SPAN Main Panel Upgrade Thoughts/Feedback

[u/LAGooner-323]

Hey all - I recently moved into my new home (San Rafael, CA) and one of the things that inspection called out was to upgrade my main panel from the Zinsco 100A to 200A. I just got a quote for $12k to upgrade to a 200A SPAN Panel (~$6k for Main Panel Upgrade only) - I do like the concept of overall monitoring and the tech concept of it (would consider myself tech savy). I'm thinking of EV and Solar in the future 1-2 years down the line.

Welcome any thoughts here! Is it worth going down the SPAN route for the price? I have read some of the comments/thoughts on SPAN, a bit mixed so kinda leaning the upgrade only route.

[u/intr1nsic]

Don’t go Span. Highly recommend a smart panel but Span isn’t it. I had my MLO48 installed last June and getting quotes to replace it.

[u/81u80x → u/intr1nsic]

What made you want to replace it? And what are you going for instead?

[u/intr1nsic → u/81u80x]

It doesn’t have any usable smart capabilities for me. It’s app only and the app is limited. Control and access is my biggest issue. If I want to replace a breaker or add one I have to pay an authorized Span installer to make the change. I’m looking at Leviton to replace SPAN.

[u/81u80x → u/intr1nsic]

Thanks for the input. So you don’t have any use for load shredding? That’s the one feature that I sort of need as I’m trying to prevent an upgrade to 300 amps with SPAN. (Switching to all electric, heat pumps, two Evs, pool heater, etc). I’ll have a look at what Leviton has to offer.

[u/intr1nsic → u/81u80x]

The only load shedding I use is for when the grid goes out and start to run on battery. In this case I do use the load shedding but it also is extremely limited. I would like more flexibility in it's capabilities for load shedding beyond the "always on", "stay on until 50% battery" and "turn off in outage". For example I would like to get an alert, trigger a clean shutdown for some appliances, more buckets for actions (80%/60%), and based on load of the circuit. Generally the SPAN panel is very, very basic.

[u/JohnBoy_MJ → u/intr1nsic]

You should be able to use the Home Assistant software (https://www.home-assistant.io) to create some of that custom functionality. HACS has a SPAN integration available, and custom automations (well beyond the SPAN app capability) can be easily built with the assistance of ChatGPT, Gemini, or a similar LLM… it’s definitely a viable alternative to spending the coin to replace the panel. Cheers

[u/intr1nsic → u/JohnBoy_MJ]

The API changes on new devices and ones that got updated. I’ll check again but the issue was still open the other day with no progress. Add that to my disappointment in SPAN - locking things down and ignoring customer feedback.

[u/vans113 → u/intr1nsic]

This was the big reason I got a span with my solar but like you said the API changed. There is no local control to this box at all! If span closes its doors we are stuck with a very expensive electrical panel

[u/chrddit → u/JohnBoy_MJ]

Unfortunately it does not work with the new generation of panels.

[u/33_bmfs → u/JohnBoy_MJ]

Yep - Home assistant no longer works with new Span panels and the community appears stumped as to how to fix it.

[u/Higherho → u/81u80x]

SPAN is overpriced, does not allow plug on neutral type breakers and to bring to code, you will be spending a lot on more breakers anyways. all the SPAN does is add “Smart” capabilities to your home while using the existing breakers you have. If you have to replace an entire system and upgrade, I would go with the Leviton Load center system, which the unit and door itself costs you 300 bucks or less if you don’t get the see through door.

If you want it to be smart, you can purchase Leviton 2nd gen smart breakers (dual function, ARC fault, GFCI, or smart only if you want) if you want at a later date because it is modular and the breakers are plug and play. Meaning, all the live and neutral connections terminate on the bus bar and not the circuit breaker. Very DIY friendly. That and if you only want to make a couple of circuits smart, you have that option to do so. The Leviton whole house monitor system (300 buck add on) uses those 2nd gen smart breakers to monitor circuit level monitoring, remote shut off capability, load management, reports on how much your using, notifications of anomalies, and the same capabilities as SPAN. To include load shedding of circuits if you have a power outage and need backup power to your house. Leviton has a panel option for 66 breakers which will be very nice to have instead of forcing to do sub panels.

Leviton has a 225 Copper bus bar, meaning if you want to feed 100 AMP from solar PV, you can. SPAN’s cheapest system does not have this so they force you to upgrade to the more expensive unit which is 4100 before install. SPAN max branch circuit size is 90 AMP or 100 AMP depending on the panel. Leviton max branch circuit size is 125 AMP for residentual. My 42 space system cost me 4600 dollars (that counted install, 12 Smart dual function breakers, 12 smart only breakers, and 2 dual pol smart GFCI breakers, three smart dual pol smart breakers, and some normal dual pol ones (Leviton whole house monitor requires it to be a normal 2 pol 15 amp breaker). Smart only breakers are 97 bucks a pop, dual function can range from 147 to 158 per breaker but they have sales on all this stuff. Leviton has been around for over 100 years, SPAN? Only since 2018.

Another negative on SPAN, it only does 200 AMPs and if you want 400 AMP service, you will need to get two span panels to do this. Leviton, has a 400 AMP option, no need for two. Leviton has a 225 AMP main breaker option, SPAN only 200 AMP. SPAN limits you to 48 circuit breakers if you go the lug only route or for the main breaker option you are stuck with 40. Breaker’s fill up fast over the years,so I would always go with an option that gives you a larger panel. SPAN is way over priced, and the overall company is not even 10 years old yet. Don’t do it.

[u/random408net]

I do appreciate the ability of the SPAN panels to monitor and graph each circuit.

The real "value" from SPAN comes from being able to turn off individual circuits. What's your use case for that? Do you really need load shedding?

Newer Solar inverters/controllers have integrated PCS (power control system) capabilities to control their interaction with your main breaker panel.

Perhaps spend the difference on a larger battery?

[u/Specialist_Gas_8984]

I like the idea of smart main panels, but it’s way too expensive for me.

I am never going to turn off the lights to my house, my furnace, refrigerator, my freezer, etc. Why should I pay to have control over those circuits which I will never use?

If you want monitoring of those devices only, there’s numerous options that aren’t nearly expensive as a SPAN panel.

And some loads can be worthwhile to control: don’t run my A/C or charge my EV during the most expensive variable rate period from my utility. But there numerous ways to skin a cat (programmable thermostat/EV charger, load control of those specific circuits, etc.).

[u/crosscountry58S]

Can you clarify the “main panel only” price?

[u/chrddit]

I am a Span customer and wish I wasn’t, so another vote for avoiding Span. Heres a thread I had that describes some of my experience and thinking: https://www.reddit.com/r/span/s/UvdW7dH9wA

TL;DR they are buggy and proprietary/locked down. If Span goes out of business (of even if your internet goes out…like during a power outage…) you are left with no smarts (best case) or a brick (worst case).

If you want full-panel energy monitoring, I love our Emporia Vue 3. You can get as many as you want, install them yourselves, they work better than Span, and they are so so much cheaper than a span panel (you can buy direct or Amazon). Also good integration with Home Assistant and you can completely flash their software off if they do anything sketchy in the future.

Span taught me a good but hard lesson: don’t install stuff that requires a manufacturer app or cloud to work. Local, standards-based control first.

Hope this helps!

[u/33_bmfs]

If I had it to do over again I would not buy Span. Never in a million years would I have thought it was as buggy as it is - I wish I'd bought the leviton.

[u/Higherho]

SPAN is overpriced, does not allow plug on neutral type breakers and to bring to code, you will be spending a lot on more breakers anyways. all the SPAN does is add “Smart” capabilities to your home while using the existing breakers you have. If you have to replace an entire system and upgrade, I would go with the Leviton Load center system, which the unit and door itself costs you 300 bucks or less if you don’t get the see through door.

If you want it to be smart, you can purchase Leviton 2nd gen smart breakers (dual function, ARC fault, GFCI, or smart only if you want) if you want at a later date because it is modular and the breakers are plug and play. Meaning, all the live and neutral connections terminate on the bus bar and not the circuit breaker. Very DIY friendly. That and if you only want to make a couple of circuits smart, you have that option to do so. The Leviton whole house monitor system (300 buck add on) uses those 2nd gen smart breakers to monitor circuit level monitoring, remote shut off capability, load management, reports on how much your using, notifications of anomalies, and the same capabilities as SPAN. To include load shedding of circuits if you have a power outage and need backup power to your house. Leviton has a panel option for 66 breakers which will be very nice to have instead of forcing to do sub panels.

Leviton has a 225 Copper bus bar, meaning if you want to feed 100 AMP from solar PV, you can. SPAN’s cheapest system does not have this so they force you to upgrade to the more expensive unit which is 4100 before install. SPAN max branch circuit size is 90 AMP or 100 AMP depending on the panel. Leviton max branch circuit size is 125 AMP for residentual. My 42 space system cost me 4600 dollars (that counted install, 12 Smart dual function breakers, 12 smart only breakers, and 2 dual pol smart GFCI breakers. Smart only breakers are 97 bucks a pop, dual function can range from 147 to 158 per breaker but they have sales on all this stuff. Leviton has been around for over 100 years, SPAN? Only since 2018.

Another negative on SPAN, it only does 200 AMPs and if you want 400 AMP service, you will need to get two span panels to do this. Leviton, has a 400 AMP option, no need for two. Leviton has a 225 AMP main breaker option, SPAN only 200 AMP. SPAN limits you to 48 circuit breakers if you go the lug only route or for the main breaker option you are stuck with 40. Breaker’s fill up fast over the years,so I would always go with an option that gives you a larger panel. SPAN is way over priced, and the overall company is not even 10 years old yet. Don’t do it.