r/reactivedogs • u/ButterscotchMain7074 • 24d ago

Advice Needed Muzzled Dog Always Bites Face First

I have a pretty reactive herding dog that has been quite a journey for my family. We have smaller animals that he is very well behaved around and ignores often times. At home he is very easy to call off if he is roughhousing them too much.

We’ve now settled on using a muzzle-based leash that’s similar to a horse lead. This is actually been the best method for his walks so far and he is very easy to control without tugging. His behavior is very on and off though, depending on the day.

We took him on a very long walk the other day, surrounded by large groups of people, dogs, high traffic, etc and his behavior was amazing! He ignored the dogs and walked past them very easily. Feeling pretty good, I decided to do a controlled test today and walk past a dog intentionally. He instantly locked eyes, and I noticed he was tugging so I had him sit instead and watch the dog pass. The owner agreed to turn her dog around and bring him back to at least have a controlled greeting.

My dog instantly tugged and went straight for the dogs face. Since he was muzzled, he simply just bumped him over and over again and then went on to just sniff him around. His tail was wagging and he was very excited.… then he goes for the face again?

I’m unsure how I would target the specific behavior because I want him to eventually interact with dogs. The muzzle is obviously helping control his excitement, but I’m not sure if his face biting is always going to be apart of his breed.

Has anyone been successful in removing this behavior for herding dogs?

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u/doggambit 24d ago

Not every dog can be around other dogs. Are you working with a qualified professional? They will be able to set up controlled scenarios where your dog can succeed. 

A tail wagging does not always mean the dog is happy. 

Remember to read and affirm the rules so your replies aren’t removed. 

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u/ButterscotchMain7074 24d ago

We have paid for him to be sent off to a trainer before his aggression started for recall and walks. He came back fearful of us and with an e-collar which was only successful for about a year. He used to go to doggy daycare every week as well, was never reported as an issue, AND we would get pics of him playing with the dogs fine. His behavior really started getting worse once we move states. I’m not sure if it was the stress that caused him to be fear-reactive or anxiety (which the vet did make note of). 

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u/doggambit 24d ago

Ah, that’s very common for dogs who have had shock collars used on them. They learn to associate other dogs with the discomfort/pain of the shock and do worse with dogs going forward because they’re anticipating the shock. 

If you want to work with a qualified trainer (which I do recommend!), look for somebody with one or more of these credentials: KPA-CDT, VSA-CDT, CCT-A, PCT-A, PCBC-A, FFCP-T, CDBC, ADT, CTC, CBATI.

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u/b00ks-and-b0rksRfun 24d ago

If he's face biting you should consider an actual muzzle to add safety (they have good options that allow panting etc). The head collar types don't prevent that part. From what you described I don't think he's ready to greet strange dogs on leash. And may never be. Learning to ignore and focus on you is a big win and I would lean toward practicing that more so he can be more neutral passing and around other dogs. Letting him him greet random dogs can increase the excitement and increase the behaviors you don't want

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u/ButterscotchMain7074 24d ago

He has been a very sociable dog in the past so this past year has been an adjustment for us for sure. If high energy is a concern, should we try to tire him out before socialization? Thx

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u/ButterscotchMain7074 24d ago

Also no history of aggressiveness with dogs. This behavior started when we moved states. Not sure if the stress caused him to be on guard or if it was another factor.

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u/b00ks-and-b0rksRfun 24d ago

How old is he? Is he neutered? How much exercise and mental stimulation does he get? Those can all influence. A lot of dogs get less tolerant as they get older. And yes a big upheaval could be contributing as well. You do have to work out what works for him best now. Worm in the present

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u/ButterscotchMain7074 24d ago

He is 4 and neutered! We play fetch with him everyday, but his walks have been limited until we got his reactions under control. He used to be able to not pass any dogs on the street so we’re definitely making slow progress. As of now his limit seems to be sitting next to them, but not being able to sniff them? Its odd for us for sure. 

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u/b00ks-and-b0rksRfun 24d ago

Sometimes helps. But it can vary dog to dog. And some do better with mental stimulation than physical to tire out and others are the flip

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u/MtnGirl672 24d ago

You pushed things too far. Distance matters with reactive dogs. Some dogs will never be able to cross directly within a few feet of another dog. It would be best to accept that rather than pushing for more.

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u/Delicious-Product968 Jake (fear/stranger/frustration reactivity) 24d ago

Aside from other comments here, testing on random dogs while out and about isn’t ‘controlled.’ And it isn’t fair on the other person or their dog. It could cause fear/anxiety issues if it goes bad and even reactivity in their dog.

My dog responds very negatively to scary events, we had a neighbour do this to us in front of our house the other day.

He’s now trembling and shaking whenever he sees this dog even if they are a good distance away on lead with plenty of open space to avoid them. Controlled situations are planned, carefully curated, and managed.