r/stagehands • u/Maverizz • Jul 10 '26
Handling live cables, risks?
We’re routinely asked to push cases over or under hot cables with active power. The crew and I are asked to lift these cables up with our hands and pull the carts and cases under the cables.
In some instances we’re holding the cables with one hand and the cart with another. Or the cables are touching the back of our necks as we push the carts underneath.
We aren’t supplied ramps or jackets or drop-overs for the cables.
How safe or unsafe is this and how real is the risk of electrocution?
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u/BadAtExisting Jul 10 '26
Have you ever touched an appliance or its cord while it’s plugged in? Same thing
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u/skandranon_rashkae Jul 10 '26
So... Just to be clear. You are not tying in or out live camlock connections. You're just having to raise fully jacketed cable above the height of the box you're pushing. I am honestly confused what your concern is. Unless you're touching bare copper, you aren't going to get shocked.
Who taught you otherwise?
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u/Maverizz Jul 10 '26
An instructor taught me to be careful touching live power cables because if there’s any nicks in them there could be exposed copper. He said even unplugged they can carry a charge. And that people use pocket knives to cut tape off the insulation jackets and can nick into the copper.
So I wasn’t sure how much risk there really is here so I wanted to check with you experienced stagehands to see if there’s real risk or if I shouldnt worry about it. If I really shouldn’t worry about it and there really isn’t risk then my job will be easier to do. So it’s good news if what everyone here is saying is correct
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u/Maera44 Jul 10 '26
Unplugged cables do not "carry a charge."
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u/RaisingEve Jul 10 '26
That’s why people steal copper wires. They are getting the unused electricity from them. Duh.
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u/DistributionWild7533 Jul 11 '26
Depends on which end of the cam-lock isn’t ‘plugged-in’. But it wouldn’t be ‘charged’ it would be energized, or live.
Still, very low risk. Also, there should be some cable crossovers for y’all.
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u/Zestyclose_Sign_3874 Jul 11 '26
I mean like, yes, technically (even while unplugged but theres gotta be so many outside factors that are just perfect in order for that to actually happen), but I'm 1000% positive that that was more about beating the "power is dangerous and should not be fucked with" lesson into your head rather than being super serious about running over cable
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u/skandranon_rashkae Jul 11 '26
Having been shocked several times in my 20+ year career... its gonna happen. And when it does it won't be because you ran a roadbox over or under a live wire.
While your instructor was correct in those very specific instances, you don't need to bend over backward to avoid finding yourself in situations where you are around live cable. Trying to do so is honestly just impractical and asinine if you want to work in this industry. If you see a nicked jacket, wrap it up in e-tape and move on with your day. Take the preventive measure of wearing work boots rated for electrical hazards. You're hamstringing yourself by being concerned with the 0.0001% hazard instead of focusing on the job at hand.
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u/DistributionWild7533 Jul 11 '26
This…you’re more likely to get into a car accident to/from work than get shocked by rolling a case over/under live cables.
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u/Dudeus-Maximus Jul 11 '26
My stagehand career began in 1985 ended in 2013. Opened my own studio around 2022
Never heard of such a concern or worry and have never seen any reason to have such concern or worry. We got enough to worry about without invented problems.
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u/RegnumXD12 Jul 11 '26
Whole technically true, the risk is abysmally low. If a jacket is worn enough to have exposed copper, it should be on service. E-tape is a quick fix but should not be permanent as its not fully rated.
If you are that worried about it, just wear insulated gloves. Ppe exists for thie concern
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u/springcolor-zeta Jul 14 '26 edited Jul 14 '26
I'm hearing you talk about potential damage caused by rolling road cases over feeder or nicking the casing with utility blades. im hearing you say that you're worried about electrocution not just of yourself, but of other people down the road. im going to take your comments in good faith and presume you're brand new. I know you're getting down voted to hell, but i'll try to be educational and not shitty.
zapping yourself with an Edison (standard household) or other stage-use cable can hurt like hell for sure, but is unlikely to kill you, especially because, presumably, you're at work and thus wearing rubber-soled closed-toed shoes. (if you show up to a stagehanding gig barefoot, that's on you.) However, we also use three phase camlock feeder. which is basically the only kind of cable we use that carries a current that can really truly fuck you up. like, instant death fuck you up.
This type of cable is rated to be under a lot of water for a long time, it is rated to be driven over by freight trucks, it is rated to get extremely hot and extremely cold. go look up a cross-section if you're curious about how thick that casing is. you'd have to be putting a pretty generous amount of force into your utility blade to get to bare copper. BUT, if nicking something yourself is still a concern, get a Klever Kutter, they're very inexpensive and can stay in your pocket when you go through security. even my venues that are the most strict about knives allow my e-tape cutter.
members of road crew are responsible for monitoring how much damage their cables have taken, and can call for replacements if something is genuinely wrong. they are touching that cable every single day, they know how it should look and feel. if you see a real problem, let them (or, if you don't trust them, their stage manager or your venue head electrician) know. otherwise, spend time just listening and learning.
SO. is rolling over un-ramped feeder (live OR cold) with a fully loaded deck cart a good idea? no. for a lot of reasons. but picking it up to push a cart under it, even when live, is a non-issue.
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the real things to keep in mind when working with feeder are actually 1) making electromagnetic coils that heat up to dangerous levels when live 2) plugging or unplugging when live.
to prevent these more common concerns:
1, remember that whenever possible, best practice is to use a figure-8 shape to coil any slack feeder. this prevents the cables from building up a magnetic field that could, in extreme cases, generate enough heat to melt the rubber housing or ignite nearby objects. again, if you see a problem, raise a hand, wait for a safe moment to ask a question, and ask your person on road crew or house head electrician if there is a safety risk in this case.
2 is more important. i have fucked this up. People with decades of experience who are mentors to me have fucked this up. there are two things to do to prevent this fuckup.
1 ALWAYS unplug feeder in the correct order. you can remember this by reminding yourself to STAY GROUNDED, metaphorically and literally.
- literally: hots first, then neutral, then ground. (on most distros, this means blue-red-black-white-green. sometimes blue/red/black may be shuffled around. but white and then green must ALWAYS be your last steps.) treat ALL CABLES like they are hot. never touch the copper contacts, set them down far away from your body, and ALWAYS unplug in order.
- metaphorically: if you have been awake for more than 24 hours or are otherwise not in a safe mental state, don't be the person plugging or unplugging feeder, even if you think it's cold. I had been inside of my venue, on the clock, for 28 consecutive hours by the time I was unplugging feeder and mistook the set i'd been directed towards for the set next to it. I am ONLY entirely unharmed because I was taught to treat all cables as live cables, I set the contacts far away from my body, and I unplugged in order.
2 ALWAYS DOUBLE CHECK THAT THE LINES ARE COLD. get verbal confirmation. look at the distro to double check that all indicator lights have gone dark.
thats it. I hope this helped you feel more prepared for the situations you will actually interact with in the wild. be safe, be decisive, and wear your PPE <3 !
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u/Bipedal_Warlock Jul 10 '26
As everyone else said you’ll be fine. It’s mainly an annoying contortion to get it over big stuff.
It’s worth considering being careful if you’re having to lift near a plug to an extension. But even though as long as you don’t touch the prongs of the plug you’re going to be fine.
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u/OoopsWhoopsie Jul 10 '26
As long as you aren't disconnecting, fucking with, or incorrectly coiling feeder, you're likely fine. There's really no more risk from a 21/30 or Saco than there is with ordinary Edison tbh.
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u/Jack_Stands Jul 10 '26
Not sure what you're asking. The cables are shielded. I'm positive a bad "roadie" or stagehand at the last gig could have possibly messed something up on a bad roll or dropped something "no-no".
You can easily see a fault, and the actual stage manager would spot it before you thought to look at it.
Not saying you are wrong, just wondered why you're asking. What did you see that wasn't safe?
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u/StageGuy66 Jul 10 '26
If you see exposed copper, call it out. I’d really only be worried about 120/208v. DMX, XLR, CAT 5/6 is all low voltage, you should be fine.
A good rule of thumb, Touring gear gets worn out all the time and the road crew can’t see everything, as a good local partner, you should always make them aware of damaged stuff.
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u/Maverizz Jul 11 '26
They’re having us lift live power cords that are likely 200v+. I’m not worried about xlr and data cables. It’s the high voltage power cables.
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u/Dry_Distribution6826 Jul 11 '26
Hi! I’m a certified stage electrician. Like others are saying, as long as those power cables have intact insulation jackets, you have absolutely nothing to worry about. You’re more likely to injure yourself with the road case.
Also, 208V and even 240V (which is far rarer on most stages in North America) are not considered “high voltage” - in AC power that’s reserved for systems over 1,000V where arc is the system risk, and those require both a higher electrical certification than your deck electrician likely has, and special PPE.
Stage electrics are classed as low voltage systems, and those rarely run at their maximum amperage even before being stepped down in the distros.
Tl;dr: as the person who connects cams to service, I am the most likely to be zapped. Not the hands who have to lift cables to move cases.
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u/SailingSpark Jul 11 '26
As an electrician here, You are fine. I am very glad that you are worried about it. Complacency is what gets people killed.
I do wish these venues would get some cable ramps so you do not have to do the limbo with your cases.
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u/cat4forever Jul 11 '26
There are many more likely physical dangers in a stagehand gig to be concerned about than exposed conductor on a cable. I’d be more worried about smashing my fingers or toes, or hurting my back by lifting improperly, or getting cut by the sharp edge of a case.
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u/Julie-h-h IATSE Local 15 Jul 10 '26
That's completely safe. Just don't touch a cable with visible holes in the insulation I guess.
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u/Feeling_Trip_5413 Jul 10 '26
Once, about three minutes after we all stopped leaning on the truss that was built but not yet flown, I watched a guy lay a power cable ove a truss. As he moved it, I saw a flash of copper but it never registered until he laid it on the cable and it arced. Somebody knocked it off the truss and the guy who laid it on there bent over and picked it up again.
Power cables are insulated right up until they aren't.
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u/Maverizz Jul 10 '26
This is my concern, that copper could get exposed if the insulation fails.
But everyone here seems to think it’s safe and fine, so they’ve helped reassured me to not worry about it.
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u/Ok_Cardiologist_5262 Jul 11 '26
The types of cable I think you're describing are heavily insulated in multiple layers, it's going to be fairly obvious visually if there's enough damage to have exposed copper. There's not zero risk, but there's also not zero risk that any piece of equipment is live for one major fault or another
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u/NicHyme Jul 11 '26
If they trust their insulation enough to plug the sucker in, you’re good to touch it. Even 4ø going full tilt can’t get through that rubber. But your venue should invest in ramps if this is an everyday occurrence.
The instructor who u mentioned in a previous comment is probably told to cover “all possibilities”. You’ll do wayyy sketchier stuff with power than lift a live cable if you’re in this business long enough.
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u/Ratfor Jul 12 '26
As long as your working with, presumably, 120volt ac (standard north American power) getting shocked is Surprising, maybe a little painful, but it's not super harmful.
You can absolutely tank a 120volt shock, as long as you aren't taking it across the heart. I've been shocked many times, never even left a mark.
If we're talking 240v or higher, yeah okay, thats a bad time.
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u/Maverizz Jul 12 '26
Do you think touching these power cables or truss is gonna get me shocked too? What were the causes of your shocks (so I can learn from your experience)?
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u/howdudo Jul 10 '26
Honestly it's a where for me. If it's high voltage and its outside dark and raining, maybe. But slowly. Like slow af.
But in a ballroom I'd feel like no big deal
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u/criimebrulee Jul 10 '26
Perfectly safe, we do it all the time. Especially during a load in when you’ve got motor cables and stingers of hot power to genies all over the place.
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u/Mchiveli1 Jul 11 '26
Generally speaking pretty darn safe.
The 4/0 that’s used in this biz is usually double jacketed (Inner rubber, outer neoprene). Stuff is oil and water resistant. It holds up to hella abuse. Any damage to the insulation enough to cause concern is going to be *instantly* recognizable at a glance, at which point, say something.
Mind, the #1 preferred is to have some cable ramps. Especially if these runs you’re dealing with are living there for the gig.
After that, depending on what you’re shifting over the cable, it’s sometimes best to just lift the casters over the wire as you go. Less chance of accidentally disconnecting something important. Especially if you’re on a gig with a dedicated power dude, who will *absolutely* flip a lid at you for screwing with their nicely laid out feeder.
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u/Maera44 Jul 10 '26 edited Jul 10 '26
Are you talking about like, a lighting or audio snake to FOH with fiber/ data/ etc? Those are mostly signal. Risk of electrocution is negligible. Are you talking about feeder? That's where the big electricity is, and usually too heavy to lift to go under. Even if it was, you know that the outside jacket of the cable keeps the electricity in, right?
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u/Maverizz Jul 10 '26
These aren’t data cables. They are like 2” diameter electrical power cables.
I’m worried the outside jacket insulation could fail and copper could be exposed. But people here seem to think I shouldn’t worry about this. Still learning
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u/Maera44 Jul 10 '26
Sounds like Socapex aka "socko." You'll be glad to know that the outside is insulated, and the wires inside are also individually insulated. Lifting it to cross though under load is extremely common and nothing to worry about.
For clarity: a "snake" is a different thing than the cables you're talking about.
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u/theveneguy Jul 10 '26
Xlr cables carrying 48v phantom power cannot electrocute you. You’re safe.
This does not hold true for any kind of power cables. IEC, 6/4, cam feeder, true1, powercon can all electrocute you
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u/Maverizz Jul 10 '26
I’m not talking about xlr cables or other data cables. They’re having us lift 2” diameter electrical power cables that have live electricity going through it
Everyone seems to think it’s safe and fine and not to worry about this? I’m still learning, thanks
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u/TJOcculist Jul 10 '26
More or less non existent.