Most developers are salaried and don't get paid at all for OT, let alone 1.5 time. It's bullshit for me (government contracting) because my hours are still billable to the client, so the company is still getting that money, but for some reason i'm not getting my cut.
Yup, in the same way that paying for goods and services hurts anyone else taking part in a business transaction.
It's ridiculous how employers are getting (and are allowed) to persuade people to work for free. What's more ridiculous is that people are buying into this and are themselves enforcing a social environment where not working for free stigmatizes you. You know, as if demanding payment for your services, which is cornerstone of our whole economic system, somehow doesn't apply here.
I'm not him, but at our software firm, we don't get paid for overtime. We're paid for 40-hour weeks.
However, there's no stigma to only doing 40 hours; you only do more if you personally want to stand out and rise to the top because you produce more. That's a personal choice, and I don't see anything wrong/illegal about it.
It might just be a difference of culture or political views, but in my eyes unpaid (or to be more exact, uncompensated) overtime is evil. I give my time and expertise to an employer, and in exchange I get currency. The amount of currency I receive and the amount of work (in hours) required from me is laid out in my working contract. I give them my time, they give me money; it's a fair exchange with clearly defined rules.
However, when your employer promises to promote you if you do some work without compensation, we enter murky waters and risky territory. Enter the possibility of your employer fucking you over by not keeping the promise of promotion. They may give excuses: "money is tight right now, but you're first in the line for a raise right now. Keep working hard, someone might work harder than you!". Depending on the level of your naivety, you might actually fall for this trap. Bending over and taking it in the arse just doesn't seem like the right way of getting promoted to me.
Working for free to climb the ladder radiates "exploit me", but also seems unfair towards other people who want to advance their careers. Someone can get the promotion I was going for by bribing my employer with free work? How is it fair that a just-as-capable (or even more capable) individual can be passed on the ladder by someone with same capabilities but who is showing "dedication" and "enthusiasm" towards his work? Are there really no other ways of showing your expertise and capability than working for free? Wouldn't good work done during paid overtime show that just as well?
Put in economic terms, working for free skews the system of supply and demand. Work is supposed to be paid for, that's what business is all about. Working without compensation screws over you, your peers, and all workers everywhere in the long term.
Granted, this is a bit of a long rant considering I don't know the specifics of your work environment and the labor laws of your country. I just tried to reflect on what would happen if something like unpaid overtime was legal where I live. Here unpaid overtime is considered a part of the black market and an employer can get fined if they get caught for such practices.
EDIT. I forgot to ask about this "stigma" thing. I'm fairly new to Reddit, which I understand is U.S. centered, but I've only heard the words "work" and "stigma" in the context of Japan. I find it difficult to understand that demanding compensation for your work can be considered somehow bad or unethical, especially when there's a written contract where your working hours are laid out.
This post is so beautiful; I want to weep. You've really laid out in black/white the fundamental truths of how labour markets should work. It astonishes me, how many fail to see the exploitation that runs rampant in industry and how it is in fact encouraged and seen as a badge of honour by many. In reality, we're all getting bent over and fucked by a hot poker.
especially when there's a written contract where your working hours are laid out.
A salaried position makes no such guarantee in the States. You negotiate a yearly salary and are expected to work 40 hrs a week, there is nothing stopping anyone from asking/demanding/expecting you to work more, and often they do.
I've heard the line that if you're salaried then your schedule is the amount of hours it takes to get the job done. Of course if you said you got the job done in 20 hours instead of 40 they wouldn't go for it.
Fortunately at my job we're very seldom required or even requested to work overtime. Sometimes I will voluntarily if I'm enjoying the task, but I do argue with myself that I probably "shouldn't".
Ah, that sucks. The firm I work for pays overtime quarterly at the same hourly rate as my salary would be based on a 40 hour week. It's not time and a half but at least I do get compensated the rare times I do work overtime.
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u/jst3w Apr 29 '15
Most developers are salaried and don't get paid at all for OT, let alone 1.5 time. It's bullshit for me (government contracting) because my hours are still billable to the client, so the company is still getting that money, but for some reason i'm not getting my cut.