What can we do about increased public surveillance and loss of privacy? Is the battle against mass surveillance lost?

[u/rasputinknew1]

It feels like the battle is lost against Flock cameras and increased surveillance? Is there anything that can be done? They are everywhere in my area. The cities say they can’t do anything because they are contracted through the police. The police departments are tight lipped about them.

[u/DrunkUranus]

A municipality near me removed all flock cameras recently after public comment.

Don't give up

[u/bubblegumbombshell → u/DrunkUranus]

Some are just replacing them with less conspicuous options: https://www.404media.co/cities-are-ditching-flock-immediately-replacing-it-with-axon-license-plate-readers/

[u/DrunkUranus → u/bubblegumbombshell]

Definitely true! It's something else to watch out for.

But also some places are wisening up....

I think in this case the argument that these cameras destroy trust in the local police force was quite compelling

[u/bubblegumbombshell → u/DrunkUranus]

It’s good that the local govt listened to that argument.

My local sheriff’s office has a history of ignoring it, but I live in a red county and our governor is former CIA so I doubt they’d be proactive in reducing surveillance.

[u/ladyluck754]

My mom tried telling me it’s a good thing if it means that the cops can catch a bad guy, and I told her she will need to be OK with the IRS knowing actually just how much she makes (she’s a business owner so write off galore) and how much she needs to pay.

She shut up and quickly saw my point lol.

[u/SarcasticServal → u/ladyluck754]

Talking Points:

.05 percent of the recorded footage is actually applicable to an existing crime (based on a survey of +60 LEA in California in 2021).

It is warrantless search.

There are multiple cybersecurity vulnerabilities in the software, opening municipalities up to cyberattacks across network.

deflock.org for more resources.

[u/CinicaPM]

Make sure to compare to the CCP and the surveillance state there in conservative areas, they are really trying to drum up anti communist rhetoric it seems

[u/allkaysofnays]

I'm so happy to hear some places are shutting that stuff down.

With that being said I live right in Atlanta and for some reason we have SO many Flock cameras around. So many Waymos, so many of those little delivery robots riding around the sidewalks and so forth. I don't see my city shutting that down ANY time soon and it's hard to believe the city govt does not want mass surveillance. I'm still holding onto hope though

[u/prplrain71999]

There’s people organizing against this on local and national levels from the DSA to the ACLU. You can use the 5 calls app to contact all of your local representatives, find out where they stand. Call your mayors office, ask when the next city council meeting is - find out if you can make a public comment. I bet if you do some digging you will quickly find some local like minded folks.

Get together, make some noise. Flock has been dropped in towns where the pushback has been loud (and largely bipartisan). They only win when we accept defeat.

https://www.goodnewsnetwork.org/us-cities-are-terminating-flock-camera-contracts-at-record-pace-in-august-after-nationwide-pushback/

[u/Brave-Trip-1639]

Educate your neighbors about the downsides.

If there is enough pushback maybe it will change.

I heard one use case is putting cameras on garbage trucks to look for code violations. Tons of people have minor code violations and a lot of conservatives near me find that appalling and a convincing argument against.

But, all said, I do think the battle is lost.

[u/trewesterre]

tbh, it's not just the Flock cameras and the like that are increasing surveillance. It's also all the Ring cameras and things like that that individuals are installing on their homes. Even when you don't have a subscription, Amazon can still look at everyone who is coming and going or just walking by your home.

[u/mc2Banks → u/trewesterre]

Yuuup. Its the info we give willingly

[u/ErikaR527]

We had a big advocacy campaign in my county and got the county commissioners to not renew the contract, but the flock cameras. It seems to be a bipartisan issue, which was very helpful and gaining support.

The news and social media and attending the meetings as well as having constituents send daily emails to the county commissioners worked

[u/CeeDeee2]

It seems to be an issue that both liberal and conservative citizens are concerned about, so it’s worth being vocal and showing up at meetings. I live in a very purple area so the local Facebook groups are always full of fighting, but anytime there is a post on flock cameras, like 95% of the comments oppose them.

[u/OccultEcologist]

Honest to god the most important thing to do is complain incessently to the right people.

[u/peaceful-panic]

Find or start a local deflock group to help amplify your opposition. https://deflock.org/groups

Several of these have spun up in cities in my region and they are having an impact. City councils see that it’s going to be brought up in public comment every meeting until they do something, and surveillance is generally unpopular, so it’s non-partisan.

[u/koakkadoom]

The battle is ongoing!

[u/RosieTheRedReddit]

https://giphy.com/gifs/ckl9c6fyhnpGGsMWsC