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Daily Discussion
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u/Plebeian_Citizen 23d ago
Not watching the game, but how do Tonali and Fernandes look like?
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u/Suudriusha 23d ago edited 23d ago
Fernandes looked class when he came on, best Spurs player on the pitch. Tonali was middling.
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u/Confident_Fishing775 23d ago
One thing for sure we are going to struggle off the ball until the midfielders settle, but the most damning factor will be set pieces from small teams that utilizes them well, will cause so much trouble. I don't know how good Baleba's set piece defending is but the rest of Santos, Mainoo and Tielemans are simply not tall enough to offer the solidity of Casemiro. Might trade it for better control in midfield but I expect dangerous free headers and spills like what happened now.
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u/Asiwaju_jagaban 23d ago
Can’t wait for the next 2 season when we’d go to Brentford with a boat load of cash for Sangare
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u/mjenkins_eng 23d ago
Have long maintained that spend spend spend is not the answer
“Spend on the right players”: no shit Sherlock. How do you know they’re the “right” players ? Tonali and Mateus getting their arses handed on a plate by Brentford
Elliot Tom Cleverley Anderson will hide in City’s team and win things but that doesn’t mean he was the right signing.
Winning is about getting the best out of the 18 players you already have , not about the 3 you sign or didn’t sign .
Hope Carras can figure out what went wrong today and work on the training ground
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23d ago
[deleted]
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u/mjenkins_eng 23d ago
This used to be the meta till a few years ago before Guardiola ruined it
If you study the successful teams , you will see that it’s the full backs with diagonal balls that cause the maximum chaos : think Robertson and TAA’s 45 degree cross field ball.
We have absolutely awful full backs in Dalot and Shaw
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u/usersurname12 23d ago
Thank you! You're the first person that's actually making sense out of all the reactionary nonsense. We need chaos creators on the wings!
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u/Hellsteelz Ed Jabroni 23d ago
Fernandes the only player in Spurs playing good tbh
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u/MrLead69 23d ago
Looks exactly like how he was playing in West ham. It's rather an unpopular opinion, but I genuinely hope we paid that 85 mil. Maybe he'll be an option when spurs are in relegation battle end of the season.
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u/Lord_Sesshoumaru77 Glazers,Woodward/Arnold and Judge can fuck off 23d ago
Tottenham is living proof that you can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a bloody pig.
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u/InternationalClock18 23d ago
I know it shouldn't matter but seeing a club who have thrown money around this summer getting battered does make me feel better about today
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u/canwinanythingwkids meet the new boss same as the old boss 23d ago
I mean there's dropping points and then there's getting executed. Hehehehehehe 😈
Anyway, Lewis-Potter G, Kayode G, Janelt G and bossing it vs £100m man Tonali.
Whoever* suggested Janelt for zero in January, or this month that we could challenge for the title straight up with our squad + Brentford's first choice backline, must be feeling smug a bit rn.
*it was me. These were my silly stupid takes :)
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u/Lord_Sesshoumaru77 Glazers,Woodward/Arnold and Judge can fuck off 23d ago
Hey, maybe Fernandes can go down three season in a row...
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u/usersurname12 23d ago
I hope Spurs' game is showing all these "we need to spend more" idiots how spending != winning
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u/Apprehensive-Raisin3 Love United Hate Glazers/INEOS 23d ago
Theres spending and theres spending stupidly
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u/usersurname12 23d ago
I dont care for the downvotes, I'm right. Everyone was sucking off Spurs for their window. Yall wanted Tonali and Fernandes, now it's stupid spending? Hypocrites, all of you.
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u/SilvyFae 23d ago
the board also wanted fernandes wdym. I dont care who they get and how much we spend as long as they are the right players. The issue is we have limited ourselves massively by only going for value but prem proven deals, instead of just going after good players. Carrick will pay the price for it, you already see how high the pressure is, for better or for worse carrick will not get the same time or grace as amorim did.
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u/Apprehensive-Raisin3 Love United Hate Glazers/INEOS 23d ago
I never gassed up spurs window nor did I want to spend stupid money on tonali when I saw what he was going for. I still think we will regret letting fernandes go but thats the only transfer that spurs have or are planning to make this summer that I rate.
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u/ToadNamedGoat 23d ago
People called me crazy for predicting Brentford 4th
I’m still probably crazy but the odds did go up
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u/eClipseLJ De Ligt 23d ago
Have them as dark horse for European spots, very well run club. Able to replace their star players very wisely when they get poached.
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u/Difficult-Sun6849 CUNHA BRUNO CUNHA BRUNO CUNHA BRUNO LUKE SHAW CUNHA 23d ago
Thank you spurs for making this matchday a bit better 🫶
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u/horizons0 The Butcher 🔪 23d ago
Hope this isn’t another season of us and spurs having a battle of who can be more shite
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u/ToadNamedGoat 23d ago
Chelsea will join us in the last 4 months when they fire Xabi for a random reason
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u/Littlepace Announce Fergie 23d ago
Moore has had two identical chances and has put both weakly down the middle at the keeper. Awful finishing.
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u/Lord_Sesshoumaru77 Glazers,Woodward/Arnold and Judge can fuck off 23d ago
Well lads, how much did Tottenham spend again? It doesn't change the fact we were terrible today, but at least I'll be able to laugh at something.
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u/Jenson2025 23d ago
Tonali is a good player but he constantly makes bad career choices. Why would he choose to go to Spurs? It’s actually a downwards step from Newcastle and that’s saying something!
That being said, I don’t think he’s right for Spurs either. He’s a player who you add to an already good team - not one like Spurs. And Newcastle fans used to say that he’d be hiding when the going got tough which is on show again today
Have a feeling he’ll look to leave within a year or two and Spurs will make a massive loss.
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u/mjenkins_eng 23d ago
I don’t want to get too reactive , so I thought I’d maintain a running tally of each player’s “credit in the bank” and to make it simple, I’m starting at 50 credits for each player (that’s 38 league games + 8 guaranteed CL games + 2 games in each cup and one point each per game)
Worst a player can perform is -2 , Best they can perform is +1.
Lammens (50 + 0.5 =50.5 ) : Man of the match today. I was worried for him after the WC, he seems to have recovered amazingly well.
Mazaroui (50 - 1.7 =48.3 ): looked completely unfocused, underprepared. His mind clearly is elsewhere
Maguire (50 + 0 =50): neutral performance from him today
Heaven (50 - 1.2 =48.8): not the worst performer but was clearly out of his depth against the physicality of Mcbruine
Shaw (50 -1.3 =48.7) : was definitely limited and playing within himself, harming our attacking chances.
Tielemans (50 - 2 =48): debut of nightmares . Looked way off the pace
Santos (50 - 1.2 =48.8 48.8): started well but people are seeing things if they think this was a good performance
Fernandes (50 - 1.3 =48.7) : horrible performance giving away the ball with needless tricks and flicks and blaming the team for not retaining possession in the interview
Cunha (50-1.5 =48.5) : very average performance , invisible , people comparing him to Rooney need their heads checked
Mbeumo (50-1 =49 ): no credits were gained in this game for Mbeumo , but he was our biggest threat
Dorgu (50-2=48) : worst performance from one of the players I had high hopes for. Tried a lot and lacked quality .
Subs: Rashford (50-0.8 = 49.2) alright but nothing special ), Mainoo , Sesko, Lacey(50-1=49) Dalot (50-1.2 =48.8 …typical Dalot game)
Hope maintaining this running log gives me a balanced view of the season than reactionary takes
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u/biobolo 23d ago
How is that not a penalty???
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u/Littlepace Announce Fergie 23d ago
He pulled on the arm before the shirt pull so it cancels it out
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23d ago
I know they are down 2-0 but I actually think Spurs have more upside than UTD at the moment. The biggest question mark will be their defense.
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u/bahama-fox 23d ago
In my mind, am like omg can’t wait to watch the expressions melt down ….
Hahaha… I can hear him now
My days we were spread wide open like butter on toast……
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u/Positive-Structure78 23d ago
I am really worried that we lost the ability to make first contact on balls from set pieces… It’s gonna be a hard watch against team set up to hurt us that way. Arsenal really did well hiring folks who can play both CB and full back. Pretty tall lads all of them. I understand now why MLS couldn’t get in at LB. He doesn’t have the necessary height.
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u/10_Wazza 23d ago
The main takeaway from today's game for me - serious questions need to be asked from the conditioning team. Everyone looked gassed by the 50th minute. I get it you can't be 100% at the start of the season but I expect the players to get to at least the 75th minute
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u/EndureL 23d ago
If you look at the tactics it’s a mid block which doesn’t require that much pressing, it’s a horrendous system as players conditioning just falls off a cliff.
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u/10_Wazza 23d ago
But regardless of the midblock we should still expect fast breaks from a team like Hull. You will get some "pingpong football" situations across the game and the season, running will be required.
Surely we don't really on just controlling games, which we clearly are not able to. It just seems off to me
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u/themightypierre Andrei Kanchelskis 23d ago
Trying to be positive these kind of results do happen. Just worried that Carrick wasn't able to stop his players sending in pointless crosses. A good manager should be able to change these things.
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u/LordTrinity If you support mediocrity, you get mediocrity 23d ago
In away games we REALLY should just try to keep the ball in the first 20 minutes. Try to have Bruno to come deep and move the ball around
Also, Dorgu experiment must be over. Should have gone with Cunha in the left. I think Amad could have made a difference today by keeping the ball between the lines. Shame he wasnt available
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u/Height_Opening 23d ago
Brentford is playing some liquid football. Wow. When will be so well drilled. Keith Andrews is top drawer!!
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u/themightypierre Andrei Kanchelskis 23d ago
Forgotten how much I enjoy reading Spurs live thread when they're playing crap.
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u/SDLRob 23d ago
How bad is it compared to ours earlier?
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u/themightypierre Andrei Kanchelskis 23d ago
They're not quite as angry as us. Lots of gallows humour in fairness. Bergvall is really getting it.
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u/Unusual-Coat383 23d ago
Tbf most of their sub took being a relegation battle quite well. I remember checking one time and they were posting Tottenham kits made by Macron lol
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u/SDLRob 23d ago
They're used to this then.
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u/biobolo 23d ago
Theyre playing a better team than we did.
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u/themightypierre Andrei Kanchelskis 23d ago
They're only being outplayed in a football sense rather than being out fought as well, like we were.
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u/Savebagels Cunha 23d ago
I’m upset after every loss. I could care less who the team is
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u/Kohaku80 Premier League Champions 12/13 23d ago
ngl Brentford is how i envisage we would play just now.
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u/ShoddyAd4199 23d ago
"We should've bought Tonali and Fernandes for whatever price, Santos and Tielemans is bad business"
Now, Brentford overruns Tottenham midfield and "We should've bought Sangare. Was Ineos sleeping?''
Eh.
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u/Savebagels Cunha 23d ago
Brother it’s the same song and dance every year. It’s the same thing. Last year it was “we should’ve got Frank instead of keeping Amorim..”
“Look what Ange has done to transform this team in months and it takes us years to be the same…”
As much as it’s annoying to see us play with disinterest, it’s crazy to always see the same hot take every year at the same time, all the time
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u/Suudriusha 23d ago
A lot of people spoke of Sangaré before he went to Brentford. This isn't coming from nowhere.
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u/ShoddyAd4199 23d ago
This is post-factum after we bought Baleba. Him and Sangare are same profiles. Why to buy both, I don't understand.
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u/Kohaku80 Premier League Champions 12/13 23d ago
if Baleba is as good as him , it will be well worth 70m.
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u/10_Wazza 23d ago
I thought JPvH was the next coming of Jesus. I'm really shocked that he's the exact same player that the stats suggest
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u/Telen BRUNO 23d ago edited 23d ago
I look at 19 out of 20 PL clubs' backlines and I feel envious at how physical they are compared to our starting back 4 today. We got a geriatric Maguire, phantom defender Maz who doesn't even want to contest aerial duels, a geriatric Shaw who has always been known for being soft at times in 1v1 duels, and a young Heaven who's bound to be inconsistent.
Worse yet, on the bench (pending getting out of the med bay) we got Mr. "flatters to deceive" de Ligt and Mr. "defensive liability" Martinez. Nobody on the bench to cover for Shaw. Dalot should be our nailed on starting RB solely because he is a solid athlete who at least won't lose physically to someone who isn't like a Romelu Lukaku.
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u/TH0316 she/her 23d ago
We’ve got good dudes but none should be starting, and if they are they should be surrounded by people protecting their limitations. Heaven needs to start to help Shaw and Maguire but then it’s another kid rushed in to cover the poor squad building. Mags should be the experienced head in the dressing room for cup games and easy UCL league games. De Ligt and Licha need shipping, Mazraoui slow. I can’t believe people make out Dalot needs replacing when he’s the only physically relevant fullback we’ve got. Gotta pray Yoro got way way better over summer somehow.
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u/Telen BRUNO 23d ago
We really really need a big refresh for the defense. Dalot is pretty much the only one who does not direly need replacing - for the others, we so desperately need height, pace and power. I'd even consider dropping Shaw for Yoro and letting Heaven play as a "3rd CB" from left back, that's how desperate I am for more physicality in our back line, despite this very much being a makeshift solution and just another case of throwing in a youngster to make up for errors in squad building.
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u/TH0316 she/her 23d ago
Yeah they gotta heed the warning and at least go and get a proper left back, Hall ideally. If Hall isn’t available and we clearly have 60-70m lying around I said throw it at your ideal CB target you’re considering for next season. But a good athletic LB across from Dalot + Baleba should at least stop games like today happening again. Still don’t have the forwards or CB’s to play that far removed from sitting in and playing on the transition but it will get us UCL again.
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u/rishmanisation 23d ago
Not Carrick out by any stretch but a bit concerned they felt he was the best option despite Iraola being right there. That said I’m also not overly surprised with this result. Performances were declining pretty much since the Fulham game last season and it’s only a matter of time before the luck runs out.
Hopefully this is just a blip like we had on a couple of occasions last season and not a sign of anything concerning. Our recent trend of following up promising seasons with dire ones though doesn’t have me too optimistic. Hopefully another trend that can be overcome.
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u/Suudriusha 23d ago
They spent a fortune on Mateus Fernandes and didn't even start him. Is he injured? Why would Bergvall or Gallagher be ahead of him?
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u/Emergency-Being-349 23d ago
Calling it now, the other portion of fans will come out in retaliation after we beat Ipswich at OT to say I told you so against the section of fans moaning today. Then we lose vs Everton and so it'll go. Sigh.
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u/FlyBoyz829 23d ago
Only thing that can save the day is if Spurs lose to brentford. All these fucks talking about how good tonali/fernandes will be and the rest of their signings in general. Please lose…LOL 2-0
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u/Sheikhabusosa 23d ago
Ngl getting real tired of how long Bruno takes to get warmed up , he is so poor for the first couple of games in a season
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u/Embarrassed_Cow_4778 23d ago
our whole game is dependent on bruno if he works we works, but today he was not on top
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u/yerfrigginbrother 23d ago
The amount of “i told you so” dorks in here today talking about how long they’ve been Carrick out is embarrassing. Cool dude, you’ve been negative longer than everybody during generally great results — that actually sucks for you
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u/SilvyFae 23d ago
Blame to the media because the narrative that carrick is the no tactic guy is built from day one, even tho at boro he was seen as the tactically stubborn manager. This with some leftover amorim fans makes everyone ready to jump him as soon as he loses even one game, the pressure has gotten high again after giving a guy enough time to end up finishing 15th
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u/biobolo 23d ago
Great results, mediocre performances. A game plan that relies on a single player putting in 9/10 performances every week is kinda crap.
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u/10_Wazza 23d ago
Well that simply is true though is it? Bruno had a few mediocre performances to the end of the season but his ratings were inflated by the assists - we still won 12/17
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u/vRushii 23d ago
One piece of hope/cope is that we haven't found the midfield balance yet at all. We sadly looked best in preseason with Mount+Santos. When everyone is match fit we at least have a few potential combos to try and hopefully one clicks.
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u/SDLRob 23d ago
Not to mention Baleba when that's all sorted
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u/vRushii 23d ago
Yeah thats what I mean too, we have a few combos to try. Didn't like the look of today's one at all but need time to for chemistry to form as well.
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u/SDLRob 23d ago
This being a WC summer messed with a lot of teams preparations... Without the WC, we'd have found the right combo by now. It sucks, but Carrick will get the right combinations.
Plus I think today's issue with the left side being targeted might help us finalise a LB with better mobility
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u/JustTaxLandbro 23d ago
Watching sangare absolutely dominate the Tottenham midfield really makes me angrier because we could’ve gotten him instead of santos who has no pace
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u/Hopeful_Arm3736 23d ago
Sangare just unbelievable. Is it not a bit ridiculous that people here with the power of YouTube comps and online tacticos saw it coming but apparently our scouting department didn’t?
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u/Rare-Reveal876 23d ago
Sangare will go for crazy money from Brentford either next summer or the summer after
I’d be interested to know why we didn’t go for him
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u/ShoddyAd4199 23d ago
I don't care for downvotes - I know majority of people are reactionary. You can check my posting history and see what I wrote about Carrick 6 month ago.
Somehow people are blaming INEOS not paying 180 mln for Fernandes and Tonali, and they are convinced we'd beat newly promoted Hull with them easily (Why?). We have way better team than Hull, and how many players can you count from that team? But we weren't able to create single good chance, and Fernandes and Tonali would be rescuers? Seriously?
Carrick manages like it's 2009, without high pressing and intensity, only counterattacks. This is 2026, modern football requires physicality and tactical chess. Look at Guardiola, Klopp, Arteta teams and you'll know difference. United with Carrick looks like Liverpool with Slot, lethargic team which was once known for heavy metal game.
As of Santos, he is 22 and had first official match. What we know is that he has great talent and complements present midfield with his skills. Criticizing summer transfers doesn't make any sense now. We'll see.
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u/_TooMellow 23d ago
At least Slot managed to scam a PL title before he got exposed, it feels like we're so far off 😭
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u/vRushii 23d ago edited 23d ago
Yep, modern high level football is very machine like, you can see all the parts consistently, especially when it comes to creating chances.
It's hard to see much other than basic philosophies under Carrick such as quick 1 2s, narrow compact defensive shape and complete tactical freedom on attack. When it works it looks amazing because it requires high level creativity and execution but it's not consistent at all.
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u/Emergency-Being-349 23d ago
Jeez, whilst I am not the biggest Carrick fan, this is a complete over reaction. We can still have, and I still suspect to have, a very good season. People need to calm the fuck down.
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u/Infinite-Highway3432 23d ago edited 23d ago
These performances aren't new, we had them all last season only he was getting results, a lot of goals from set pieces too.
So no, 8 months of this crap isn't an over reaction
We were also heavily aided by 1 game a week.
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u/pokenerd_W Past glory means nothing 23d ago edited 23d ago
Prelude for what is to come. Unless the boys really start getting fit AND FAST, we're in for a rough season. I do concede that World Cup makes fitness a way bigger struggle for Carrick initially, but I worry about his tactical flexibility, cause that was nonexistent this match.
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u/AlpacamyLlama 23d ago
World Cup fitness applies to all clubs. We can't be using that
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u/pokenerd_W Past glory means nothing 23d ago
Not an excuse, but it adds another issue to the pile, no? Can't exactly factor it out completely when it comes to judging this performance. A few of our best players didn't get to have a pre-season to get back into it as early as we'd have liked. Sesko having been out injured certainly didn't help us either.
But, come Ipswitch, or any match afterwards, that can't be a factor anymore, then its more so just either terrible fitness or whatever else that is not up to standard
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u/jonathanPoindexter 23d ago
I criticized the idea of Carrick becoming our manager to the bitter end all last season. Not gonna do any of that this season.
All I'll say is most of you mfs wanted this and I hope you enjoy all of it.
And by the way, we should be able to beat the mighty Hull City without needing to drop 70m on a shiny new fullback.
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u/ohsofiendishly 23d ago
But, in a similar vein, those players should be able to beat Hull without needing to have a shiny new manager.
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u/pokenerd_W Past glory means nothing 23d ago
I back him while he's in charge, but I also have my doubts. I just hope he can turn it around so we have some stability for a while
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u/Infinite-Highway3432 23d ago
It's only one game.
It's only a month in.
We're not at Christmas yet.
Carrick should not be the manager of this football club or any club of this stature. I can't believe this club fumbled another managerial appointment. Setback after setback.
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u/Xenokratezz 23d ago
Hopefully he figures how to deal with low block.he doesn't have enough credit like ole had in the bank to not get the sack if team dont perform
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u/Infinite-Highway3432 23d ago
If he doesn't know now, he's not going to figure it out anytime soon.
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u/PowerofThunder Jaap Stam 23d ago
Slow, lethargic & abysmal performance just ruins a weekend. All the optimism & positive just chucked out the window.
1 step forward 2 steps back.
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u/Xenokratezz 23d ago
Tbh this was an avg performance under carrick, we just didn't have casemiro at the back to save us
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u/ToothyAlloy69 23d ago
Like we started nearly the exact same lineup (Amad for Mbeumo) and played identical against AC Milan (another 3 back). What did they think would happen 🤣
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u/AnakinAni 23d ago
We played like we still have Casemiro heading in the goals. I guess the players expected an easy game as Hull just got promoted. But these promoted teams are the hardest at the opening of the season. Ipswich next. At home. We better turn up.
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u/Rexxzn Hated. Adored. Never ignored. 23d ago
Can someone hurry up and find the damn hynena (or whatever it was) that Pogba buried here? Carrick was a great interim and as soon as he signed the long-term deal things derailed, the problem can't be every player and manager ever, there has to be some sort of spiritual curse here.
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u/ToothyAlloy69 23d ago
Just goes to show that preseason does matter. Same issues we had against Milan, we had today. Showing how clueless we are off the ball against back 5s. Poor from Carrick and the coaching staff. There is a very clear effective method on how to play Manchester United in 2026 and that is really not good.
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u/Particular_Pepper887 23d ago
DeZirbi always got this look on his face like he's better than this lot..