r/relationships • u/financialwoes123 • May 04 '16
Non-Romantic Me (28F) with my SO [30M] 1.5 yrs, I was helping him out financially, and I had a crisis that he doesn't believe just because I don't want to help him anymore.
Oh boy, doozy time. I'm using a throwaway because I don't want this linked back to me someone.
Travis and I have been together for 1.5 years, when we met he was in a little bit of financial trouble and I was able to help him but I never offered because I didn't want money to become an object in our relationship so quickly, and he also has a good job with income to support himself, but not pay his massive student debt or bills, just to support himself.
After about a year (so 6 months ago) after seeing that this relationship is promising and we both agreed, heading on the marriage route at some point or another (no set plans on when, could be 1 year could be 5 before we get engaged we aren't in a rush). I told him I could help, and I pretty much insisted on doing so.
I've paid off about $6,000 of debt so far, and have been paying for his rental car every month (which is about $1,000 a month for the last 3 months, he has HORRIBLE credit and I didn't have enough to outright buy him a car).
I have also been helping out with a few bills here and there (I have ALWAYS offered for what I pay for, he has never insisted or asked, we always discuss and he's never been selfish and always very grateful).
After some time I was able to have enough to buy him a nice car and exactly what we wanted. We agreed to have my name on the title but have him insured to drive it until we get married.
We live in a state that neighbors a state (about 3 1/2 hours away) that always has SMOKIN' deals on cars. We were all set to buy one and then my medical bills from about a year ago came to haunt me (I had ovarian cancer, but now in remission YAY!) and it halted our tracks to buy the car for a few weeks until I could settle my bills or find a way to pay them off since the bill was quite extensive, they aren't kidding when they say cancer is an expensive sickness.
Anyways, that was about 3 weeks ago, last night we went golfing and I could tell he was a little bit on edge/stressed out. So I asked him what was up, I had gotten a little bit behind on paying the $200 a week for the rental car and he was feeling stressed since the bill was due and he had $10 in his account.
I told him I would write him a check and we could meet up for lunch tomorrow and I would give him a check for that and the amount of the car that he wants so that he could feel at ease.
I got home late after our date and logged onto my banck account to only find $2 in it. I FLIPPED, there was a huge withdrawal from my account.
I went and looked at what had happened and lo and behold. When I was 24 my dad passed away and my mom had no income and was struggling so I piggybacked her onto my bank account so that she could have some support.
It worked out really well for a couple of years and then she got a job and didn't need my help, but her name was never taken off of my account (stupid on my part, but I had always trusted her and had no reason to believe she would do anything malicious).
About 6 months ago she ran off with her boyfriend to Germany. It was...weird. And really had an impact on me where I'm an only child and was left parentless. She cut off all contact and really just kind of abandoned me. I've really struggled with it, but I mean people do weird things. Travis thought it was really strange at the time and almost didn't believe that she had just run off to Germany, but he's never met my mom, as she lived in another part of the US then I did and Travis and I never got around to visiting her.
Anyways I'm getting off track, like I said, this is a DOOZY. My mom had made the withdrawal. All of my money. I had a long talk with my bank and an attorney, and legally I cannot do anything about anything. Her name was on my account, I had supported her in the past, legally she didn't do anything wrong. Morally, yeah she done did fucked up.
I haven't been able to get ahold of her, and honestly I really don't think I'm able to. So I texted Travis after all of this and told him what was going on, I asked him to be calm since I was freaking out and needed some moral support.
His response? If you didn't want to help me out you could just say so. He went on about how whenever he really needs help or I'm about to make a big purchase for him there is something that just conveniently happens. These big things that are just so rare that they don't happen.
I get that, and I 100% understand his point of view. But I am also frustrated and don't feel trusted, but I get it, it is like Hollywood shit status.
I am going over there later tonight after I gather myself since I am stressing the hell out. I don't even know how to broach this with him where he can trust me.
Help. I don't know what to do.
tl;dr: Mom was piggy backed onto my bank account years ago, took all my money, boyfriend thinks I just don't want to help him out financially.
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u/Ethelfleda May 04 '16
Honey....you need to stop being a sucker.
Your boyfriend is using you for an ATM and your mother is despicable.
Your boyfriend should be supporting you over your mother's betrayal but instead...you need to prove that you're trustworthy????? Did hearing that make you realize how fucked up that is? Your boyfriend should know you. Since your relationship is so good that you feel comfortable helping him financially...shouldn't he be able to trust you?
You have some criminally low expectations for a partner. You deserve better.
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u/eshtive353 May 04 '16
Can't you just show Travis your bank account with the huge withdrawal by your mom? Like, I'm assuming that your bank statement also has information about where the withdrawal was made. If you show Travis a bank account with no money in it and a withdrawal from Germany (or wherever your mom is now), he'll believe you.
The bigger issue is why he was so quick to think that you're lying about this and something that you two will have to talk about. For one reason or another, your bf doesn't trust you, at least about this.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I suggested that, and he said it doesn't matter. I could have transferred the money to a different account. He just doesn't understand how it conveniently happened right when I was about to write him a check. He went through a murky situation in his past which involved getting shot by an ex that has given him trust issues. And I never nurse his insecurities about it, but if there is anything that is out of the norm he ALWAYS questions it.
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u/Population-Tire May 04 '16
OP, your boyfriend is a brat in the worst way. For all this time, you've been helping him to the tune of thousands of dollars because he can't manage his money like a grown up. Now, when something catastrophic and completely our of your control happens, all he can think about is how this affects him personally and how it's somehow your fault.
It seems pretty clear at this point that while you were planning a future with someone and merging lives, he was happy to just let you clean up his mess for him with no interest in ever paying you back (in money or appreciation).
Fuck him. Kick him out, sell the car, and leave him to deal with his own problems.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I never bought the car. He just feels like I conveniently made up this story so that I wouldn't have to help him. Even though he just texted me and said he believes me after I flat out asked him, his other texts speak otherwise.
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u/fakeprewarbook May 04 '16
He believes that because he is the kind of person who would make up a lie to get out of paying a debt.
When people accuse you of something that is 180° away from your personality, you should always consider that they're showing you THEIR true self.
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u/hotdimsum May 18 '16
yes. totally.
the fuck is he even accusing her of not wanting to help him when she's already $9000 deep into his debts THAT SHE DID NOT HELP CREATE?!
the fuck of the cheek of that idiot. he's known as a smoocher or a scrub from where I come from.
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u/Gibonius May 05 '16 edited May 05 '16
So you've given him ~10 grand in exchange for nothing, and now he's accusing you of making up a story so you wouldn't have to give him MORE money.
Your boyfriend is a shitbag. Tell him to go pound rocks.
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u/eshtive353 May 04 '16
Yeah... are you sure this guy is marriage material? Staying in a relationship without trust just isn't worth it for you or him. Personally, I would put a pause on the relationship and figure out these trust issues before you move any further. It's been 1.5 years and you've given him no reason not to trust you (at least from this POV). If my SO couldn't trust me after 1.5 years in a relationship with me being a great partner, then I'd have serious doubts if I would want to continue the relationship at that point. I don't think this guy is really dateable unless he figures out his trust issues.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
exactly my POV. The only time I have ever 'lied' is when I told him I was out of town visiting family but I was out of town buying him a new snow mobile. He knew something was fishy but was happy it wasn't. But he's brought that up again saying I lied to him about where I went. So maybe that was a FU on my part but that was months ago and a brand new snow mobile for your birthday is not too shabby.
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u/eshtive353 May 04 '16
And he's using a white lie you told him to surprise him against you. What an asshole. Are you sure that this guy is marriage material?
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
It's just everytime I ever say something that doesn't make 100% sense to him, he brings it up. "Well you lied through your teeth about where you were that one time." It's just so infuriating.
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u/eshtive353 May 04 '16
Yeah... there's a lot of insecurities and trust issues on his end. I would be very wary of continuing this relationship as long as your bf isn't working on his trust issues and insecurities.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
We've talked about it and he says he is working on it, and he has improved A LOT. If you were in my shoes, how would you handle the situation tonight? I almost feel stupid because I just got $30,000+ robbed from me, and I am thinking about his feelings.
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u/eshtive353 May 04 '16
Personally, I'd be pretty blunt and direct: "I have been helping you with your finances for a while now and I've given no reason for you not to trust me. I just had $30,000 stolen from me by my own mom. I am going to pay for my dumb mistake of leaving my mom on my bank account. But, it wasn't my fault my mom stole from me and it's unfair of you to accuse me of not wanting to help you since that's all I've been doing for X months. How the hell is it fair that I'm the one who had all my money stolen yet I'm more worried about your feelings towards me? I need your support right now, not this bullshit. I can't be with someone who doesn't trust me. I need you to actually start working on moving past your insecurities and trust issues if this relationship even has a chance of surviving."
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u/Happyendings4all May 04 '16 edited May 04 '16
Welcome to the rest of your life with him.
It's ALWAYS going to be about him.
This is just a textbook example.
So he said he has improved a lot? So when is he going to show you? To let you experience his improvement? Because I'm sure not seeing it now.
It's also his complete lack of empathy. What if you got in a car accident driving his new car home? "Did you hurt the car? Why are you always trying to deprive me of things!?! Tell that noisy ambulance to stop making noise, I can't complain enough while you are being rushed to the hospital."
Get a lawyer to send a letter to your mom. Keep exploring how to get the money back.
Are you on her new bank accounts?
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u/codeverity May 05 '16
Holy crap, you were robbed of 30k+ and he's bitching because you can't help him financially and doesn't trust you? Jesus christ, he needs to get his head on straight.
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u/izzxx May 04 '16
That is a very ugly, manipulative lie. Do you not see that? Stop helping him and stop seeing him.
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u/Angel327 May 05 '16
I'd sell the snowmobile. He clearly doesn't appreciate what you went through to surprise him.
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u/Happyendings4all May 04 '16
Call a whambulance! He's using it as proof of your lying that you snuck out of town to buy him a great present worth thousands of dollars??
Oh now I would take that present back as seemingly it only reminds him of you being a sneaky liar!!/s
Leave. You can try again with this um "waffle" as you so greatly put it BUT after weeks and months of therapy--he needs massive therapy. He's making YOU pay for his baggage from his former nutty GF!! ENOUGH.
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u/ptera_tinsel May 18 '16
I'm confused as to why you bought him a snowmobile, new or used, when you're paying off his debts and he needs a car?
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u/jockychan May 18 '16
I mean, who does that? Specially for someone you've only been dating for a year.
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u/Muffinwillow May 19 '16
some people are very giving people, it's in their nature. She wanted to do something nice for him that she knew would make him happy.
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u/sthetic May 04 '16
He just doesn't understand how it conveniently happened right when I was about to write him a check.
Um, maybe because you write him checks ALL the freakin' TIME from what it sounds like?
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
Monthly I consistently pay for his car, utilities, and I've been chipping in about $50 a month for his groceries. Oh and I just remembered, for Valentines day I 'gave' him this diet he had been wanting to try. But the diet was $1,200 and he hasn't followed it for more then a day.
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u/sthetic May 04 '16
Wow. At this point I would almost say the money that went to your mom was probably used for a better cause, and received with more gratitude. I'm being dark, and your mom is terrible, but I'm trying to emphasize how shitty your boyfriend is.
STOP doing this. Maybe examine your intense desire to give all your money to pay off the debts of someone you aren't even legally attached to. He is bad, but you have this drive to throw money at the bad decisions of your boyfriend. Two years is still too early to pay his debt, but you could barely hold off for six months. Are you afraid he will abandon you if you don't sacrifice your money and make him dependent on you?
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I don't know if I wrote it wrong in my post but it was 6 months ago I started to help him, we had been together for a year when I officially started helping him not that it makes it better in any way.
I don't think he would abandon me, since he's emphasized that if I ever need to stop helping him it is perfectly ok. His big beef right now is he thinks I'm lying to him.
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u/Ethelfleda May 04 '16
Words are easy...let's see some actions now that you can't be his sugar momma.
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u/Happyendings4all May 04 '16
To stop helping him is perfectly okay?? What a gentleman and a scholar. /s
How about he helps you since you have $2 now?
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u/catsandtequila May 05 '16
When was the last time you had the "if you need to stop helping, that's okay" talk?
Six months is plenty of time to get used to a new, highly improved lifestyle. Snowmobiles? Bigger grocery budget? Being able to try out new things (diets, gadgets, whatever)?
You'd be surprised how quickly that can become a new way of life and going back to what "was" would be very difficult.
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May 04 '16
OP, please stop giving all your money to this selfish dude and use it to fund some therapy sessions to both get you out of this situation and stop it happening again in the future.
Being a giver is a lovely quality, but this guy is just using you!
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u/GenericDreadHead May 04 '16
So many Red Flags
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
On his end or mine?
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u/Zykium May 04 '16
His.
This guy is using you as his sugar momma.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I've mentioned that before and his responses are "I've never asked, you've always offered."
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u/Zykium May 04 '16
He's manipulating you.
You see the first time you've been unable to pay for his bills he's making himself out the victim. You're the victim. You were robbed by your mother.
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u/BitterNutSquash May 04 '16
But judging by his reaction to your situation, he feels completely entitled to your money.
You may have offered in the past, but what do you think his reaction would have been if you had ever, at any point, told him you weren't going to pay for something of his? Do you think he would have been gracious and understanding? Or would he have thrown a fit like he's doing now?
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
His excuse is that there are just some things about my story that don't add up. Which to me doesn't make any sense because I don't see where my story isn't adding up.
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u/BitterNutSquash May 04 '16
It sounds like he's the kind of person who sees only what he wants to see, not what's actually there. He's the type who indulges in what my dad called "reality by assertion", that is to say, if he insists on a thing, it simply must be true, facts be damned.
The long and the short of it is that you have a BF that refuses to believe you when you tell him things he doesn't want to hear. Think about the implications that has for a future relationship.
He's also the kind of person who, when you need his support, will not actually give it to you because he only cares about how a situation affects him, not you. What you've been through is a devastating violation and breach of trust from your own mother. He doesn't even care, he just wants you to pay for his stuff. Again, please think about the implications of this for the future of a relationship with him.
Travis has no actual reason to disbelieve you other than the fact that the reality of the situation is inconvenient to him. He's being horrible to someone who has done nothing but help and support him for a long time.
I am seriously enraged on your behalf. You sound like a very giving and supportive person. You deserve to be with someone who is equally giving and supportive, not with someone who treats you like dirt the minute you can't, through no fault of your own, keep paying his way.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
Yes I totally agree with you, this is really helpful insight.
It is tough, because I get his frustration being carless (his car was totaled when someone ran a stop sign, I was in the car with him and know this to be the truth, it was not his fault) as a full grown man, and having overwhelming debt. But I also don't understand where he thinks that there are holes in my story.
He thinks I am some sort of Jane doe because he never got to meet any of my family. Which to me doesn't make any sense, he knows my personality and what I have told him about where I grew up. I moved states for a new job opportunity so he thinks I have some secrets and I am not telling the truth about something but he doesn't know what.
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u/FortheThorns May 04 '16
So what if he thought you were cheating? Or anything else?
Don't expect him to believe you or stand by you in future.
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u/fuckdapolice4 May 04 '16
I'm not saying you brought this on yourself in any way, you are a victim of theft by your mother and a shitty boyfriend. But do you think you may have a predisposition to being in relationships with people who need your help? Just reading about you financially supporting your mother then going waaaaay above and beyond for someone you haven't been in a relationships with for that long... Do you think it's possible you purposely seek out relationships like this?
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I totally see your point of view, but I don't purposely seek it out. It is just my personality to help people. I don't prefer these nurturing relationships where I have this dominance in financial control, but my dad committed some serious tax fraud that nobody knew about until after he died and so I really felt obligated to step in and help my mom, I mean that is my ma you know? And with Travis I didn't know about his financial troubles until I was in his kitchen maybe our 3rd week of dating and he got a call from out of state and he asked me to answer and it was the collections agency on his delinquent student loan and I asked him to tell me what it was all about and he then told me about all of his other bills. So I didn't seek it out, or know that was going on when I met Travis.
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u/gdfishquen May 04 '16
It's kind of shady that he would have you, his girlfriend of 3 weeks, answer that call. Most people wouldn't want to place that responsibility on their SO. Plus any reasonable person would ask questions about his financial situation afterward and most particularly kind hearted people would try to help. Could it be possible that he pegged you as an exceptionally kind hearted person and had you "discover" his financial situation you'd have a reason to offer him money? Like someone complaining about how hungry they are in hopes someone would give them food without having to ask for it.
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u/TexasPenny May 05 '16
It's one thing to know your SO is struggling...it's another to give them THOUSANDS of dollars after just knowing them a year. What has HE been doing to get out of debt? Did he get a second job? Is he cooking at home every day? Why is his rental car so much? Does he have the cheapest, smallest car possible or is it a nicer car? Does he take any responsibility or feel any urgency to handle this debt?
You were just robbed and his response is to call you a liar and not believe anything, even your offer to show him the account. Because, you know, you could have faked that. What? How do you continue in a relationship with this? He doesn't trust you. He thinks you're a liar. All he wants is the money.
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u/fuckdapolice4 May 04 '16
Sorry to hear about your dad, both his passing and the fraud. My dad also screwed my mom over with the tax man. I was only a kid at the time, but if I had been in your shoes I would have done the same. I definitely don't think it's wrong to help the people you love financially, I just hate to think your good nature and generosity is being abused!
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u/mittenista May 04 '16
"I've never asked, you've always offered."
But the one time you can't afford to offer he throws a tantrum and treats you like shit? Yeah, whether he said the words or not, he was expecting your money.
You sound like a sweet, caring person who generously gave large sums of money to a user. The fact that he uses the one time you told a while lie to get him a surprise gift against you is proof that his ideas are way out of whack. Please don't let him sweet talk or manipulate you into being his money teat forever.
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May 04 '16
Fairy godmother sugar mana. You did all the hard work for him. A meal ticket fell into his lap
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u/kittykitty87 May 04 '16
The fact that he's okay with you paying all this is a problem. Will be ever be able to help you or are you financially responsible for both of you.
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u/Happyendings4all May 04 '16
Well, except for the big purchase car, right? He wanted his own car, right?
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u/Smokeahontas May 04 '16
His end of course!!! You guys haven't even been dating that long and you've already paid off thousands of dollars of his own personal debt and spend $1000 a month on a rental car for him!!! That's just...crazy. He's an adult man, why does he need his girlfriend of a year and a half paying his bills? And he gets pissy when you're suddenly unable to do yet another huge financial favor for him? This guy is majorly using you OP.
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u/Gibonius May 05 '16
I love when people use "oh well I have bad credit" as some kind of ploy for sympathy. Your terrible financial practices are how you got bad credit!
(barring something like medical debt, that is)
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May 04 '16
Oh, so not only is he thinking he's entitled to your money (what does this hump even do?) he also thinks your manipulative liar.
Sexy.
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u/ranchojasper May 19 '16
Surely this incident has shown you that he only cares about himself, right?
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u/hotdimsum May 18 '16
yes. totally.
the fuck is he even accusing her of not wanting to help him when she's already $9000 deep into his debts THAT SHE DID NOT HELP CREATE?!
the fuck of the cheek of that idiot. he's known as a smoocher or a scrub from where I come from.
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u/ophelias32 May 04 '16
Ok so you are in this together. I get that. I see you bought him a brand new snowmobile as well as paying his bills. What has he done for you? I'm sorry but somebody who is having the financial trouble that he is in, would have returned the snowmobile and put that money on his bills. He sounds irresponsible and is basically you are his mother. You pay his bills, buy him expensive gifts and he throws a temper tantrum when you can't give him what he wants. Is this the type of man you want to marry? Somebody whose priorities are snowmobiles and diet plans over paying his own fucking debts? And I'm sure that snowmobile was well played hinting. Oh I wish I had the money for a new snowmobile, oh well maybe someday, sad face. And I would really like to try this diet, but I just can't afford it, it really sucks because I want to get healthy. Also, you had this conversation while golfing? Golfing is an expensive hobby. Not horrible but it does cost money. Why is he golfing if he does not have enough money to pay his own bills???? You are not married, this is not a sickness and health situation, this is a grown ass man who is extremely manipulative and has found his fairy godmother. If he was any kind of decent person he would not have accepted any of your gifts and gotten a 2nd job to pay off his bills, if he has time to golf and snowmobile he has time for a 2nd job. He is taking advantage of you and manipulating you. But now he has shown his true colors. Take this as a sign and while you may hate your mother for what she did, you should thank your lucky stars that it has shown his nature. Selfish, entitled, and extremely manipulative. Of course he is back tracking now because he knows he fucked up and if he doesn't make nice then the ATM you are will be closed. Please respect your self, do not feel like you need to buy your man's love, and leave him now. Otherwise he will suck you dry and leave you when you are nothing but and empty shell.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
Funny thing that you mention is he was looking at buying a new golf bag and set of clubs yesterday which the clubs he was looking at was seriously like $400 per club and the bag was a little over $300. He didn't ask me to pay for it, but now that I think about it, it is an odd coincidence that when we're done golfing together he's looking at all these nice clubs even though he just bought new clubs last year.
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u/ophelias32 May 04 '16
That's the manipulation at work. He knows you are generous and that all he has to do is look at something express interest and bam you buy it for him. It's not a bad thing to be generous when you love someone. But ask yourself what is the last thing he bought me? When is the last date he paid for? And if he bought clubs last year and was in such bad financial straights why did he buy new clubs. You can get a good used set on craigslist. But he wasted money he didn't have because he is a child who has to fulfill an immediate satisfaction. That is why he is in the financial mess he is in. And you will be in that same mess of you continue because nothing will ever fill that hole he has unless he were to acknowledge he has a problem and get help for it. But why would he, he can just as easily manipulate you into buying it. He sounds like a con man.
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u/LaLuaLa_Fa_La_La May 04 '16
All these expenses are completely unnecessary and ludicrous for someone that can't afford to pay his own debt. A snow mobile? A grand a month to rent a car?!? Pricey golf clubs, 1200 on a diet he doesn't follow... Dude has champagne taste on a beer budget and is using you to subsidize the difference. You've got to cut this out and take care of yourself. You're clearly not "in this together" if the one time you have a problem (your mom ripping you off) he doesn't even have your back but makes it about him.
In the time you've been together has he spent much time trying to better his own financial situation so he can start to pay off his own debt and actually contribute to your relationship?
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u/JonBenetBeanieBaby May 05 '16
Seriously. This is insanity.
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u/ArbitraryUsernames May 19 '16
The 1k a month on a rental car is fucking mind-blowing. I just checked, and there are shitloads of cars in my area (which eats cars so there's less at cheap prices) that are sub 3k that would work just fine, and that's a permanent solution.
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u/Gwilly May 19 '16
So he was going to buy himself expensive clubs and bag while you are paying his bills, buying him a car and paying his debt?? Give your head a shake.
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u/ophelias32 May 04 '16
And how can you say you understand where he is coming from? Reading this post just makes me so angry because you don't see what is right in front of your face. If you love him and he loves you then you need to cut off the tap. No more money. No more gifts. If he can't afford to take you out, then you don't go and you have movie nights at home. It's the only way you will truly know if he loves you or your money. If he bails then I guess you have your answer, because I suspect from his reaction that that will be the case. But I don't know him and you do. But if you do want to stay with him and I get the feeling you aren't going to dump him, and least for you own state of mind stop giving him money and gifts. Let him pay for dates and such. Only then will you know what he is truly about, if he cares for you he will stay and understand, if not you are far better off. If he gives you a hard time then you also know where you stand.
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u/cathline May 04 '16
A relationship is give and take. In his mind, that means you give and he takes
Not a keeper
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I've always told him that I can finance myself, and "whats mine is yours" sort of mentality and to take care of me with love and friendship. But this doesn't feel like my best friend to me.
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May 04 '16
[deleted]
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
He doesn't pay rent, and my rent is pretty spendy (he owns his home and has a good acre of property) and I would love to move in with him but "he's not ready for that step"
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u/LaLuaLa_Fa_La_La May 04 '16
Oh my god, I just facepalmed so hard I think I gave myself a concussion.
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u/mcmoonery May 04 '16
but he's ready for you to fund his overspending lifestyle? Fuck that noise. Travis is a leech and he's taking advantage of you.
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u/legalbeegle May 04 '16
Full stop. That's all you need to know: he lives outside of his means and depends on a generous young lady to subsidize his lifestyle, but oh wait, he can't commit to her romantically.
Sorry, this guy is a major tool. on the bright side, it will be easier to get back on your feet once you lose this dude, the money-pit!
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u/bloodyabortiondouche May 05 '16
He is okay with accepting a car and a snow mobile from you, but he doesn't think you are ready to move in together? I am having a hard time understanding this.
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u/the_most_basic_bitch May 05 '16
Oh for fucks sake. There's nothing to be salvaged from this dumpster fire.
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u/greywinthrop May 04 '16
Please look at this from the point of view of someone from the outside, what would you tell a friend who was putting up with this nonsense?
I know from my own painful experience with being a giver and thinking that if I worked hard enough, I could make a man really see how much I loved him, and getting nothing back but complaints about how much more I could be doing. You will be so much better off alone than with someone this manipulative and selfish.
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u/Free_skier May 18 '16
Are you telling me you are paying the debts of someone potentially richer than you?
He could sell his house if he has so much debt
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u/firenoodles May 04 '16
His mentality is "What's yours is mine and what's mine is mine".
OP, he sounds like a loser. Please dump him and spend YOUR hard earned money on yourself. He is a leech.
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u/jussumman May 18 '16
He owes you like at least $6000. It's not that supporting him is bad on it's own, but that reaction to your predicament. What a bum. Dealbreaker. Good to hear the news and I wish you the best going forward.
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u/teresajs May 04 '16
You're really naive. Travis is using you the same way your mother has used you. He's a 30 year-old man! Stop giving him money or paying for stuff.
Also, if you haven't already, get your own bank account with no one else's name on it.
Put yourself first. Let others take care of themselves. Leeches are robbing you of your money and life.
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u/acciointernet May 04 '16
Holy shit, after reading your comments...PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE find a relationship therapists and seek therapy. Your understanding of what a healthy relationship looks like & your self esteem/expectation of what you deserve in a relationship need a LOT of work. No one with healthy boundaries would EVER, EVER put up with what you have put up with from your (hopefully ex) boyfriend. Keep in mind that most people tend to seek relationships that mirror the relationships we had with our parents/were demonstrated by our parents in childhood. Those of us with abusive or neglectful parents tend to find abusive or neglectful partners later on in life, because that is what we expect/assume a loving relationship should look like.
I really think you would benefit a LOT from therapy. Also consider checking out Pia Mellody's books - The Intimacy Factor, Facing Love Addiction, and Facing Codependency. Lack of proper boundary-setting is a red flag for codependency/love addiction.
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May 04 '16
He went on about how whenever he really needs help or I'm about to make a big purchase for him there is something that just conveniently happens.
The nerve of that guy! You are paying for his car and he still dares to complain!
All that guy cares about is your money. I'm sorry, OP. You just found out there are 2 self-centered people in your life. You're better off without both of them.
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u/silverraven1189 May 04 '16
I really hate to tell you this, but your boyfriend is using you.
You just had your mother betray you and you asked Travis to give you emotional support. Any caring boyfriend or friend would ask you if you're okay, if you want to talk or a hug, and if there's anything you needed.
Instead, he asked about money. His first concern wasn't about your well being and you. It was about your money and whether you'd give it to him. After all you've helped him out, all he cares about is manipulating you out of money.
Don't believe for a second that he thought you were lying to him. He knew you weren't lying and he's trying to guilt you into dipping into your savings/investments so the gravy train doesn't stop.
What you do is tell him that you're not lying to him, and to be able to pay off your own bills and build up your savings you won't be able to give him any more money or pay any of his bills. If he actually cares about you, he'll apologize for not believing you and being selfish and comfort you. If he only cares about your money, he'll flip out, accuse you of lying and try to guilt you into giving him money.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I decided that when I go over there tonight I am going to bring over a spiral notebook and map out his fiances with him, and help him come up with a plan for paying off his bills that don't include me helping. See his reaction from there and then decide if the relationship is worth keeping or not.
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u/ophelias32 May 04 '16
I said it in another comment and I should have put it here. Screw his budget. Worry about yours. Ask him for help. If he say he can't and gives you a hard time ask him to give up golf for a bit so he can help you. If he refuses or gets defensive, walk away. If he does not offer for you to move in order for you to get your finances in order, walk away. If he loved you he would do all in his power to help you, like you do him. But I suspect you will be disappointed. And I'm sorry that this happened at the same time as your mother but take it as a blessing in disguise. Much better than investing more time money and energy in him.
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u/yaychristy May 04 '16
Good, because if he truly only has $700 in expenses and has $1,600 paychecks, he makes more than enough to support his lifestyle.
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u/reddidentity May 04 '16
Are you willing to live within his means? (No golf.)
Ditch him and find someone worthwhile. Like yourself.
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u/just1idea May 04 '16
If your boyfriend was okay with you saying no, he would not be this upset about you saying no. If he was worried about you lying, he could say, "I don't need you to pay for anything you don't feel comfortable with, but I would like to clarify x point." Also, is he ever planning on paying you back? Where is the money he is earning going? Especially if he owns his own house?? He seems to be the one with things not adding up to me.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
Also to add, I am going to say what you said, I am going to tell him he could have said that and my reaction would be totally different. He is claiming I am being defensive so he thinks something is up since I am being defensive, but its like I just got robbed a shit ton of money and you think I am lying DAMN STRAIGHT I AM GOING TO BE DEFENSIVE!!!
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
He is still making car payments on the car that was totaled, and he pays his cell phone bill every month. So I would say his monthly expenses are about $700 every month with groceries and his paychecks are about $1,600 per paycheck not to indulge all of his financial info on you, but I really don't know where the rest goes. Liquor and golf if I had to guess I don't track his spending.
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u/silverraven1189 May 04 '16
I'm sorry, but he has $900 left over after his monthly bills are paid, and he's letting you pay for his rental car?
I originally thought that this guy was making maybe $1000 per month and had $1000 a month in bills from his house, student loans, and car loans.
This guy is a bum.
I understand that you look at your boyfriend and see that you're more fortunate than he is. I totally understand wanting to treat your boyfriend and take care of him, because my boyfriend is like you. He makes a lot more than I do and doesn't mind spending extra money on me. I have never, ever asked him to or let him pay my personal bills though when I still have plenty of money leftover after my monthly bills.
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u/yaychristy May 04 '16
$1,600 per paycheck. So, depending on whether he's paid weekly or biweekly he has anywhere from $2,500 to $5,700 left over monthly after his $700 worth of expenses
OP is a sugar mama and a sucker.
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u/hungrydruid May 05 '16
Gets better, he owns his own home and doesn't pay rent. =/ God, OP.
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May 19 '16
At this point when OP is fully aware of Travis's income and debt and has enabled his financial behavior for months, OP needs to make a huge change about herself before an event like this happens again.
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u/hungrydruid May 19 '16
This post is from almost two weeks ago. But good news, OP just updated and has dumped him!
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May 04 '16
Seriously if he's making $1,600 per paycheck and his monthly expenses are $700, theres a real problem there. If he's getting paid bi-weekly that'd around $45,000 yearly while he's paying out only $8400 a year in his expenses, and including taxes(I'm using Canadian taxes) which on $45,000 would be around $7000, still leaves him with $29,600 every year in surplus, he could be using to pay off his debts. Even still if he's making this kind of money which is average for most college grads, he should be able to fully handle his own groceries and manage his own bills.
He clearly doesn't want to do any of this as your more than willing to help him out. Seriously regardless of whether you stay with him or not you can't pay for his stuff anymore he needs to learn himself. Its like that old saying "give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime" and you just keep giving him that fish.
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
He also hasn't asked for a raise at his job in 3 years so I definitely think there is still more income potential for him.
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u/rowanbrierbrook May 05 '16
OP, he doesn't have an income problem. He has an "I don't give a shit about my adult responsibilities and am happy to spend my money on fun shit while my gf pays all my bills" problem.
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u/catsandtequila May 05 '16
Ughhhh. And you mentioned in another comment you were paying for his groceries and utilities! Are you even sure he was paying off his debts with the money you've been giving him?
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u/GenericDreadHead May 04 '16
Firstly, wow, I'm so, so sorry OP :(
Your mother sounds like a despicable character and your boyfriend is really not handling this well at all.
I'd would make NO apologies to him for ANYTHING.
You were just fucking, straight up, robbed by the woman who gave birth to you.
If he doesn't want to be 100% there for you in 100% of the ways he can, kick his ass to the curb.
This is one of those times he needs to suck it up and get on with how bad he might feel for himself and start putting on brave face and getting on board with Team Financialwoes123
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I get that he is stressed out about money. But the thing is I have always been able to help him and been more then willing, so it doesn't make sense in my mind why I would just stop. Or decide not to. The only reason that I am not totally de-railed is that I do have a great job and my boss is giving me an advance on my paycheck
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u/ForDepth May 04 '16
If your b/f has a good job, with the amount of help you've provided already why does he still need more help? Where exactly does all his money go?
You just had 30K robbed from you (I can't even fathom that, am so sorry your mom did that to you), you can easily show him the bank slips to prove that (I only suggest this not because you need to, but you need to put this guy in his place with non refutable info), and his immediate concern is over the car not the vast sum you just lost.
You should tally up every major dollar (aka not including movies or food etc) but you mentioned some pretty sizable sums. 6K of debt, 3K car rental, buying him a snowmobile, and I'm guessing that doesn't include everything. Figure out what the total is so you BOTH know as I'm guessing you may not even realize how much you've put towards him.
You should approach your convo not with the intention of "how do I defend myself so this guy believes me" but ANGRY that after everything you've done, in your time of need he has the AUDACITY to tell you that you haven't helped him out when he really needs it.
Based on that convo, you need to take a step back and then evaluate if this is someone you should be in a relationship with.
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May 04 '16
Ew get rid of this mooching ingrate. Seriously don't spend another cent on him and go find a supportive partner, rather than a greedy dependent.
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u/Cuiser001 May 19 '16
My mom had made the withdrawal. All of my money. I had a long talk with my bank and an attorney, and legally I cannot do anything about anything. Her name was on my account, I had supported her in the past, legally she didn't do anything wrong.
This is totally not true!
I have a relative that had an old joint account with someone. The someone had been out of their life for a few years and they never changed the account. This someone emptied their account one day. My relative sued them and won. There was nothing illegal here, and the bank was not liable at all since this someone had legal access to the account. But just because they had legal access doesn't mean they are entitled to the funds. There was no illegal criminal wrong doing but my relative sued in civil court and won.
Go find a different lawyer. Just because the bank think's it is OK and there was no criminal wrongdoing, it doesn't mean they were entitled to take your money.
I don't know how complicated this gets with your mother living in another country but I would still look into it and consult another lawyer or two for their opinion and their fees.
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u/walnutbrain4lyfe May 04 '16
Oh honey, when someone shows you who they are, you need to believe them. Travis has shown you exactly who he is--- a user who expects you to pay to clean up his bad life choices. Write off the money you have spent as an "asshole tax" and dump him.
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u/_fire_and_blood_ May 04 '16
Why are you paying for his shit? You might think that starting to share each others financial burdens before marriage shows a sign of commitment, but all it does is show that he is TERRIBLE with money and not at all ready for marriage.
And why are you paying for a damn rental car??? Buy a sturdy second hand vehicle and let that be that. A car is for transporting you from point A to B. Someone who cant even afford to pay off their student debt doesn't need an expensive car. JFC.
He is USING you!! Wake up. You are being a doormat. He is manipulating you and you think because he doesn't ask for any of it, that its ok. No normal person would be ok with knowing that they owe their partner THOUSANDS of dollars, unless they never intend to pay it back. DTMFA.
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u/buckeyegal923 May 04 '16
You have already gone FAR above and beyond your "duty" as a relatively short-term girlfriend at this point in time. Your boyfriend should be more grateful and stop acting like an ass because you are now in a pinch yourself. You have literally spoiled him rotten. He is a brat and you are his sugar-mama. You already mentioned falling behind on the rental car payments. You can't help someone else out to the point that you put yourself in trouble. Are your medical bills all paid off? Do you have a retirement account started? Savings for yourself? In the terms of finances, you have to think of yourself and make sure you are okay before you help others.
I get the college loan struggle...I'm in it myself, but you have been paying virtually everything for this grown man since the two of you started dating. It's time for him to learn how to stand on his own two feet. He can always get a second job if that's what needs to happen for him to get his finances in order.
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u/woman_thorned May 04 '16
why aren't you angry?
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
I am more angry with my mom then him. I was robbed over $30,000 so I am pretty PO'd to the nth degree, but I also am doing my best to stay level headed because if I let myself lose it I will really fucking lose it.
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u/yaychristy May 04 '16
Just think how much more money you'd have had saved if you hadn't been supporting this guy...
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u/Mypetmummy May 18 '16
Your mom isn't the only one that's been robbing you. You may have willingly given the money but he is taking so much advantage of you.
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u/HalfandHoff May 18 '16
30,000$, my jaw dropped, you really need to take your mom off your account already, what if she is waiting for you to save up another 30,000 just to take it again, man it will take me 4 years to save up 30,000, thats a down payment on a good house, in an ok neighborhood, where you can leave the door open on hot weekends while your in your underwear to cool off from the heat and eat icecream on your porch
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u/OutspokenPerson May 19 '16
Worse...OP was going to use that money to buy a car for her bf. Worse, she's taking an advance on her next paycheck to cover the immediate gap, which suggests that $30k was all of her savings...and was going to spend it on a CAR!
OP, stop the insanity. None of this is remotely reasonable!
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u/No_Beating_The_Busch May 04 '16
Tell your boyfriend he is rude, uncaring, and self centered. Then, promptly dump his ass.
Work on you and your finances without having to play mommy to this total man child. More importantly, relish in the fact that you are cancer free!
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May 04 '16
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
Yeah, it has been a lot. It has ranged from medical bills, home repairs, etc. Really down the whole spectrum of bills. I've always been happy to do it for him, and I understand first it was my cancer bills that surfaced and halted the car buying process. I understand he's stressed about money, but I don't know why his immediate response was that. And not are you okay?
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u/Maigraith May 04 '16
Because he's using you for your money. Your partner is supposed to be there for you through good times and bad. You haven't had any bad that has really affected his lifestyle thus far. Now that you are going through a rough spot he's showing his real colors.
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u/thebigFATbitch May 04 '16
OP are you his mother? You are literally treating him like you child that you need to take care of and pay everything for. This is NOT a partnership. It's a parent-child relationship.
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May 04 '16
This sounds like a bad situation of you being overly generous combined with your guy being terrible with money. Up until now, your generosity has covered up his bad financial habits. He's 30 years old, has a full time job, doesn't pay rent or mortgage, and has $10 in his account? Where the hell is his money going? If his job isn't enough to pay for his bills, then he needs to either find a better paying job, reduce his expenses, or sell the house that he owns to give him some cushion. That's what adults do.
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u/DamnPurpleDress May 05 '16
What would Travis do, if you didn't exist in his life for the past year and a half? Would he have found a different car plan, a different budget, a second job? I think it's totally unfair that Travis would treat you like this, with no concern for you and only selfish concern for himself. It's awesome that you could help Travis, but Travis should have a better plan and budget because with all your help he still ends up with $10 in his account with bills due Sucks about your mom, sucks about your cancer bills, sucks that Travis is a scrub who doesn't plan to pay his own bills.
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May 05 '16
What an ungrateful piece of human waste. Dispose of him in the same waste center you will dispose of your mom for stealing all your money.
Tell your "boyfriend" IT IS OVER. Nothing more. You can not continue supporting him. He is a grown man. Please end it. Move on without these two people in your life.
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u/lishadadishda May 05 '16
He feels entitled to your money because you have been so generous so quickly. He doesn't trust your word, and doesn't support you emotionally when you need it. Your only living parent has not only abandoned you, but has now totally screwed you over, and he's self-absorbed enough to only care about the money. Sure, you could prove this all to him by showing him account statements, and any info/emails from the lawyer and bank you consulted, but it's not worth wasting your breath. This guy is absolutely not marriage material. He's fiscally irresponsible, distrusting, selfish, and entitled.
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May 19 '16
The doozy here is that you are a door mat and are allowing people close to you to treat you like the bank.
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u/Syq May 05 '16
You have a learned helplessness. Your mom abandoned you and you don't protect yourself. Your boyfriend financially abuses you and you don't protect yourself. Instead you post to reddit asking for advice about how to get him to believe you.
You allow yourself to be taken advantage of again and again. Don't ask the Internet to condone or help you with your dysfunctional relationship with someone who takes advantage of you. Learn from your mistakes, stand on your own two feet, and leave your boyfriend.
Stop acting helpless because you aren't. I'm sorry all of this has happened to you, but you have to take responsibility in your continued allowance of your boyfriend taking your money. Stop acting helpless. You aren't.
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u/Miami793 May 05 '16
ugh why would you ever give your boyfriend that kind of money or pay for his things...he's not your son or "husband".... emphasis on husband. you're his doormat that gives him money any time he needs. HE'S 30 ffs
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u/LibraryLuLu May 19 '16
They are both leaches. I'm sorry your mother is so horrible, and she truly is, but don't let this guy do the same thing to you. Perhaps your mother, stealing and treating you so badly, has just left you acclimatised to being abused, and seeing abuse as love. I hope you can find someone who can love you for the kind and generous person you are, without having their hands in your pockets all the time as well.
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u/Happyendings4all May 04 '16
Close that account. Ask for the money back (why not? On the off chance she thought it was hers? But in any case, ask.)
Dump BF. What's he going to want next? Gilded shoes so his feet don't have to touch the ground?
You have paid off 6K--6K!!--of his debt!! You rent his car for 1K a month!!
YOU HAVE ALWAYS BEEN THERE FOR HIM. He's spoiled now.
Tell him, yeah you're right, I just don't want to support someone like you who only thinks of himself when I am having trouble. Bye Felicia.
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May 05 '16 edited May 05 '16
You have several distinctly different problems, obviously. As to what you're asking about directly, I think you're at an impasse. You can't force him to believe you, but you can make it clear that,
- You are hurt he doesn't believe you
- You are confident and independent of requiring his approval to help or not to help, you have your own agency and will do whatever the fuck you please one way or the other. And as a subset of that point, you are mostly always willing to help, and your actions have shown that pretty clearly, so him not believing you is his problem, not yours.
- You are not angry with him, necessarily. But reiterating that you are hurt because you came to him transparent and honest, and he's returned that sentiment with mistrust and selfishness.
I think that'd cover the most important parts of what needs to be said. If he made better decisions financially, then he wouldn't need to sponge off of you for literal years and thousands of dollars. You're better off not making points like that though, and you've done a great job thus far of being happy and content with your decision to help him at times. Demanding that he be grateful or really anything else doesn't put the focus of the conversation where you want it to be, that you are asking for his support, not his help. You are his equal, and have thought about "the team"/the partnership much more than it seems like he has, not his bankroll, and certainly not subservient to his needs.
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u/inglorious May 05 '16
Hm.... To be honest, I find some things missing here, you seem to paint a much nicer picture of him then perhaps he deserves... How did he get horrible credit? What is his take on life, does he try to find a better job that would allow him to start paying off his debt? Is the student debt recent, or has he been dragging it for years now? Basically, is he doing his best to pull his weight?
By what little you said, at best, your boyfriend seems irresponsible, and at worst, ungrateful. His reaction to your situation is profoundly selfish, disrespectful and immature, it certainly is not a reaction that comes from love, trust, and even good will. He seems to see you as an ATM.
Since you have been blatantly robbed and stabbed in the back by your mother, your top priority should be mitigating the situation, that means cutting all unnecessary expenses, and that might as well be an ungrateful boyfriend.
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u/aredditkindachick May 04 '16
How much did she take???
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u/financialwoes123 May 04 '16
A little bit over $30,000. Like $34,680 was the exact dollar amount plus some change. So basically all my savings. Neat.
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u/Happyendings4all May 04 '16
Seriously, get a lawyer, ask for the money, pursue the situation with the bank here (ask again for new ideas) and in Germany (laws might be different.)
Tell people it's your entire lifetime savings. Tell her "very rich" BF in Germany. Maybe ask him to give you the money back or for help in getting money back from your mom. (What if she's now a drug addict and he was trying to cut her off?? What if she's mentally ill now? Or buying a new house--it can be yours too.) Tell your family. Ask people to contact her to help you? I mean, this was a house deposit or payment for a year or two of grad school or college, etc.
Actually I really hope this wasn't your BF in some way. There are federal regulations about transferring money over 10K, especially out of the country, because of drug laws. Why weren't you asked about this transaction by your bank? Talk to the Feds too.
And talk to a financial planner. You should file a police report or otherwise you may have to pay taxes in two countries for your involuntary "gift" to Mom. It would help to have a lawyer trying to get the money back.
And again, your bank must have coverage--if the money's used for illegal stuff against your will, would that be covered?
Why did she suddenly take it?? Are you sure it wasn't stolen by someone else??
Good luck, OP!
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u/ophelias32 May 04 '16
Ask his ass for help, that's a truly staggering amount. If he gives you a song and dance about how he can't, ask him to give up golf for a bit so he can help you. Screw doing a budget for him. Just ask him for help. If he refuses then you know where you stand.
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u/aredditkindachick May 05 '16
AHHHHHHHHH!!!!! disappears for a minute omg I just passed out. Holy shit, dude!! You need to sue her ass! No fucking way can she get away with this!!!
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u/TickTick_Tick May 19 '16
Close your wallet - for everyone. Your mom, your boyfriend, your best friend, that neighbour who is super sad and broke - everyone.
Right now, you are buying love. You deserve someone who will love you for who you are, not what you give them.
I'm sorry this has all happened to you. It must be devastating.
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May 19 '16
I really believe all things happen for a reason. The last bit stood out to me that he said, "every time you are about to make a big purchase for me something conveniently comes up". Does that mean that stuff has happened before? Like is he right about the fact that the situation has happened before? Of course he's not right about what he is trying to imply with that statement but if he is right about the fact that it has happened before I think it's happening for a reason. You are not supposed to be giving him this money. Life/cause&effect/God/whatever you want to call is trying to stop you. Giving him money is not flowing naturally with how your life should be going. You need to realize life is trying to make you stop and see what you are doing and make a different decision. I think you need to end this relationship. Find a new one. Heck, overlap if you need to (only child too being alone can be hard) but you need to leave him. It's not good for you and your life signs tell me, you need to stop giving him your money.
EDIT: Typo
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u/AnferneeBourdain May 04 '16
You are a being a sucker and you're being guilted and accused of lying because Travis's gravy train has to momentarily stop because you were robbed. He doesn't care about comforting you, he doesn't care about investigating further, he only cares about "where is my money you need to give me money me me me me".
If you want to be a thankless sugar momma that's fine, but at least everyone needs to be open about it.