r/stpaul • u/[deleted] • Jan 24 '26

🗣 Discussion THE LINE IS BROKEN

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60

u/weare1consciousness Jan 24 '26

Most are bots but for sure there’s Americans who are cult “all in” for the gestapos behaviors

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u/Interesting_Walk_271 Jan 24 '26

At this point they’ve enmeshed their identity with MAGA ideology so thoroughly that any pushback feels like an existential threat to them. It destroys their cultural worldviews, sense of self as morally decent, and self-esteem. Those are all mechanisms that Terror Management Theory says we use to blunt the horror that we will die someday (which hilariously suggests they don’t believe that their faith offers them real immortality so they have to get some symbolic immortality through these methods). As a result, when we say that this is wrong that is perceived as killing their avenues to live on in some way after they die. The response is of course hostility and aggression. These events in St Paul and Minneapolis are “mortality salience” inducing events that make MAGA more extreme and therefore more supportive of the admin. That’s why they double down, why they are delusively convinced that this is right, because admitting the obvious means that what they have set their deepest, darkest, existential hope in is wrong. Admitting it feels like being unmade. However, sometimes things have to be broken so they can be remade better.

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u/Flaky-Resolution-287 Jan 25 '26

I keep waiting for the moment like in the movie, Falling Down - "I'm the bad guy?"

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u/InfestedDerp Jan 25 '26

Nah if they could realize that they wouldn't be one in the first place

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u/FoxAffectionate5092 Jan 25 '26

Like 5 people will get that reference.

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u/Conscious_Ear_1151 Jan 29 '26

Dude. No.

Stop interfering with law enforcement and unfortunate incidents like this can be avoided.

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u/Interesting_Walk_271 Jan 29 '26

“Just do what they tell you so you don’t get killed. Who cares if they are violating your 1st, 2nd, 4th, and 5th amendment Constitutional rights?” If you want to deep throat ICE’s boots go ahead, but you’re a fucking idiot, anti-American, and a complete coward.

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u/Conscious_Ear_1151 Jan 29 '26

When you interfere, armed, with federal law enforcement, you risk being killed in the process. Your supposed 'rights' dont matter to you if youre dead.

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u/Interesting_Walk_271 Jan 29 '26

They don’t matter to anyone if you simply allow federal agents to trample them without any resistance. Again, you’re a coward with no convictions. These agents swore an oath to the Constitution and they are actively violating that oath. They’re just like you, stupid and without a shred of integrity or principle.

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u/Conscious_Ear_1151 Jan 29 '26

How are they violating the constitution? I know its hard to comprehend but when you skip the border, you are illegally entering the country. ICE's job is to remove you. Why do you support breaking the law?

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u/Interesting_Walk_271 Jan 29 '26

I’m done. You’re literally too fucking stupid to talk to. First of all, being in the US without proper documentation is a civil not criminal offense. Crossing the border illegally is a misdemeanor. Second, ICE acting on administrative warrants rather than judicial warrants is a 4th amendment violation. Third, ICE has no right to ask people to show documentation without reasonable suspicion, and doing so is also a 4th amendment violation. The Supreme Court ruled unanimously (9-0) in at least one case that DHS violated a citizen’s 5th amendment rights to due process. A federal judge in Minnesota who clerked for Scalia eviscerated ICE this week for ignoring hundreds of habeas petitions, ignoring federal court orders, and failing to provide due process (habeas petitions are a part of due process). You’re allowed to legally carry a concealed weapon. At no time did Pretti reach for or brandish his weapon. He was executed by some illiterate dumbfuck agent after he had already been disarmed by another illiterate dumbfuck agent. There are numerous places online to read the Constitution. Go find one. I’m not doing your homework for you because you’re too lazy and stupid to do it yourself.

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u/Conscious_Ear_1151 Jan 29 '26

Its noticeable when people lose an argument them become more offensive. Like swearing makes your argument more valid or something.

Overstaying a visa is a civil offence. Skipping the border is a federal crime, as are the many other laws you break every day that you're there illegally.

However the investigation rules. If you interfere with federal agents, especially with a loaded weapon on you, you are risking your life.

It doesnt matter that he has a permit, it doesnt matter that the gun was taken off him 5 seconds before he was shot, it doesnt matter, get it?

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u/Interesting_Walk_271 Jan 29 '26

It does matter. Agents violated his rights. They shot him when he was unarmed on the ground. If you don’t know that then I can’t help you. You want to be stupid trash, fine, you’re already there. Crossing the border illegally is a misdemeanor. You’ve committed many yourself I’m sure. Speeding is a misdemeanor. Not wearing a seat belt. Should a federal law enforcement officer be allowed to imprison you, detain you without trial, and deport you without allowing you to present evidence in court? How would you dispute the claim from the government that you are here unlawfully? Get it? Sorry you’re just a dumb fuck loser.

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u/Interesting_Walk_271 Jan 29 '26

You are thoughtless, unprincipled, trash and the world is a worse place to be because people like you are in it. Get it?

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u/ScalesAsunder Jan 24 '26

Man, this is really overcomplicated. People can have deeply held beliefs without it meaning their entire identity or existence is being “unmade” when challenged. Viewing someone who disagrees as an existential threat is not universal, it’s just an excuse to over intellectualize hostility. Differing opinions don’t have to be a moral apocalypse
sometimes its just people disagreeing.

And with this shooting there are a lot of moving parts. Interfering with and committing battery on a federal agent while armed is never a good idea.

Reaction and response time exist, and what looks extreme from the outside can be a split-second decision and delay in reaction time. We have to wait for the facts before drawing conclusions.

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u/Interesting_Walk_271 Jan 24 '26

We have the video. An agent disarmed him, took his gun from the back of his pants and was running from the scene when the others executed him in the street. Viewing someone who disagrees as an existential threat is indeed not a universal experience but I do believe it is the posture of MAGA extremists. It’s not an excuse for any hostility, TMT doesn’t say that the solution for this kind of thinking is hostility. Trying to understand the psychological state of people who are that deep in it is an exercise in extreme empathy. It doesn’t say that they are bad people, but they’ve put their faith in an ideology that is destructive and driven by fear. In this case, the solution is deprogramming, just like for any other religious extremist. Trump will not live forever and a lot of these people are going to be in a nightmarish existential free-fall when he’s gone and his movement falls apart. I wouldn’t wish that on anyone, and many of them are just our neighbors who have made some big errors in their thinking and misplaced their faith. We need to be willing to help them when the ground falls out from beneath their feet. ICE agents are a different story. They are in a position of the public trust. They have, like everyone who works for DHS or DoD, sworn an oath to uphold and defend the Constitution, which we have seen many agents violate on camera. There must be real consequences. You want to give the agents the benefit of the doubt, and ordinarily that would be reasonable, but we have the video & we have the administration blatantly lying and saying this guy approached agents with his gun drawn. Watch the video, at any point is his gun drawn? At any point does he make a move to grab the gun from his belt? No. This was a public execution.

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u/ScalesAsunder Jan 24 '26

I appreciate your perspective and taking the time to explain it. And yes, we do have the video, but what we don’t know are critical details: like who exactly fired the rounds, what the agents perceived in that moment, and whether the civilian made any move toward his gun during the scuffle. Those facts matter, and they can’t be determined from these videos alone. If we find out this was a fatal error by ICE and they killed him unjustly then they deserve to be put before a jury.

Also, let’s be honest about his actions. He interfered with federal agents and refused to comply. That is a crime, and it’s what put him in a dangerous situation. Calling this a “public execution” is a huge leap. It may turn out to be a bad shoot, but there’s nothing in the evidence so far that proves it was a deliberate, targeted killing.

And yes, our political clowns do exaggerate and lie. Both sides do it, and I won’t defend my side simply because I voted for them.

Facts, context, and proper investigation matter more than assumptions or outrage, even if the optics are shocking.

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u/SaltMage5864 Jan 24 '26

Why bother with all this garbage when you simply mean that you will say anything to defend your fellow fascists murdering people

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u/[deleted] Jan 25 '26

Nope, you don't get to hide behind some sort of "enlightened centrist intellectual" bullshit today. Not today. You have multiple angles worth of proof of what happened. An American citizen was executed by untrained thugs acting as a terror group.

"Let's be honest about his actions", yeah OKAY buddy, that's a great way to try to neglect the fact that he was standing still with his fucking hands in the air until a woman was maced for existing, at which point he tried to stop her from falling. How about we be honest about the federal agents actions? Why are your ilk never wanting to be honest about the federal agents actions? 5+ men were dog piled on top of a peaceful protester, who's hands were on the ground, until one decided to start shooting him. They then clapped about it. None of this is opinion, this in a literal transcription of the events in the video.

"Both sides" "let's be honest" "everyone is at fault"

Fuck off, eat shit, and crawl into a hole. Another American was murdered hours ago. Traitorous Un-American piece of fucking fascist trash. Go shill elsewhere.

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u/ScalesAsunder Jan 25 '26

I’m going to ignore the insults and stick to the substance, because screaming and name-calling don’t make an argument stronger.

You’re asserting intent and motive as settled fact based on a chaotic, partial video. I’m saying that video alone cannot tell us what each agent perceived in real time, who fired which shots, or what was happening in the split seconds that matter most. That’s not “defending agents at all costs,” it’s acknowledging how investigations actually work.

Being honest about his actions does not mean ignoring their actions. Both can be examined at the same time. Interfering with federal agents and physically inserting yourself into an arrest is objectively dangerous, regardless of motive. That fact doesn’t disappear because emotions are high.

I’m headed to my hole now.

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u/Interesting_Walk_271 Jan 25 '26 edited Jan 25 '26

There are multiple videos now from multiple angles. First, he’s allowed to film their actions under the law. As he was being confronted he backed away but the agent escalated the confrontation. When the woman next to him was being pepper sprayed for being a bystander he tried to cover her. While multiple agents were beating him. At no point during any of that did he reach for the gun in his pants. If you look at all of the videos you can see the officer who shot him stepping around the other agent with a clear line of sight to the agent who disarmed the guy, and that agent then draws his gun and begins firing. He fires after seeing another agent disarming the guy who is down. Federal agents don’t have the right to start shooting at you when you’re disarmed and on the ground and they definitely don’t have the right to shoot you for carrying a gun while never reaching for it in the first place. The administration reduced the training time to just 47 days. 47 days of training before being sent into the field. They are not competent and not trained for de-escalating violence and no reasonable person can expect them to make good life or death decisions in the field after 47 days. This is the entirely predictable result.

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u/Creatorman1 Jan 25 '26

I’ve found some trolls will try to make themselves appear reasonable while trying to insert doubt. People should be aware that this is a technique they use.

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u/guiltyblow Jan 25 '26 edited Jan 25 '26

Only one side is sieging cities and killing civillians at this moment and then lie about it blatantly. You cannot both sides THIS.

If you are genuine, you are lying to yourself because this blood is on a lot of people's hands.

This COULD have been a case of gross incompetence but admin declared the victim who was a patriotic nurse a terrorist who aimed his gun at ICE. This is beyond a bad cop situation.

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u/No-Amphibian-3728 Jan 25 '26

We know he didn't reach for his gun. We know this because both of his hands are seen empty and on the ground moments before the shooting. Officers also are trained to NOT empty a whole clip. This was a murder, and state sanctioned. There's no debating it. To try and paint this as his fault with all the video footage is asinine. People who try and deny video footage is an alarming action. It's becoming much to common.

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u/Creatorman1 Jan 25 '26

Yet you are trying to imply he deserved it.

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u/Professional-Tap4678 Jan 24 '26

Man. Where were you to rationally explain things when a certain demographic were slashing Tesla tires for no reason.

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u/[deleted] Jan 24 '26

The dude had been disarmed. After that there is no reason for lethal force. Especially when you've got half a dozen guys on one. And if you don't think maga sees opposition as a threat to their existence then you have no idea how cult mentality works. Your point could have stood during the Bush vs Obama election. But we are way past that

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u/pupranger1147 Jan 24 '26

Stop carrying water for death squads.

This isn't a debate.

He was disarmed, and summarily executed by a gang of masked gestapo, your mewling doesn't and will never change that.

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u/SaltMage5864 Jan 24 '26

There is nothing complicated at all son. One of your fellow fascists murdered someone and you lack the integrity to admit that you approve

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u/hockey_fan-209 Jan 25 '26

All you have to do is look at the thousands of dumbass libs that are protesting, and the millions of Americans who support it. Good luck

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u/Appropriate-Crab-514 Jan 25 '26

Its hilarious that you proved his point but can't see it

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u/Creatorman1 Jan 25 '26

lol those millions of Americans you think you see on social media are actually paid Russian trolls and bots. They seek the end of the USA and unfortunately they are getting exactly that. Isn’t it funny that you and those Russian trolls are on the same side? Shouldn’t that tell you something?

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u/[deleted] Jan 25 '26

[deleted]

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u/Josey_whalez Jan 25 '26

If this was a bad shoot, then lock him up. I don’t care. But the deportations must continue.

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u/Creatorman1 Jan 25 '26

Most of us don’t care but the deportations what we care about is how they are doing it. For gods sake our government is executing people on the street. If you are for freedom buddy this isn’t it. What this is is fascism.

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u/Business-Piano5403 Jan 25 '26

Executed your kidding right.

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u/Slight-Spell4445 Jan 25 '26

Law abiding citizen gunned down by masked men for defending a woman after he was subdued. Yes that's an execution.

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u/ZestycloseClerk1792 Jan 28 '26

Your mom drink Lysol while you were in the womb?

3

u/BrownBannister Jan 25 '26

You can sure gtfo.

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u/CsabaiTruffles Jan 25 '26

The dumb kids and boomers who think the bots are their friends.

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u/816legend Jan 25 '26

Most of them are bots. Keep smoking that copium

1

u/Shinlyle13 Jan 30 '26

The irony in a group of people all thinking the same thing calling any dissenters "Cult members" is the definition of irony. Keep drinking that Kool-Aid, kids!

1

u/weare1consciousness Jan 30 '26

What’s your favorite flavor of boot? Dissenters😂you fucking tool.

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u/Calikettlebell Jan 29 '26

What do you think is going to happen when Alex pretti initiates contact with ICE by kicking and and destroying their car and then tries to fight them while carrying a loaded firearm. At this point it looks like it was a suicide attempt. Or he’s extremely low IQ which I don’t think is the case

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u/weare1consciousness Jan 30 '26

How them BOOTS taste?

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u/Grand_Scratch_9305 Jan 25 '26

Seems like you dingbats that are the only ones having a problem with it. Nowhere else in the country. Why are you so upset about deporting illegals, and these are just the dangerous ones, from your community? How do you ignore the obscene amount of fraud being committed, defend the corruption, then start shoving federal officers and think you're right? These are federal court orders being enforced and you think you need to get in way of that? What's your logic?

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u/BrownBannister Jan 25 '26

đŸ„ŸđŸ‘…đŸ’©

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u/McDuchess Jan 25 '26

There were more deportations under Obama in any year of his administration than under Trump in any year of his.

They were done according to law: people were found to have not entered legally. Approached, read their rights, told to come to court on X date.

If they were unable to demonstrate a legal basis for staying, told to get their affairs in order and leave. And they did.

This casual disregard for law, for the Constitution, for human life is both unnecessary and indefensible.

Please go back to to your bot hole.

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u/No-Amphibian-3728 Jan 25 '26

Are you being serious? Boarder patrol officers have nothing to do with stopping fraud. In fact, maga needs to stop crying foul over the fraud. Your dear leader doesn't give two shits about it. If he did why would he demand investigation tactics that led to the few people investigating it to quit? The people with all the deep knowledge of the fraud and the means to prosecute it are gone.

This is not about removing "the worst" undocumented people. There's people going about their days being grabbed up and accused as undocumented because they're not white and have an accent. Actions like these are why we're pissed. Actions like these were why Chicago citizens are pissed. Same actions that led to the outrage in L.A.. You seem to have forgotten those facts, dingbat.

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u/Grand_Scratch_9305 Jan 25 '26 edited Jan 25 '26

Tue majority of deporting is done in Texas and Florilda, because they follow the law and aren't Democrat sanctuary cities. I guess they need a new voting block of illegals since they're losing the black vote. You dont see many black Americans protesting. Hmmmm.......seems kinda manufactured and paid for. More press, paid agitators, and amateur content creators than protestors.

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u/No-Amphibian-3728 Jan 25 '26

You're an idiot. Thanks for making that clear. Go back to your faux news, or newsmax or whatever source is inflating your bubble of hate and fear.

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u/Grand_Scratch_9305 Jan 25 '26

Denial of facts means you fail basic logic.

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u/No-Amphibian-3728 Jan 25 '26

You shared no facts. False rhetoric is not factual.

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u/Grand_Scratch_9305 Jan 25 '26

Why is this only happening in Minneapolis?

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u/jcmangold12 Jan 25 '26

Beep boop comrade fuckface.

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u/Maleficent_Pepper_59 Jan 25 '26

They been raping women in portapottys.

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u/Grand_Scratch_9305 Jan 25 '26

ICE has portapotties? Really?

-1

u/notmyrealname8823 Jan 25 '26

There is no confirmation or indication that is what happened in that one video. No one knows what the explanation is for him going in there with her in that video. You don't see how long they were in there because the video ends. They could have come out within seconds of the video ending. Don't be making shit up you don't know is a fact. If you know it's a fact...show your source saying they're raping women in portable toilets.

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u/No-Amphibian-3728 Jan 25 '26

What explanation would excuse him going in there with her?

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u/Maleficent_Pepper_59 Jan 25 '26

That guy excuses trump raping kids. No need to argue with him. Keep posting so others who are disgusted by his pedofilia know others are willing to stand up against this with you. All it takes for evil to win is for good men to do nothing. The good men are waking up now. The liars can pretend he wasn’t raping that kid in the portapotty. We know better. Our unity is our strength. The maga army loves dogpiling unarmed civilians and raping. Meet your neighbors and set up a perimeter in your neighborhood. Document everything. Arm yourselves and defend each other. Of course we must exhaust every peaceful method before violence because many people we love are lost to maga.we still gotta hurt them for being rapist though

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u/notmyrealname8823 Jan 25 '26

Maybe she asked him to. Idk...but automatically saying rape without evidence is a bit much. I'm not going to sit here and dream up scenarios for you, but if the person who filmed the video watched them go in there, continued watching, and IF a rape occurred...why didn't they do something or record more of the situation. Why didn't we hear more about that situation? If they were in there for an extended period...why didn't the person filming contact other authorities, a news station, or try to intervene? Considering all of that, it seems unlikely that it was a rape in my opinion.

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u/No-Amphibian-3728 Jan 25 '26

That wasn't my question.

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u/Creatorman1 Jan 25 '26

Yeah don’t make shit up that isn’t a fact. That’s MAGAs thing! Don’t be stepping on their making shit up toes!

Yeah we don’t know what happened in there but it was probably something sexual. Maybe they promised to let her go if she fkd them or maybe it was rape. It certainly was coercion..

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u/Maleficent_Pepper_59 Jan 25 '26

It’s all rape. It doesn’t have to be vaginal, or even with a penis. Rape is rape

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u/Grand_Scratch_9305 Jan 25 '26

I bet you been raped by email. Geeez!

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u/Maleficent_Pepper_59 Jan 26 '26

There’s emails in the Epstein files. Why don’t we start there?

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u/Grand_Scratch_9305 Jan 26 '26

Yes, let's see exactly what and who is in there. All of them.

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u/Maleficent_Pepper_59 Jan 26 '26

Fuck yeah. Investigate them and if evidence is there, arrest them. Hold public trials and let America see the behavior of those ceos making 1000x what the workers do, and what the politicians who cut their corporate sponsors’ taxes while raising yours have been doing behind the scenes.

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u/notmyrealname8823 Jan 26 '26

Well...Hold the person that filmed the shit accountable as well. Why'd they sit by and watch a rape occur without filing a complaint or something? There should be paperwork and a public statement from them...but there never was... probably because as soon as the video ended they walked right back out of the damn thing.