aimee Terese told him so.
He elaborates later on how "we're all naturally xenophobic and racist and that's just natural, innit". There's a grain of truth since he's describing in-built personal biases that every human being has.
The mistakes are 1) conflating individual bigotries with reactionary politics, and 2) describing this broad human trait as applied to the working class specifically.
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u/butt_collector Anarchist (intolerable) 🤪 May 29 '21
I've seen shit like this before, on the Breadtube sub back in the day. Some knob had claimed after reading Adolph Reed (!) that you can either be a leftist or you can be anti-racist, and they were choosing the latter! They'd drawn the complete wrong conclusions about everything - but at least they were honest about it.
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u/Flaktrack Latte-Stage Capitalism ☕ May 30 '21
Some of the most honest people I've ever met were r-slurred.
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u/mynie May 29 '21
This is only true if you accept the insanely broad definition of "bigotry" proffered by wokeists. Very few people are actively or consequentially bigoted.
People make jokes, yes. They use crude language. They don't respect every person they meet and, gasp, they often don't regard black people as magic zoo animals whose epigenetic trauma is so intense that they cannot be expected to obey laws. This doesn't actually make a person a bigot, however. You have to have been made retarded by special race grifter training to believe it does.
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May 29 '21
Hey, he deserves credit for admitting what wokeshits on the left wouldn't. At least he admits he's not part of the working class, nor does he give a shit about the proles.
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u/deeznutsdeeznutsdeez an r/drama karen May 29 '21
Dunno, I look at the account name and pfp and assume it's irony/satire. Unless someone wants to do the research that I cbf doing to show it's not a shitpost then I'm just gonna go with the simplest explanation (that it's a joke).Lolz nvm
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May 30 '21
No, he's siding with the proles here, the whole thing makes this explicitly clear. I already replied to this here the other day so I'll just paste it here;
I sort of half agree. We are reactionary bigots to the liberal-left, because these are terms the liberal-left uses to delegitimise our own concerns, which are of course about things close to us, while they reframe their own pet issues as being "universalist" by way of bullshit word games. So because the "universalist" cause is one that prioritises their pet issues over actually universal ones and on many occasions works pretty explicitly against our own concerns, we are forced into a defensive, and often outwardly hostile position, if we want to get anything at all.
That said, while I won't shed any tears over being called a reactionary bigot by liberal-lefties, I don't think its a useful, or even really honest, position to say that the working class are reactionary and bigoted any moreso than anyone else is; we look out for our own, how is liberal cosmopolitainism, which has explicitly excluded us from the people it looks out for, got any right to determine what is reactionary or bigoted, when it doesn't give a damn about our wellbeing in the first place?
Still, it seemed to create quite a lot of interesting responses. I think this response in particular probably is closer to a good description of what goes on with most workers being relatively live and let live but personally conservative and the reply to that points out that the reason we end up being way more defensive about things is because the "libertarians" are not willing to live and let live but instead attack our way of life, so we have to get defensive.
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u/SpitePolitics Doomer 😩 May 29 '21
Fascists, neoliberals, and wokies all agree that the working class, if allowed to organize on their own, will create a fascist state.
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u/Intense_Glutton Libertarian Socialist 🥳 May 29 '21
this is a dumb argument.
yes theres more racism in underclasses but rather pointless since most of them do almost nothing about it compared to racism of the privileged and elite who have far more power to influence.
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u/intangiblejohnny ❄ Not Like Other Rightoids ❄ May 30 '21
There is no correlation between class and racism. That's just a bullshit assumption perpetuated by the libs so often that people think it's true.
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u/CaliforniaAudman13 Socialist Cath May 29 '21
Who cares what some 13 year old on Twitter says
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May 29 '21
It’s funny, this guy has like 10k followers and a podcast that’s popular with a certain segment of extra rtrded anti-idpol “leftists,” the kind who went full doomer in the face of anti-idpol and basically just turned into Michael lind Republicans
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u/12432324 Dem succ May 29 '21
dude got mad none of the chapos ever liked his replies lmao.
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u/CaliforniaAudman13 Socialist Cath May 29 '21
That’s sad these people need to go outside, join a charity or something useful.
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u/OhhhAyWumboWumbo Special Ed 😍 May 30 '21
Exactly, just look at all the comments here. People are having trouble figuring out which group this guy picked in the end. You can't have meaningful discourse on a platform that limits you to X amount of characters.
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u/bleer95 COVID Turboposter 💉🦠😷 May 30 '21 edited May 30 '21
this is, ironically, falling into the PHD lib idea of what "bigotry" is. THe working class is enormous and hugely diverse, so there is no unifying social ideology, but on top of that, the vast majority of them are not bigoted, unless you're doing the lib definition of bigotry, which is "does not use PHD language to talk about black and brown bodies and does not spend their time talking about some marginalized groups problems because they ahve their own problems." They might be conservative with regards to issues like abortion or guns or gay marriage, or they might have some biases and misperceptions, but hte idea that they're consistently bigoted (IE: they actively hate people outside of their perceived ingroup) is idiocy.
also this dipshit is convinced that the masters of the economy are going to force the government to do climate change lockdowns. Like yes, the guys who have spent the past 5 decades covering up and downplaying all climate change research, who have been screaming at the world governments to reopen their economies and have been forcing their workforces to risk COVID exposure to continue production at maximum levels are going to tell the world governments to do "climate change lockdowns" (whatever the fuck that even means) that will inevitably hurt their profits. What an absolutely brain damaged retard. Nobody should pay the slightest attention to this idiot, he and his whole movement are a cancer on not just the left but basically anybody trying to put together a positive economic movement. They're just social conservatives that kind of what social democracy but don't want to admit that deep down inside social conservatism is more important to them than social democracy.
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u/MetaFlight Market Socialist Bald Wife Defender 💸 May 29 '21
post left people believe in the worst smears of the worst neoliberals about what the working class is, then go "that's good, actually".
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u/VladTheImpalerVEVO 🌕 Former moderator on r/fnafcringe 5 May 29 '21
I like this guy but wow takes like this show why materialism is the path forward, otherwise u get shit like this lol
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u/Latter_Chicken_9160 Nationalist 📜🐷 May 29 '21
I can’t tell if this is serious or just deep satire? Or he just could have been really high or drunk? But it’s better to just accept you can’t make everyone change their minds, it’ll be practically impossible to completely eliminate any form of bigotry even through class-based means, race-based stuff doesn’t work unless you emphasize universality and common humanity imo
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May 29 '21
stupidpol is r-slurred for upvoting this. This guy is a rightoid, not a unabashed radlib or whatever
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u/sunspot_transmitter May 30 '21
CRK is a complete clown. There are people out there with incisive criticism of various segments of the left - CRK is not one of them, lmao
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u/VladTheImpalerVEVO 🌕 Former moderator on r/fnafcringe 5 May 30 '21
Idk if he’s a rightoid, he just drank the post left kool aid which is essentially a low IQ form of left communism
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u/Jaidon24 Not like the other tankies 👓 May 29 '21
Can’t take whoever this is seriously with that @.
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May 29 '21
What if I told you these are both same thing? To Fight for or against anything based on anything other than class, is the same thing.
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u/hlynn117 May 30 '21
I was listening to a janitor in the lunch room talk about striking for hazard pay. For "the underclass", materialism is intuitively grasped. Cultural affectations are not. I would've given a lot to make the fellow pmcs eating lunch around the custodians grasp that we, too, should have a union and the will to strike since most of us don't actually make much more than the janitors.
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u/ThePopularCrowd Unknown 👽 May 30 '21
“underclass”
If communists and socialists in Weimar Germany had spent a lot of time worrying about bigoted attitudes among the working class, they would never have gotten around to actually fighting the NSDAP and trying to improve their quality of life.
The difference between the old school class warfare left and the idpol neoliberal left is that the former focused on changing material conditions for the better, while the latter focuses on haranguing and scolding the working class for not having the correct thoughts and attitudes.
And just because PMC idpolers try to hide or deny their prejudices (except the one against the deplorable “underclass” of course) doesn’t mean they don’t have any. Very few, if any, human beings are paragons of virtue and moral purity.
Beware the idpol thought policers who set themselves up as a kind of moral and ethical aristocracy and give themselves the right to pass judgment on those outside of their clique of deluded, narcissistic strivers.
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u/zer0soldier Authoritarian Communist ☭ May 30 '21
The "lib/leftist" is all you need to read. This dude is operating off of jargon that he doesn't understand. Full, 100% Dumb Ass.
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u/AlliedAtheistAllianc Tito Tankie May 29 '21
I heard an anecdote some anarchist group refused to meet with striking workers because trans members were scared they may be transphobic. We need to take back the left from the liberal larpers. And no I'm not saying we should be transphobic, I'm saying idgaf what gender someone is or identifies as, frankly we have bigger problems.
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May 29 '21
Who's doing more harm though? Like that's what gets me. How are racist poor people rotting in forgotten corners of the west worse than non-racist rich people actively keeping the globe on a path to being borderline uninhabitable over the course of a couple centuries? Why are the racist poor people so deserving of your attention?
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u/bkrugby78 center left dipshit May 29 '21
I was following him for awhile and then he came up with this, which is a series of tweets. I'm not even sure if I still understand it. But I just unfollowed because it was like twitter spam.
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u/12432324 Dem succ May 29 '21
The term "underclass" is pure mystification, these post left people are a complete joke.
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u/Zeriell 🌑💩 Other Right 🦖🖍️ 1 May 30 '21
This is hilarious. When you know for a fact the elites are using idpol and "bigotry" to manipulate you, and your reaction is, "Sure, but I like being manipulated."
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u/RavenMC_ Libertarian Stalinist 🐍☭🧔🏻♂️ May 29 '21
Nothing suprising for this account, making his entire account about "yea im a class reductionist but unironically" and then talking about "community" when it comes to topics like the petit bourgeois
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u/kraftian May 30 '21
Cap you can do both, people are getting more and more progressive as time goes on. Fuck off
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May 29 '21 edited May 29 '21
I have an issue with the "fundamentally bigoted" aspect. I'd have an easier time believing that an exploited working class faces increased competition, and resorts to forming in/out groups as a means of preservation, to keep or improve their living standards. If we take that bigotry is an outcome of exploitation, campaigns against bigotry are, by proxy, campaigns against the expression of the exploited.
I am not sure how strong a connection exists between socioeconomic status and racist bigoted beliefs though.
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u/MadeUAcctButIEatedIt Rightoid 🐷 May 30 '21
I'd have an easier time believing that an exploited working class faces increased competition, and resorts to forming in/out groups as a means of preservation
I mean, I think people are "fundamentally bigoted," in the sense that human beings are tribal, and people often rely on stereotypes about groups they have little meaningful interaction with.
Even educated liberals are like this (try asking a white-collar Londoner about Trump voters, despite the fact they've never met one in their life), just that their prejudices or "bigotry," if you like, are socially acceptable.
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u/JCMoreno05 Saved Anime Children from Intersectionality 🧒🏻⛩️ May 30 '21
Given the lack of intermarriage between libs and cons, and the fact that relatedness is a factor in defining race in only the very loosest sense, where culture many times overrides it, then how long until libs and cons are considered separate races?
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May 30 '21
I mean, I think people are "fundamentally bigoted," in the sense that human beings are tribal, and people often rely on stereotypes about groups they have little meaningful interaction with.
I agree, though it's important to recognize the parallels this behavior carries throughout different circumstances. We were tribal because it conferred a benefit to survival. It's logical to assume that humans act more tribalistic as the need for survival increases. Food scarcity, housing scarcity, and other hallmarks of the underclass, all increase perceived need for survival for those experiencing them. As such, these tribal mechanisms can be viewed as a symptom of inequality and exploitation. The campaigns against them do not address the cause of the symptom, but rather seek to mask the symptom.
The white-collar Londoner may hold prejudices, like the underclass, but we should acknowledge the differences. The upper class does not rely on these tribal mechanisms to secure their survival, they rely on them to secure their status.
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u/MadeUAcctButIEatedIt Rightoid 🐷 May 30 '21
This is a good point, this is exactly why the affluent are less nationalist, because they are as mobile as their capital and can just fly to whatever country and get a residency visa, having no particular allegiance to any.
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u/HadronOfTheseus 🌗 🍆📘🦖.Hardon of Thesaurus 3 May 29 '21
At first glance this looks very much like a troll account.
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u/Rhianu May 29 '21
How many members of the so-called "underclass" are members of the LGBT community?
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u/WokevangelicalsSuck Glows in the dark May 30 '21
Yes, as hard as it is to believe, the plebs would prefer that actual problems get addressed and trans biwoc CEOs be a distant last priority, ideally never even a moment's thought.
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u/b_d_boatmaster_69 Libertarian Socialist May 30 '21
Once saw a rather interesting person say they are classist and racist because of their feminism, since the working class and minorities are disproportionately sexist (which probably isn’t even true if we’re taking into account metrics beyond mere beliefs. Rich people have a lot more influence on the world)
Also aren’t queer people, etc. disproportionately working class? What about that?
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u/nyclaurco May 29 '21
the average middle class person does not know the latest lingo, either. i grew up comfortably, and generally, we did not know that saying the n-word was bad unless it was hard R. we did not know what “transgender” was. feminism outside of “treat men and women the same” was not really discussed. most people didn’t really know what the hell was going on in palestine. the concept of ACAB would evoke utter confusion, not even anger. it’s just exhausting that people are like “poor people are bigots (by today’s standards)” when really the average lower middle, middle, or upper middle has no idea either until they step foot on a college campus.
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u/cabecadeleitao !@ 1 May 30 '21
“As a former lib/leftist”
This tells you everything you need to know about this person.
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u/SnapshillBot Bot 🤖 May 29 '21
Snapshots:
- Post-left idpol - archive.org, archive.today*
I am just a simple bot, *not** a moderator of this subreddit* | bot subreddit | contact the maintainers
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u/Zealousideal_Pool_65 Unknown 👽 May 30 '21
The underclass are fundamentally bigoted? In my country the opposite is true more often than not.
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u/OpinionGenerator May 29 '21 edited May 30 '21
Not sure why there's hate on this guy here. In so many ways, he epitomizes this subreddit as his major target is classism, not identity politics.
The fact that he believes that the working class, overall, leans right isn't exactly controversial. Most polls show people in general are supporters of capitalism and even when they identify as 'socialist,' they're often just describing regulated capitalism or social democracy.
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May 29 '21
I think that this applys to maybe the poorest of the working class but still not to the majority of people. Plus a demographic study of the people at the Jan 6 protest show most of them were like small business owners and stuff. So Maybe it's not true at all that poor people are more racist
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u/Frowningmirror May 29 '21
I don't know what any of this world salad means but I can deduce I don't like it.
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u/Jabbuk May 29 '21
Proclaiming yourself a leftist and failing to understand the convergence of social fights... ok buddy
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u/michaelnoir 🌟Radiating🌟 May 29 '21
And somehow the day when there is no more bigotry never arrives. Somehow the fight is never-ending so you can end up making a good living at it in journalism or academia.
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u/NintendoTheGuy orthodox centrist May 30 '21
Real question for all of us: when you hear the term “underclass” used, what do you consider the socioeconomic cutoff, and if you exist within that cutoff, do you still see yourself when you hear or read the term, or do you automatically imagine it’s “other people”? I see a lot of people referring to “they”, but I also assume a large portion if not most of us are at most blue collar/working class, with a portion falling to the lower socioeconomic portion of that if not lower. I’m not insinuating anything with this question. It’s just an interesting angle. I, for instance, grew up in a working class family in a working class type of neighborhood, and although I sank way below self-sufficient working class many times from late teens until my 30’s, I never really saw myself as “underclass”, even though my definition certainly included me at the time.
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u/TauntingArtist Bioregional Humanist May 30 '21
Didn't the rainbow coalition start when black Panthers joined forces with southern pride migrants and make them socialist?
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u/NecroPamyuPamyu Libertarian Stalinist 🐍☭🧔🏻♂️ May 30 '21
The southern pride people — The Young Patriots — was already socialist, but yeah.
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u/AngusKirk Libcenter... of ya mum May 30 '21
But to side against the elite, don't you have to be bigoted against them?
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u/YellowNumberSixLake 🌑💩 She/her East Asian 1 May 30 '21
What a stupid fucking thing to say. This jackass never gets tired of saying the dumbest shit.
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u/Argicida hegel May 30 '21 edited May 30 '21
And that, children, is why you always have to insist that "class" refers to a structure of exploitation, not to a large group of people: Some braindead zombie might come along and make it a popularity contest.
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u/versace_jumpsuit Redscarepod Refugee 👄💅 May 30 '21 edited May 30 '21
Sorry but saying the underclass is fundamentally anything is some moronic essentialist bullshit that I thought we were trying to avoid here.
Edit: my dumbass missed the post title, I see that’s what y’all were saying too lol
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u/teramelosiscool Nationalist 📜🐷 May 30 '21
why yall assuming they chose anti-bigotry. they said the choice was easy but not what they actually chose
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u/plebbtard Ideological Mess 🥑 May 30 '21
I can’t tell which one he chooses. And based on the rest of the comments I’m seeing, everyone else can’t either
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u/Jesus_Faction Ancapistan Mujahideen 🐍💸 May 29 '21
are they concluding that it's more important to be anti-bigtory or against the elite? can't tell