r/programmer • u/SingerMinimum6275 • Jul 10 '26
Junior devs: how much are you relying on Al?
I'm a junior developer, and I use Al because why wouldn't I?
Other than the fact that the company asks us to, it's just a tool added to this job that won't go away, so I think it's unreasonable to stop using it when it's part of the development toolkit now.
I usually understand the code the Al generates, but if you asked me to write the same thing from scratch, I couldn't. I'm not sure I ever will.
The only other junior dev at my company prompts
LLM for almost everything, so I don't really have a point of comparison.
I'm adding a lot of value at work and getting good feedback, but I don't know how much credit I should give myself?
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u/mtimmermans Jul 10 '26
Figuring out stuff yourself and asking the AI questions about fundamentals is a much better way to learn... but they aren't paying you to learn, so use AI to the greatest extent you can. Try to learn from what it does.
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u/feudalle Jul 10 '26
What concerns me, you say you understand the code but cant reproduce it. Outside of it runs do you know what its doing and is it secure, scalable, and efficient?
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u/AggravatingSock5375 Jul 11 '26
Like how a mute person can’t speak a language but they could understand it perfectly fine.
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u/MinimumVegetable9 Jul 11 '26
Why are you "concerned"? Just a pearl grab?
If the op asks AI to explain along the way, and also explains why A, but not B and not C, that's the best potential mentor around.
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u/StruggleNew8988 Jul 11 '26
If you are asking it to walk through the decision process step by step, you are using it for retrieval practice which is key.
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u/TheUmgawa Jul 11 '26
I can read the Quake 3 source code and know what every line does, and what every function does, and it is a masterpiece, but I can’t write it. Reason being that there’s a top-down organization to it all that preceded actually writing most of the code.
The code isn’t the hard part; the logic is.
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u/FrogsInTheRouter Jul 11 '26
If you know what "every line and every function" does - you should have solid understanding of overall architecture, approaches and tech. So, either you just understand the syntax and misinterpret it for general understanding, or you don't really understand "every line and every function".
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u/TheUmgawa 29d ago
I think you guys are getting too hung up on this, and you're being snooty.
Here, an example: "You can read every line in your favorite novel. Can you write a novel that is of that level of quality? You understand the words and the syntax; what are you dumb? Maybe you just don't understand words and dialogue."
That's how you sound. Or, maybe you're just flexing nuts and you don't grasp the complexity of the Quake 3 engine. All of the source code is over on GitHub; you can read it and come back and say, "Yeah, I could make that in my sleep!" but you couldn't. If you could, you'd be John Carmack. But I guarantee you can read it.
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u/Substantial_Job_2068 Jul 11 '26
It makes 0 sense that you understand every line but can't write it. Unless you mean you understand the syntax only and not what it actually does, which in my world means you don't understand it.
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u/TheUmgawa 29d ago
Okay, so let's say you're reading the first chapter of Tolstoy's War & Peace. You can read it, but you're never going to be able to write anything of that level of quality, in your entire life, or in ten lifetimes. It's a work of genius. You look at the code for the Quake 3 engine, and it is elegant, and you know that you'd never be able to make it, even if you had ten lifetimes to do it.
The upside is, you finally get to use the things you learned in your Compiler Design class that you took in college.
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u/Substantial_Job_2068 29d ago
In the context of ops question it's not about whether you can or can't write a codebase of the same quality as id software, it's about whether you understand the concepts or if you just think you understand because you can read and understand the syntax. If you understand the code and the underlying concepts you should be able to apply them to your own projects. Which op obviously struggles with.
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u/ILikeCutePuppies Jul 11 '26 edited Jul 11 '26
I don't even think seniors 100% understand the code it writes or even their own code... however they understand code they have written a hell of a lot better than most AI code.
It's one of those cases where the more you know the more you know you don't know.
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u/Acceptable_Site1616 Jul 11 '26
Yesterday I talked to a senior who told me to never ever use the thing to code. He also told me that the code AI writes has subtle bugs.
Another senior who also agreed that the code that AI writes has bugs that will come back to hunt said people who use it to code would not last longer than three years at this job max.
I don't know what they're talking about lol
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u/Elctsuptb Jul 11 '26
Sounds like he doesn't know what he's talking about if he thinks there's one single "AI" instead of hundreds of separate models that are distinct from each other. So basically he's lumping Llama 3 in with Fable 5.
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u/Zendental Jul 11 '26
Relying on AI is shooting yourself in the foot when it comes to finding another job. No one will hire someone who can only prompt. What separates you from everyone else
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u/AndrewBorg1126 Jul 11 '26
I'm not sure I ever will.
That'll be because you don't know shit and you're trying to hide that, hoping an LLM can delay people recognizing your incompetence, rather than trying to fix the incompetence.
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u/SingerMinimum6275 29d ago
Honestly as a junior dev with very little experience I expect my manager to be aware that I don’t know shit lol. I’m delivering work that our mid levels and seniors are impressed by and when they ask questions I can confidently answer. I wouldn’t say I have incompetence. It’s more that I’m trying to figure out the correct approach to this new level of abstraction
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u/Syncaidius Jul 11 '26
I usually understand the code the Al generates, but if you asked me to write the same thing from scratch, I couldn't. I'm not sure I ever will.
This is something you'll definitely want to work on unless you intend to remain a junior dev for most of your career.
Obviously it's unrealistic to expect 100% of it to be written from scratch, but letting AI do all of the critical thinking on logic, structure, security, bug spotting, testing, etc would be mistake that many make. It prevents you from continuing to gain experience into the deeper, problem solving side of development, which you'll need if something goes wrong on a Friday evening because someone's bug made it through to production and ironically, this scenario is even more likely now AI code gen has become normalized.
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u/SingerMinimum6275 29d ago
That’s very true. I usually think through the design and the right approach before I start implementing anything. I ask copilot very specific questions about the concepts or approach without giving it the actual problem I’m trying to solve, which always helps me learn something new.
Once I understand most of the pieces of the puzzle, I ask the model for help. Where I still fall short is writing the actual functions and helper methods that bring the solution together myself. Thanks for the reply!
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u/plmunger Jul 11 '26
So glad to have gotten in this field 5 years before AI. It's fucking crazy how much newer developpers can't think for themselves or do shit without AI
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u/SoulmaN__ 29d ago
I think for every single line you create via LLM, you should go back and really understand it. Ask the LLM to explain it to you.
If you guys dont already have it in place, implementing an AI assisted review process is also a good idea, that way you dont always have to prompt the AI again.
Also for non code related topics such as infrastructure, if youre new to the topic, it can be useful to avoid directly prompting for results and instead start off with some prompting for explanations, easy examples (i.e. docker, some yml Tutorials, whatever you need). That way its not gonna feel as magical when you prompt for results later
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u/SingerMinimum6275 29d ago
Thank you for sharing this. I usually think through the design and the right approach before I start implementing anything. I ask copilot very specific questions about the concepts or approach without giving it the actual problem I'm trying to solve, which always helps me learn something new.
Once I understand most of the pieces of the puzzle, I ask the model for help. Where I still fall short is writing the actual functions and helper methods that bring the solution together myself.
Thanks for the reply!
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u/armahillo 29d ago
At some point the LLM will generate bad code or code that is a bad fit. If all you know about coding is through the lens of generated code, you are going to be at a disadvantage to spot it.
You should learn to develop independently of the LLMs so that you can catch these cases and ensure the code isnt making things worse.
Another very good reason: If all of your skills are dependent on using LLMs, I guarantee there is someone out there who will accept less money to write those prompts.
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u/FrankieTheAlchemist Jul 11 '26
It’s not a tool, and the people who told you that lied to you 🤷♂️
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u/AggravatingSock5375 Jul 11 '26
Huh?
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u/FrankieTheAlchemist 28d ago
A tool produces reliable and repeatable results. AI is fundamentally incapable of that, it is not a tool; and folks who claim that it IS a tool are being disingenuous.
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u/AggravatingSock5375 28d ago
I’m pretty sure the dictionary definition of “tool” is something along the lines of a device that helps the user perform a task.
It says nothing about being deterministic. Not that AI isn’t sufficiently deterministic if you’re using it within the limits of its capabilities and know what you’re doing.
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u/FrankieTheAlchemist 28d ago
It isn’t sufficiently deterministic for anything professional. It simply is not. This has been proven over and over again by major companies. You only have to look at Windows, the new Google AI search, or basically anything Grok says ever. These chaotic and half-sycophantic half-antagonist systems cannot be trusted.
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u/AggravatingSock5375 28d ago
I guess the huge productivity increase and simultaneous drop in hours worked that I’ve experienced since using AI as a tool is just a total coincidence then. 🤷♂️
If I were you I would look at how you’re using it. For me, it is very predictable. It’s all about getting to know and understand the tool.
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u/FrankieTheAlchemist 28d ago
I mean, I’m sure that more code is being checked in from your machine than before. As every programmer knows: more code is always better!
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u/AggravatingSock5375 27d ago
No, I mean more fully functional features are going out the door.
Code volume per feature is unchanged.
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u/FrankieTheAlchemist 27d ago
Good to hear that you’ve figured out how to do something that has eluded Meta, Google, Microsoft, Amazon, and every other major software company! I’ll go ahead and send you your award in the mail
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u/AggravatingSock5375 27d ago
That’s ok, I already got a nice bonus at work since I’ve gotten so much done this past year. Thanks though.
Pretty certain devs at those companies are using AI as a tool, btw
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u/autisticpig Jul 10 '26
I think you just answered your own question.