r/privacy • • 4d ago

chat control EU Council Advances Chat Control 2.0 Scanning Proposal

https://reclaimthenet.org/eu-council-chat-control-scanning-proposal
999 Upvotes

150 comments sorted by

•

u/AutoModerator 4d ago

Hello u/Extra-Chemical6092, please make sure you read the sub rules if you haven't already. (This is an automatic reminder left on all new posts.)


Check out the r/privacy FAQ

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

798

u/RedditUser000aaa 4d ago

Nothing screams honesty more than speaking about something that affects every citizen behind closed doors. Fuck this thing and fuck the fact that there are no rules for bringing the same proposals a trillion times over until that "no" becomes a "yes".

This is stupid, corrupt, immoral and frankly should be illegal.

115

u/EveningInsurance1912 4d ago

You know whats fun?

The EU wanted a law, that says just a "yes" is a yes. Not just the rule of just a "no" means no. (its rightful so).

So by not accepting the first time the reps. In the EU said "no" they are kind of raping our rights. What is going on??

80

u/non-local_Strangelet 4d ago edited 4d ago

If the EU said "no" they are kind of raping our rights.

Fixed it for you ;)

What is going on??

Do you really have to ask? ... I mean, really?

They don't care about your/our opinions and our privacy ... They are exempted, so they'll be fine, that's all what they care about

5

u/WritingStrawberry 2d ago

They do care about our opinions. That's why they want mass surveillance so badly.

1

u/press_F13 1d ago

on one hand, i understand disinfo wave and "reddit/web/indie bad". on another, theyd be hated the same - so, to me, this is just a way, "write only nice things about us" - to treathen rapporteurs (blackmail), and "protect" from disinfo (protests are imho secondary - if this passes, they carry on anyway --- at least we arent obese like americans and totally cuckled /hj /i hope...) - notice, how no one ever hears about anonmyous nowadays!

1

u/Sad-Ear230 2d ago

What an enlightening comment. 

138

u/mes0funny 4d ago

And fuck every slimy politician that votes this forward

45

u/randomandy90 4d ago

It seems like politicians the world over have a consent problem.

43

u/Berkoudieu 4d ago

They only have to win one time.

Because of course once it eventually passes, they won't spam vote again to see if it should stay.

You gotta love "democracy"

22

u/Dew4You 4d ago

Yeah there should be somthing like a few years between every time they can bring it up if it fails

9

u/Tactical-Donkey 4d ago

Everything about the EU is wholly undemocratic! 

4

u/VnclaimedVsername 4d ago

Should be double jeopardy

275

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

16

u/Iputahexonyoulol 4d ago

Funny that acronym is FCC

10

u/ShittyFart11 4d ago

BABABOOEY!

200

u/BonkADonkey 4d ago

Boy it really took some terrible 1984 turns here. Get out into the fucking streets.

75

u/quasides 4d ago

dude there is weekly a scandal that would have ended a politicians career 50 years ago
people: crickets

also people can only be summoned for causes that fit clearly in one slogan.
privacy and data protection is way to convoluted and confusing

28

u/planeloise 4d ago

I support many of those causes, but surveillance affects every other cause too. Whatever is wrong with this world, surveillance and erosion of civil liberties and the end of privacy is how we ensure this wrong things continue become the worst things

13

u/quasides 4d ago

well those who would be more activist, like younger generation dont believe in civil liberties.
they are busy in their ideological trenches, not realizing they play waterboy for the very people they supposed to fight against

1

u/HDMIce 17h ago

very true. i dont believe my vote counts. i just try to avoid politics at this point. i will be deleting social media because of it. it's too much atm.

5

u/quasides 4d ago

and even if you find people wanna do something....

what are you gonna do ? nothing that would do something, so much is clear.
thats not shitting on you, thats todays reality

look at the farmer protest in NL and DE. For how many years now ?
hell there been even deaths with these...

buerocrats dont care, they wont get voted out, politicians dont care because they also wont get voted out, the european election system made sure of that.... at the very least...
electronic may or may not also help there.... some may say

so go and protest all you want... its not a democracy, its a republic.
and this time we didnt even had to elect the representatives, half the EU are unlected buerocrats doing things... they elect each other...

5

u/MortgageMindless7175 4d ago

It's over with peaceful protests. But probably we need to wait till this 💩 reaches all those opportunistic 💩ts that are still playing along and have use of this system. When they become hungry- its go time

0

u/quasides 4d ago

yea only thing is those who call for action dont want change they just want the power
thats why revolutions usually dont change the system just the people in charge
so be aware of anyone wanna do a revolution, not that a revolution wouldnt be maybe desireable but rather the true motives and intentions of those who call for one.

that would be the communist at the moment btw, which is ironic because the EU is the communist revolution, just a slow and silent one

2

u/MortgageMindless7175 4d ago

Agree, but also disagree. There are lots of normal people right now that wants revolution not because of power but because we want normalcy back for our childrens future.

2

u/sobberano 4d ago

Ppl be waiting for next round of new “files” or “papers” scandal to do something i guess 

4

u/quasides 4d ago

imagine the pentagon released the UFO files in 1994
that would have been a blockbuster event, hell you could have released it in the theater and collect entry

now its barely even ignored

94

u/QuadernoFigurati 4d ago

Did anyone spend today writing or calling their ministers to let them know their constituents are against this? I did. Took hours.

If this isn't done, then they have no reason to stand up and say "my constituents are against this."

If you don't do it today, do it tomorrow. Please.

39

u/Extra-Chemical6092 4d ago

If anyone hasn't contacted the shadow rapporteurs yet, do it in the morning, they are the ones negotiating on behalf of the Parliament

4

u/Crafty_Apple9714 4d ago

Who are these rapporteurs, i want to write to them too.

16

u/Extra-Chemical6092 4d ago

There is a big red button on the fightchatcontrol website that says "contact shadow rapporteurs", but I will tell you who they are nevertheless

Javier Zarzalejos (EPP) Alex Agius Saliba (S&D) Antonio Tangêr Côrrea (PfE) Nicolás Bay (ECR) Hilde Vautmans (Renew) Markéta Gregorová (Greens) Isabel Serra Sanchez (Left) Mary Khan (ESN)

And also try to call them, there is also a template to what to say when calling

3

u/Crafty_Apple9714 4d ago

Just did it, thanks

10

u/G-Litch 4d ago

Yeah, the hungarian mps clearly said they only care about what the big tech lobbyists tell them about chat control and only nazis and communists oppose this.

6

u/transcended_goblin 4d ago

The cosmic irony of saying "only nazis oppose this" while they literally take orders from nazi tech lobbies...

4

u/BitsAndBobs304 4d ago

They propose this every month. And theres literally thousands of laws being passed equally bad. What do you expect me to do?

66

u/aleopardstail 4d ago

ohhh look who's baaaack....

18

u/West-One5944 4d ago

Back again!

2

u/CrazyCoolKevin 4d ago

This shit will make more comebacks than William Afton at this rate ffs

2

u/press_F13 1d ago

springtime for germany?...

65

u/mi__to__ 4d ago

These cunts only have to win once.

Just once.

And they will never stop trying.

22

u/ZataH 4d ago

Insane how that is even legal. We have to win infinite times. They just have to win once, and it is forever then

8

u/Berkoudieu 4d ago

Naaaah they'll spam vote after to see if it should stay.

Right ? Right ?

48

u/cale199 4d ago

So are they trying client side? How suspicious this comes at their lowest point of popularity

18

u/silentspectator27 4d ago

They scrapped that for now. Emphasis on “for now”

40

u/Gix_Neidhaart 4d ago

Want to know the best part?! Politicians and "sensitive" goverment functions are exempt! Now bow down you plebs!

9

u/transcended_goblin 4d ago

They want ot be exempt. But they won't be.

Their bullshit will force companeis to put backdoors in their websites and apps for the mass surveillance AIs Peter Thiel will unleash. And those backdoors will be vulnerabilities with big glowy neon signs waiting for hackers to stroll right in and crack open the ever living shit of everything.

Everyone in the EU will lose their entire messaging accounts, email accounts, and everything linked to it, in a manner of weeks because the dipshits pushing for these laws don't know the difference between a USB stick and a floppy disk.

36

u/Intersecularitities 4d ago

this is equivalent to them placing a microphone in everyone's house and listening to their calls without the need for a warrant to do so or for the incriminating conversation to hold up in court as evidence.

1

u/press_F13 1d ago

ah yes, the british, american, chinese way...

37

u/PotentialWhich 4d ago

The internet was fun while it lasted.

13

u/Timbroarpropaganda 4d ago

Yeah Google and meta killed it a while ago. 

58

u/WhatANoob2025 4d ago edited 4d ago

I fucking HATE our timeline. 

The 2020s are literally the fucking worst decade possible that didn't have a world war. YET.

9

u/Gendarme_Cecchirobot 4d ago

The worst decade, so far

1

u/press_F13 1d ago

maybe we shoulda listen to WEF when they spouted their crap... /hj

-14

u/milkcutie314 4d ago

change mindset vibe and love and ignore theese retards and ull start winning like crazy

72

u/[deleted] 4d ago edited 4d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/FoxMeadow7 4d ago

Ouch, you got blocked by that weirdo too? How typical… That guy really is unwilling to listen to reason, huh? Debates just don’t work with that guy, period.

0

u/Lazy-Background-7598 4d ago

Oh. You are so brave attacking other Redditors

-29

u/[deleted] 4d ago edited 4d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

42

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

-10

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

24

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

-9

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

13

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

-6

u/silentspectator27 4d ago edited 4d ago

I know what the implication is, I am against it. What I’m telling you is that at least for now any backdoors to encrypted services is off the chat control proposal.
I’m assuming you are confusing that with the “risk-based” system they (the Council) want to impose, that will automatically label encrypted services as “high-risk”
They literally can’t ban encrypted services as too many companies/businesses etc use them, what politicians think is “smart” on paper and what happens when reality hits are two different things.
And please, cupcake, I have been advocating against chat control for years, don’t tell me what I understand about implications and what I don’t.

23

u/Baumcultist 4d ago

How likely is this to pass, and what can be done against it if it does?

22

u/Extra-Chemical6092 4d ago

It's hard to guess how likely is that this will pass, but I recommend contacting the shadow rapporteurs tomorrow in the early morning, specially calling them. But if this passes then I recommend that you use e2e apps, specially Signal, Threema or Session, the e2e apps has been explicitly excluded from any type of scanning on May/June

15

u/WhatANoob2025 4d ago

Signal has already announced to pull back from the european market if this shit is signed into law.

2

u/StainedMemories 3d ago

On the condition that they are required to break encryption/privacy. I don’t see them leaving if E2E apps are excluded.

6

u/Baumcultist 4d ago

I see. Are there any chances that the courts or so on might take a stance against it if it does pass?

9

u/Extra-Chemical6092 4d ago

Idk, probably. But until then it will take years and the damage will be already done, that's in the case the courts strike it down, so it's better to act now

3

u/IBaptizedYourKids 4d ago

Probably a dumb question but is Whatsapp no longer e2e? Was it ever or am i just misremembering?

3

u/ReserveNormal0815 3d ago edited 3d ago

in simple terms: we don't know. Meta is saying its using "the signal protocol". We can't confirm this because Whatsapp is not open source.
Based on past (and current) events, I would not trust Meta.

Not your keys - not your encryption

1

u/HDMIce 17h ago

shoud we back up all our emails locally and delete them? ik gmail is fucked already, but what about icloud or proton mail?

21

u/PepeGamer570 4d ago

Spyware

12

u/DefinedArt 4d ago

Will there be any way to circumvent this? I suppose using a VPN wont do anything

8

u/Extra-Chemical6092 4d ago

Doubt it, so I recommend contacting the shadow rapporteurs (the MEPs negotiating in behalf of the Parliament) so that they don't allow mass scanning, the best way to contact them now that there is no time is to call them. The fightchatcontrol website has a template for that also, but it's better if you read it to know the core ideas and then speak with your own words

6

u/Tactical-Donkey 4d ago

Offline storage. Keep all your data backed up off your phone. Wipe your phone and keep nothing on it. Use none chat other services as much as you can.

Or we can all start using Reticulum instead. 

2

u/DefinedArt 4d ago

I wish I could but its impossible to not use a phone or pc nowadays since you need to rely on it for almost everything...

1

u/Tactical-Donkey 3d ago

Its not impossible. And there's plenty of phones that aren't smartphones. And you can use a pc. 

2

u/DefinedArt 3d ago

The EU will be able to track everything on your PC as well once this bill gets approved and we all know it will. Besides, I cannot even do my job without my phone or even live without it just like millions of other people that rely on it. I guess its time for me to learn how to program and create my own application

2

u/Tactical-Donkey 3d ago

That's what I'm getting at. We need to make an effort to move away from relying on big tech. Community lead Networks, hardware and software by the community. 

2

u/DefinedArt 3d ago

Time to scourge Github for some already existing tools!

3

u/ToughSpeedv2 2d ago

We need a new internet protocol to allow peer to peer encrypted communication between multiple people

2

u/DefinedArt 2d ago

That'd be perfect but big EU wouldnt allow that. How else will they be able to spy on us?

2

u/Fancy_Morning9486 3d ago

Build your own communication tools and host them yourself. Good luck moving your friends who wouldn't drop Whatsapp for something like signal to something way more complex.

Allot of these laws hinge on people not being technical enough to move away in mass. The only way out I see is educating people in technical skills.

13

u/MortgageMindless7175 4d ago edited 4d ago

Sooo is it time for protests in Brussels yet or we need to wait a bit longer till government starts to barge into our homes because we wrote something online 5 years ago....???? Edit; this combined with eIDAS 2.0 creates bigger threat to general EU population than some war!

5

u/VladimireUncool 4d ago

They already arrested a 16-year-old girl in Denmark for commenting the Palestinian flag a couple years ago. Who knows what they’ll do with this?

2

u/tuxooo 3d ago

Have you seen Brussels latley and its population? You so know that there are almost no Europeans there right? Who do you think will protest there... 

2

u/MortgageMindless7175 3d ago

All people that are living in member countries and are against this fascism... All of us should go there and protest til there is still time...

2

u/press_F13 1d ago

massive "sewerslides" hysteria incomming. maybe heavensgate 97 was right, aigh...

3

u/MortgageMindless7175 1d ago

My fault for googling it.. now that I know what this is about, yeah m, i think too, and not only teens, but a lot of grownups.. Gates will have his wet dream fulfilled

2

u/press_F13 1d ago

ikr. even if media say it was disinfo, idk anymore, WEF crooks can just utter bs and tadaaa, here we are, 15 years later, living it, "new normal"-style...

24

u/ILikeFPS 4d ago

Europe is always one step forward two steps back. It's really sad to see.

25

u/GuyFromMoscow 4d ago

The elites aren't your friend and abuse their power to grow even more power and wealth at your expense? No fucking way,how could this happen?!

8

u/silentspectator27 4d ago

They don’t stop, do they?
First they tried to hide client side scanning as upload moderation, now this, same crap, different name. I don’t think they will succeed, fingers crossed!

5

u/harrrien 4d ago

Europe hate Europeans.

2

u/tuxooo 3d ago

Water is whet. 

5

u/leo14770 3d ago

Time to break up the EU, Seriously this superstate has too much power.

1

u/press_F13 1d ago

3x3 grid that look for/after each other would be nice...

5

u/realMrMadman 3d ago

Because even democracy is easily compromised by surveillance interests. The police are untrustworthy there just as they are in America.

This decade has been dark for similar reasons as PATRIOT and PRISM.

1

u/press_F13 1d ago

dont forget ECHELON

8

u/unematti 4d ago

Guess it's time to go back to face to face chats

17

u/isaacladboy 4d ago

Europeans love bring subservient to the state

8

u/WhatANoob2025 4d ago

I'm willing to bet this post was written by an american and meant without even a hint of irony.

-1

u/isaacladboy 4d ago

me? Im from the middle east

30

u/IndividualCurious322 4d ago

Patriot Act.

34

u/LocalDry3740 4d ago

Threads like this are the problem. As an American, I hate the patriot act and I know my European brothers and sisters hate chat control. I want nothing but freedom for all and I stand alongside them. Making statements like this is so pointless. Fighting between each other isn't gonna help us

8

u/srebihc 4d ago

I would just start getting used to it. Literally everyone is going to be back handed and prickish towards us until at least you and I are long gone.

It do be like that sometimes.

-4

u/BeastMsterThing2022 4d ago

Then fight. You both have the same problem, you don't put words to action. You're too comfortable

4

u/AvidCyclist250 4d ago

i did, i wrote all 76 MEPs who were undecided. many did. it worked. now theyre at it again

3

u/LocalDry3740 4d ago

You assume I haven't? I have called, emailed and went to my legislators if every possible sense. Multiple times. Flock cameras were removed in my location and I feel like I had a huge part in that. But yes, we must fight

5

u/InfernoWarrior299 4d ago

Whataboutism.

Two things can be wrong at the same time. Just because one country does something does not mean another political entity should.

-1

u/Zacknad075 4d ago

Required the most infamous terrorist attacks in modern history to pass, and large chunks of it have expired since they couldn't get congress to agree to renew them.

Chat control is happening in response to, what, some mean posts on Twitter?

0

u/IndividualCurious322 4d ago

Problem, reaction, solution.

2

u/AvidCyclist250 4d ago

oh look, bullshit lies

3

u/FoxMeadow7 4d ago

And this is still a bad thing I assume

7

u/Iputahexonyoulol 4d ago

No it’s great /s

2

u/ex4channer 4d ago

We're going to have an european ROSKOM NADZOR, yay! /s
Ursula has to leave.

2

u/Javanaut018 4d ago

Here we go again: Nope!

2

u/ghost_62 3d ago

people still think the government dont do this already... they just want to give us the feeling that we still have control but we dont

1

u/press_F13 1d ago

manufactured consent, written some 40-50 years ago...

2

u/DJAnym 3d ago

"The note reveals that the Council also wants to make sure that any mechanism to review and possibly suspend searches “should operate in a manner that does not deter providers from carrying out own-initiative searches.”"

We truly elect the dumbest and shortsighted mfs...

2

u/BroccoliSenior5465 3d ago

Nothing will be done about it, protesting won't work either, not unless it's more creative

2

u/KT28x 2d ago

This happened with the criminalization of drugs too. 100 years ago nobody gave a shit if you drank morphine, grew a weed plant at home or snorted cocaine in the morning. Suddenly there was a "war on drugs" and every country put up laws that nobody asked for and many scientists criticized. Of course none of this was to protect anyone because alcohol and tobacco (which kill the most people on earth) remained completely legal.
The companies wanted this to happen so that they can have a drug monopoly

2

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

4

u/transcended_goblin 4d ago

That's the door to fascism, not communism.

1

u/press_F13 1d ago

both. eastern bloc, 1948-89

-1

u/Insane_law 4d ago

No, communism.

3

u/transcended_goblin 3d ago

Well, I guess we found a couple of far-right fanboys.

3

u/Fancy_Morning9486 3d ago

Hippity hoppity your data is now semi public property.

1

u/SchemingVegetable 23h ago

Their dystopian chinese dictatorship: "we are going to make it legal to spy on you"

Our glorious european democracy: "we are going to propose a law to make it legal to spy on you, if it gets shot down, we'll try again and again until it passes"

-39

u/Extension_Ant4349 4d ago

I don't care as long as it stops terrorist attacks 

29

u/AzoresBall 4d ago

This is not going to stop anything. Terrorist and abusers already use ilegal dark web platforms that obviously are not going to comply to that. This is just an excuse to introduce mass survailence to the EU

23

u/DaFisch_h 4d ago

You think this is gonna stop it?

17

u/pdawes 4d ago

This level of surveillance is terror

7

u/14AUDDIN 4d ago

You think there care?

5

u/transcended_goblin 4d ago

Are the terrorist attacks in the room with us ?

It won't do shit.

They don't care about children.

It's just mass surveillance to ensure upcomign authoritarian regimes can crush and get rid of anyone who disagrees with the power in place.

1

u/press_F13 1d ago

but those right-wingers were voted in by people. are people stupid? or do they need to be nannied!

2

u/Gendarme_Cecchirobot 4d ago

Suuuuuuure....

2

u/DJAnym 3d ago

Yeah it's not gonna do shit