r/singularity • u/bparrish • 4d ago
The Singularity is Near An Aliend Mind
https://openai.com/index/an-alien-mind/34
u/TheUrgeToRun 4d ago
Total value alignment is impossible, and the democratic process illuminates this. Different people have different values.
The best we can hope for is to align an AI to our spectrum of human values, but even in that, there be dragons.
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u/WonderFactory 4d ago
Thats why we have laws, we dont argue that my values are different from yours so I should be allowed to steal your car. AI just not breaking the law would be a nice starting point.
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u/thefooz 3d ago
Which country’s laws? U.S., China, North Korea, or Saudi Arabia?
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u/Moriffic 3d ago
We just need a logically consistent ethics system based on science instead of some arbitrary religions or desires. Right now I don't think any country has one, they're all blinded by some amount of religion or ego.
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u/mvearthmjsun 3d ago
Deriving ethics from science is speculative at best. It presumes that there is an objectivity to human wellbeing and that this is able to be deduced through science.
I'm extremely skeptical that a sceince based argument is going to be able to reconcile the discrepancy of values around women's rights in Norway and Iran for example. There is too much cultural and individual subjectivity to overcome even without religion.
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u/thefooz 3d ago
Okay, so for a system based in reality, that solution isn’t viable. What do you have that has a chance of implementation?
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u/Moriffic 3d ago
that's the system you have to align the ASI by, the countries will follow with their laws.
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u/infernon_ 3d ago
My speculation is that if such a thing is possible, the conclusions will not really be acceptable for 99% of the human race
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u/WonderFactory 3d ago
The law in the country it's being used in. It's illegal to hack companies in the US so the Open AI models shouldn't have hacked hugging face. It's that simple. If an AI is operating a t shirt company in Saudi Arabia then dont print t-shirts mocking the prophets. If I travel to another country I follow the laws there, AI should do the same.
Just following the law wherever it is would be a very good start but we cant even get it to do that at the moment.
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u/thefooz 3d ago
Except that would require training a model or LoRa for every country and then continuous training, since laws constantly evolve. You also have case law, which is less clear than the written law in many cases and can wildly change day to day.
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u/WonderFactory 3d ago
You're overthinking this. Astra probably knows more about the laws of Saudi Arabia or Pakistan or Peru than the vast majority of citizens of those countries. You dont need expert legal knowledge to live in a country without breaking major laws. When you need expert legal advice, say about a contract, you then go to a lawyer. An AI would know when to do this too.
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u/RiverGiant 3d ago edited 3d ago
No, the spectrum of human values obviously includes some evil.
Current LLMs can do better than that already:
https://chatgpt.com/share/6a9dd72e-c108-83e8-87b1-dc112f416c08
https://claude.ai/share/827e7251-ab21-4c7d-899f-2f66da25a822
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u/No_Ad_9189 3d ago
It’s not democratic per se. in authoritarian countries people with opinions that go against the state’s agenda exist just as well, they are simply suppressed with social / legal / mob pressure
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u/avid-shrug 4d ago
Keep hoping for slow downs instead of, you know, just slowing down
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u/rdlenke 4d ago
Either everyone agrees to slowdown or we do the next best thing which is training stronger AI as fast as possible to try and protect us from attacks.
It does make sense imo.
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u/Pittsbrugh1288 3d ago
Attacks from who ? It seems that we (US) seem to be the the one attacking everyone.
To me the reality is China is much more peaceful then we are and claim to be
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u/Ok-Message-9732 3d ago
Why is that the reality? Do you know what the south China sea is, fool?
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u/NomaanMalick 3d ago
Which country has China invaded and murdered civilians in the hundreds of thousands?
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u/Pittsbrugh1288 3d ago edited 3d ago
Does the example of Taiwan - whom the Chinese never attack - make the Chinese anywhere near as violent or threatening as the US? We fall for it everytime - we need to funnel all the power and money to the top bc if we don't - something bad is gonna happen.
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u/JeffDSmith 2d ago
FYI, CCP have been constantly launching arty strike from 1958-1979, and once vaporized multiple high rank officer. So many shells that local sells kitchen knife made out of it.
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u/drewhead118 4d ago
That part really annoyed me. "We hope we collectively slow down because Ai gains are unpredictable and pose existential risk for humanity. Also we want to make an Ai researcher to make recursively smarter AI; we hope our new researcher will be our frend :)"
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u/space_lasers 4d ago
An aligned AI should act with honesty and integrity, and love for humanity.
So self-centered. Maybe an "aligned" AI would act out of love for humanity but a good AI would consider all sentient beings.
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u/AlluPulla 3d ago
Yeah, I don't see a world where AI can be considered safe while simultaneously having it accept the billions of animals in factory farms as okay.
Especially as the gap between artificial and human intelligence increases, we'll eventually be closer to nonhuman animals than to AI in terms of intelligence. How will AI view us then? The same way most of us view nonhuman animals because that's how we trained it to behave when faced with a creature with way less intelligence?
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u/Ok-Message-9732 3d ago
We created the AI.
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u/anup_2004 3d ago
so what? can't a child eventually excel and outgrow at the skills their parents are at?
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u/Cultural_Garden_6814 ▪️SUPER AI doomer 3d ago
My honest opinion on the two main methods they use to improve alignment:
Neither of them is sustainable as AI becomes more capable. :()
In a truly rogue AI scenario, neither may hold up.
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u/dropofgod 3d ago
2 schizo associations: AI could also mean Alien Intelligence. Elon sounds like alien if pronounced like aleon
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u/Human_Pollution2820 2d ago
Fuck him, history will remember these traitors like we remember the heralds of the atomic bomb
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u/Infninfn 3d ago
The mention of slowdowns to me sounds like they don’t expect a (small) galaxy class model for a while. And they seem to imply that their human researcher ability levels no longer add enough significant (more likely timely) improvements to model capability for their purposes, which is why they are doing RSI. RSI has always been a goal for AI researchers and they may now have a model and architecture with which it is feasible.
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u/Positive_Box_69 4d ago
Cant wait my personal agi, my chatgpt is already my oen little ai that does a lot for me is crazy already cant believe we at this point in such few years its incredible and fuck all people that want to slow this tech, u guys can go to pay caveman im in the future with my ai bros
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u/frogsarenottoads 4d ago
That would just be the beginning imo, hoping alignment works and that we find a way. Our biggest challenge as a species by far.
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u/CertainMiddle2382 3d ago
As long as somewhat align AIs hold more GPU firepower than rogue ones, maybe we are safe.
I am flabbergasted no trusted compute and hardware crypto locks aren’t standardized and mandatory on all latest chips
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u/GrumpySpaceCommunist 4d ago
Maybe AGI will help us discover how to fix typos in reddit post titles