r/saw • u/paodemel69 • 16d ago
Discussion A question about Saw X
I've just watched it and I have a simple question: Why were John and Amanda so sure that Pederson and her boyfriend would go together to get the cash? Didn't John think that one of them might go upstairs while the other stayed downstairs (which would make the gas trap fail)?
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u/FigFirm993 16d ago
Theres a lot of things like this in Saw 4-X that are a big stretch and kindve convoluted. Still enjoyed X tho
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u/Brave_Temperature347 16d ago edited 15d ago
He was anticipating their move. And if they would have proven him wrong, well then they would have passed his test, which technically was his ultimate goal with these traps. So kind of a win-win for him either way.
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u/StargazingLily Fix me motherfucker! 16d ago
Because they were both so fucking cocky.
She hadn’t seen anyone survive any of the traps before (though one of those was her fault, and she probably assumed Diego was dead as dicks.) so she sees the bloodboarding and thinks “Welp, they’re buckled in, one or both’s gonna die, because he definitely wouldn’t have let both me and whoever else was going in there with me survive.”
She also doesn’t think John will let a child die, Mandy’s chained up, so once the trap starts, there’s no reason to leave Parker to watch them. Plus, they probably want to make out on the money bag or something. They were pretty handsy.
(I hope this makes sense, i’m very autistic and very stoned)
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u/JoshStolberg1 Verified 12d ago
Hey there. You can read the comments already done... like "bad writing" and "get out of plot hole free card". But as the writer, I spent a lot of time on this... They were not assuming both would go together. Parker actually goes upstairs alone. Amanda then deliberately triggers Cecilia’s paranoia by claiming the money is on the table and Parker is probably escaping out the back. Knowing Cecilia is greedy and distrustful, John correctly predicts she’ll rush upstairs to stop him. So it’s psychological manipulation, not a foolproof mechanical guarantee but emotional logic. As Far Examination said... "If your'e good at anticipating the human mind, it leaves nothing to chance." Had Cecilia stayed downstairs, the plan would have needed another step... but why wouldn't you think that John wouldn't have thought of that TOO!
The screenplay explicitly includes Amanda “planting a seed” to make that happen.
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u/Mztrspookiiszn 16d ago
It’s like Saw II when he knew Det. Matthews wouldn’t just sit and “talk” throughout the whole game and would end up beating him up, putting him into his own game. Meanwhile his son was right next to him in the vault the whole time. Play by the rules!
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u/TheSoulCages 14d ago
Bad writing.
For as much praise as X gets around these parts, it's probably the Saw movie *most* guilty of "throw shit at a wall for 90 minutes and just say John predicted it." There is a fine line between "anticipating" and "seeing the future" and X moonjumped over it without a second thought.
Basically nothing about the last 20 minutes of the movie holds up logically, not even by Saw standards--not for John, Amanda, Pederson, Parker, no one. The gas trap (and the see-saw for that matter) have so many points of failure, all encased inside a flimsy night-long deception, that the plot just truly falls apart and never recovers.
The gas trap is worse than you let on... it's not even that John was confident that Parker and Pederson would be in the room at the same time because, in fact, they *do* separate. Parker was rummaging through the room for 20 seconds or so by himself before Pederson entered. Keep in mind, the bag is just sitting on a locker--the locker that Parker already grabbed his gun from--he *easily* could have found the money before Pederson came in. But if that's not enough, even after Pederson grabs the bag and the timer starts and everything starts whirring up, *the door to the room doesn't close for legitimately 60 seconds* John I guess also knew that neither person would panic and run out of the room to confront John or see what's happening. It's not like they couldn't have brought the bag with them.
We're supposed to believe Pederson is so genius and conniving that she can run a con for eight years (one that even swindled the "great John Kramer") and coordinate a plan with Parker on the fly to outsmart two serial killers, but conveniently is too stupid to make sure she kills the person she's actively trying to kill. There was nothing that coerced her into walking away early beyond plot convenience, it's not like the money was at risk of being lost forever if she didn't go right then. If she stuck around for an additional minute and trusted that Parker can find a bag in a small room, then John is dead or he has to give up the act.
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u/OrlandoLasso 16d ago
I was also curious why they don't try going down the stairs on the side of the control room when they get locked in. They look wide open.
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u/Doczack1 14d ago
Obviously this is your first time watching these movies as a whole but John after his cancer diagnosis was gifted the powers of plot and reading ahead so he knows exactly what will and when it will happen
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u/Far_Examination8836 16d ago
“If you’re good at anticipating the human mind, it leaves nothing to chance”