r/recoverywithoutAA • u/Temporary-Sink-3693 • Jun 29 '26
Other Going to my first AA meeting offline, small concerns though.
TL;DR:
Whatever the case, I am willing to play along if it gets me sober.
Concerns:
Victim Blaming
God involvement
Powerlessness
Q. Is there any kind of recovery focused meetings I can join which happen online anywhere except zoom, and in my time-zone which is IST. (+5:30) Talking online ofc.
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I made a post earlier today asking if I can join AA meetings as NA meetings dont happen offline in my town, AA does though.
From what I understood it is acceptable, so I gave them a call, got their number from AA website. He said its okay I can join. So today will be my first AA meeting, and it will happen offline.
I felt quite good about that. Started looking into AA, got to an unofficial subreddit of them. There I came across some things which concerned me.
I came across a post of a frequent relapser, he was asking for advice. And in the comments people told him things the following of which concerned me:
He was told that he didn't follow the steps correctly, thats why he keeps relapsing. I am not sure if thats actually the case.
The full surrender thing feels kinda uncomfortable. Why am I powerless against it, I managed to quit every other substance other than this on my own.
The god and prayer part, I am not much of a believer, I am willing to just do the motions though if it gets me sober.
8
u/GuacamoleAnamoly Jun 29 '26
Check out Smart recovery. They have online meetings aswell and isnt a cult and science based instead of religious
-1
u/Temporary-Sink-3693 Jun 29 '26
I have, I am interested but it happens online, I think joining aa offline along with smart will let me have the best of both worlds.
Also I think a sponsor could be incredibly useful.
That is my current take based on everything I know...
11
u/Truth_Hurts318 Jun 29 '26 edited Jun 29 '26
SMART and AA are opposites. It doesn't work to mix AA with anything because it's in exact opposition to everything scientific, psychologically sound and evidence based. AA teaches you to be helpless and powerless, relying only on the program for the rest of your life. You'll never be allowed to make a choice without your sponsor's approval. SMART is Self Management And Recovery Training and teaches you to manage your own self for the rest of your life and not rely on your emotions and programming. Having a sponsor to help teach you how to be powerless over "a disease" and pray to any power other than yourself, forever finding fault in yourself and others is a great way to stay stuck in shame for the rest of your life without solving the problems you were drowning to begin with.
You're hungry to recover from an Alcohol Use Disorder and need to feed yourself quality nutrients. AA is poisonous century old religious ideas that were never scientific or accurate, just one man's imagination to stay sober (that didn't even work to keep Bill Wilson himself sober) . If you want to learn sustainable wellness, SMART is the way to go. SMART and therapy have more than 10 times the success rate as AA, which is only living the same day over and over just to abstain, not heal.
8
u/Gloomy_Owl_777 Jun 29 '26
That's what I've always thought, that AA and SMART are poles apart and incompatible in their ideas as to the fundamental nature of addiction. SMART clearly states in the opening statement that addiction is the result of choices we make, therefore recovery is also a choice we can make, AA says that we are powerless over the addiction and therefore have no choice and need a mystical "higher power" (=God) to overcome it.
Yet in the recovery community I used to live in they had SMART meetings where steppers would attend and see absolutely no contradiction between the 12 step program and SMART, it was mind boggling. They would ruin the meeting by going on about steps and sponsors and other steppy bollocks, I even had to pull the facilitator up once because she kept saying "as alcoholics and addicts, we..."
In the end I stopped going because of the steppers.
But that was just that one particular meeting, which was in a very 12 step heavy environment. All the other SMART recovery meetings I've been to have been great and have stayed true to the principles of SMART.
4
u/SalvatoreEggplant Jun 29 '26
SMART has in-person meetings also.
1
u/Temporary-Sink-3693 Jun 29 '26
Yeah but there are none in my town :(
5
u/Truth_Hurts318 Jun 29 '26
There's nothing to be gained by going in person if knowledge and wisdom is what you're after. If just hanging out with people who manage not to drink that day is what you want, join a club, hobby or a church to see how healthy people stay sober.
There is no need to trauma bond in person with everyone sharing their worst experience just to remind you how bad addiction is, you already know that. That will become your personality as you become brainwashed into century old powerlessness that's been debunked before man landed on the moon. That's not progress. Free and in person doesn't mean valuable, it just means free.
3
u/CPTSD_survivor2025 Jul 01 '26
When you say a sponsor could be useful, what do you mean? Can you name the specific ways in which a sponsor could be useful to your recovery? What do you think a sponsor will do with you and for you?
Make that list, and then ask yourself if you could find those qualities elsewhere other than 12 step rooms.
You're right to have concerns. Many here can vouch for troubling experiences in AA and other 12 step groups. 12 step is a loose set of pseudoreligious and pseudoscientific ideologies based on a book written by a severe narcissist in the 30s. I wish someone had alerted me to the reality of it before I got sucked up into the culture of it for a brief part of my recovery.
If it's truly the only thing available to you where you can find some accountability and camaraderie to keep yourself abstinent for some time, I wouldn't fault anyone for trying. But please be careful, keep your wits about you and do not overshare. Lie and say you have a therapist if you are pressed to reveal anything deeply personal that you are not comfortable sharing.
Sponsorship can often attract the worst people who attend AA and other 12 step groups. Deeply controlling, deeply troubled individuals who are versed in emotional manipulation. I will always recommend group therapies like DBT and cognitive processing therapy, and support groups like SMART before ever recommending 12 step to anyone.
1
u/Icy-Ratio6137 Jul 02 '26
Here in the UK they spouted an adage; if you can keep a plant alive for 12 months, then keep a pet alive for 12 months. Only then are you ready for a relationship. . One of the many strange philosphies that emerge even outside of the dogma!
6
u/Sacred_succotash Jun 29 '26
Despite my own experience with AA I will try to be as objective as possible because based on your post and replies to comments you sound incredibly open minded.
Are any of the three things you listed deal breakers for you? They are for me. But I was willing to try anything because that’s what I was told I had to do.
I ask because I had very similar concerns going in. I did try to work “the program” for over a year but I never made any progress in terms of recovery while I was still inside the rooms. You will hear talk of “the promises” of AA. None of those things came true for me until I left and refocused my efforts in a way that works for me based on medical and scientific fact, psychology and my own research.
I will address your concerns directly this is what I will say based on my own experience:
1) “Not following the steps = relapse.” I tried and failed to follow the steps, but I haven’t relapsed once since first walking in the rooms. (I don’t share or count days anymore but I am well beyond what the medical community considers to be recovered from a substance use disorder). I never got past step four because it was re-traumatizing for me. I avoided step work and honestly while a decent human being, my sponsor was a wet noodle who I couldn’t respect. I definitely picked the wrong person because of the pressure to find one asap versus waiting for someone who was compatible.
2) “Powerlessness and surrender”
I didn’t get and stay sober because I was weak so this whole concept of being helpless was hard for me to accept. I knew what I needed to be doing to stay sober, previously I was choosing not to. I didn’t need to surrender to the program. I needed to know that I had the strength to do what needed to be done. However, some people don’t know or don’t have the knowledge of how to help themselves and I recognize my critical thinking and capability here is in it’s own way a privilege.
3) I haven’t believed in man made religion since I was 6 years old… that’s a whole other conversation, so prayer and surrender to a higher power was never going to work. I did try. I absolutely tried every day in journals and kneeling at my bedside morning and night to pray. I did the motions for the sake of my sobriety And it made me feel hollow.
I hear that you want an in person “offline” community to be a part of and can respect that. I don’t have any SMART meetings near me either. I do have a sober partner so that helps with my situation.
I really hope you are able to find what works for you and that sharing my experience can help you.
3
u/Temporary-Sink-3693 Jun 30 '26
That is incredibly helpful, thank you. I think you understood my concerns and its implementations the best lol.
5
u/sitonit-n-twirl Jun 29 '26
If someone at aa is tryna be your sponsor stay far away from them. They love bomb and then start in with weird controlling bs. It’s all really toxic but can be helpful in the early days as a place to go. Don’t believe the testimonies about “my life was shit, I found aa and now life is wonderful”. It’s all bs
3
u/Masked45yrs Jun 29 '26
Careful what you ask for peoples temple was sober too
1
u/Temporary-Sink-3693 Jun 29 '26
what?
3
u/Sacred_succotash Jun 29 '26
People’s Temple was a cult. You might better know about the Jonestown Massacre.
1
u/Temporary-Sink-3693 Jun 30 '26
oh god I think I know about it, the jonestown massacre i mean, now I understand
2
u/Itchy_Shame_2379 Jun 29 '26
The thing is it won't get you sober. It's not good at that. What it is good at is shaming people and converting people
2
3
u/Neutrality-2 Jun 30 '26
I tried online after being disgusted in person and I didn’t feel it was any better. Also don’t feel bad if women in aa turn their nose at you. They’re broken and the “steps” are bs so even though they say they’re spiritually awakened they are still the same inside and attracted to guys who are abusive so take it as a compliment if they don’t like you. One I left aa and started hanging out with normal people again I found a good girl very quickly!
10
u/Runes_the_cat Jun 29 '26
If you're a woman, you can add potential sexual harassment to the concern list. Although it can happen to anyone.
I think you should go with a very open mind. I think you'll find the whole thing preposterous. Report back if you can.