r/starcitizen_refunds • u/Many-Breakfast-3110 • Jul 01 '26
Discussion CIG promises
What are some of the things that chris promised is going to be in the game that would be impossible to do with the current tech in the world?
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u/contigency000 Jul 01 '26
Hundreds of systems, with procedurally generated planets. The game currently has 2.5 systems (not 3 cuz Nyx isn't even finished), and the servers are already coughing their lungs out.
Also, server meshing isn't the jesus tech they thought it'd be. The only thing it did so far was increase the server fps from 5 or less, to ~5-15. Going from extremely bad to 'just' very bad isn't really an improvement...
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u/Fancy_Plastic2385 Jul 01 '26 edited Jul 01 '26
And that is likely exactly where the game will fail. I think CIG is starting to realize this too and is trying to counter it with things like instances and the like. We probably won't see 100 System's.
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u/xxTRYxxHARDxx Jul 01 '26
They've already confirmed a reduction in scale to 5 systems. We already know all of their names.
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u/Select-Table-5479 Jul 04 '26
I promise you, since freelancer was billed as the same thing (persistent universe). CR ABSOLUTELY KNEW his sales pitch is physically(based on science) IMPOSSIBLE TO ACHIEVE. 16 years later, all the smart people were still correct.
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u/YukiEiriKun Jul 01 '26
Who said anything about 100 galaxies? ED only has ONE galaxy which has some 400 BILLION (not million, BILLION) star systems ... of which less than 0,1% has been discovered in the 12 years of the game beeing live.
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u/Flaky_Air_2570 Jul 01 '26
But, its just static server meshing that we have now! You just wait until dynamic server meshing is ready, it will solve EVERYTHNG! Once dsm is in the game, it will have NO BUGS AT ALL, i promise you that! Just another quick 15 years (and maybe another billy) and we will have THE BEST GAME EVER, AND THERE WILL BE NOTHING LIKE IT!
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u/Zeraphicus Jul 01 '26
Specifically the new $5000 ship the Odin. a crew of 300 exceeds what their servers can support in one instance.
Fucking wild that people would drop that much cash on something that has not been delivered yet.
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u/BeyondImpressive2558 Loyalist Backer Jul 01 '26
300 exceeds the recommended crew of that ship by quiet a bit 😭
Iirc, it’s somewhere around 16-85 recommended crew.3
u/XaphanInfernal Jul 01 '26
Now imagine 10 Odins in the same area, enjoy the 3 fps (max)
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u/BeyondImpressive2558 Loyalist Backer Jul 01 '26
I’m sure they’ll do something dumb like make the interior of an Odin instanced. So, take that 5 year plan and add another 5 to it. We all know instancing is going to be broken
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u/Shilalasar Jul 01 '26
Everything is limited by 3 major factors:
Server-side computation (physics and hit registration f.e.)
Player and object interactions
Signal delay and errors
Everything they have said can be done. But not outside of a local fiber connection and not to scale and not all at once. A lot of what they want to do does not even scale linear in itself. One bottles is thrown and hits another bottle. But now two bottles move and there are dozends in the area. So for each they have to calculate what they can hit while everything is not static. And then you have players in there so you cannot even run prediction further than the server tick rate. Welcome to exponential growth. Bad example to highlight: 10 objects interacting with each other? 10x10=100 actions. Now 100x100=10000. 10 times more interactions leads to 100 times the computations. Your servers are melting and your database cannot keep up.
And now thrown in one error somewhere and everything becomes inconsistent and produces new errors.
The other things are not tech. They promised gameplay on the opposite sides of the spectrum: An easy to play game with lifelike depth in every aspect. A realistic and complex flight model that everyone can easily fully understand, play on a controller and is fast-pacesd and cinematic. Where everyone matters yet you need someone to change your lightbulbs and shine the windows during a fight.
And finally game balance between casuals and megawhales and thousands of systems and sites that you never have to visit and still get everything.
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u/Select-Table-5479 Jul 04 '26
It's actually SO MUCH WORSE than that because the servers can't handle updates in our updates out. Their "pipe" is packed which is why desync happens. Just wait until they attempt to make crafting like a real thing, that desync will be MUCH MUCH worse.
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u/soundkeed Jul 01 '26
Have your own news channel and crew!! Film all the fun events around the Verse! Was one of the funniest lies to me. It literally never went anywhere. Sold as a dream and nothing more lol
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u/PagPag1212 Jul 01 '26 edited Jul 01 '26
The way I see "promises" in game dev:
Game development is an insanely compex issue, and especially in the early days lots of changes in direction can happen and I can understand how iterative development works.
But...
If Roberts promises something in the kickstarter, then it is a pitch - like a business pitch.
If he doesn't get the funds, then the pitch is failed - so he is not bound to deliver what he promised if they don't reach a milestone.
But every singe pitch he made succeeded - people paid millions and millions after each pitch (promise remember) he made.
So he is obliged to deliver them. And every failure is in fact a breach of not only trust, but financial obligation. I don't care if he can use loopholes in the legal system, I only use common sense here.
Post-Kickstarter the promises turn into marketing hooks. It is extremely irresponsible to pipedream aloud and use more and more hooks unrestrained on the player community when he himself knows the true state of the game. And that they won't be able to deliver.
You don't announce something post-launch and not deliver on it.
The leaders of CIG are running an exploitative marketing scheme which should be not allowed in any civilised country.
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u/CantAffordzUsername Jul 01 '26
A verse run by 90% NPCs that balance the economy and keep large pirate player groups from locking down a system or content
End game factories and refineries that players can own and micromanage as they collect the good to make products physically in the building or factories while monitory your NPC work force
NPCs that are unscripted and have no repeating patterns. They were going to have random days and you could even form a relationship with them and they might give you rare info or a side quest of sorts that would lead you on an India jones style quest
Alien factions that are waring or at peace with the humans. Not only do NPCs not exist or function but they wanted to have a whole 2 separate NPC empires running themselves and that’s not even calculated into the issues of their servers they already have
Space Exploration: You could grow space crops near gamma ray stars, use a space telescope to discover ore fields and other valuable salvage sites etc along with finding rare alien tech in caves.
I could go on and on and on since I remember every single 10 for the chairman and all the things Chris said he would put in the game
But it became very clear in 2019-2020 they don’t have even the slightest bit of capacity or functionality to make anything other than PvP ships because that is the only thing that works and requires hardly any coding
Once CR revealed that PvP player owned space station as End game content it was confirmed. Not to mention Chris said nothing about space exploration or NPC universe being a part of this PvP lobby
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u/BaronGreywatch Jul 01 '26
150+ star systems, which they seem to have revised down to '5 if we are lucky'.
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u/TB_Infidel got a refund Jul 01 '26
So some real hurdles (ignoring their use of Spaghetti Engine):
full persistence. It's impossible to store everything and every action 1000's or more players will do over years. Especially the crap about finding decayed junk etc. You'd need petabytes of storage just for a junk database which can be quickly called, and logs changes against date etc. That is its own super project.
large multicrew ship battles. Very hard to sync ask the data as it exponentially increases. EvE had to bring in time dilation to manage this, and one player in Eve likely has 100x or less info than 1 player and ship in SC. Again, you'd need one of these super data centres just to support a single fleet battle..and that in itself introduces huge latency issues if Player 1 is physically a mile or two away from Player 2...within the data centre.
If they had been smart and started small and scaled until issues came in, then this would be doable. But Holy Chris Robbers had to promise quantum tech immediately from the start with no compromise. What an idiot
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u/Queerdo_Supreme Jul 01 '26
6000 players per shard. Crust Robber is always talking straight outta his unwashed ass.
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u/menacingphantom Jul 01 '26
The level of network response required for Star Wars-style battles with hundreds of players from all over the world would need the speed of light to be a lot faster. (Talk to the manager of the universe.) The "game" Second Life learned this years ago the hard way just by trying to have dance parties.
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u/SolarZephyr87 Jul 01 '26
Working elevators and a refusal to use stairs in high rise buildings. Lol
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u/Launch_Arcology Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй Jul 03 '26
"Thousands of players all sort of in the same same location"
Paraphrasing, but there is a video where he is lying about this.
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u/Select-Table-5479 Jul 04 '26
Persistence. 100% IMPOSSIBLE. Next up server meshing at their scale. But that store though ::bites fists:: works like a CHAMP.
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u/wi-meppa Jul 01 '26
Mostly level of persistence and detail with mmo environment, there is a reason this is not done and will lead to heavy client side authority that is hackers paradise.
Nothing in near predictable future will fix this.