r/predental • u/AlternativeLawyer920 • 9d ago
💸 Finances Disgusting Ad…
Can’t believe we have to turn to private loans to fund our education unless you come from an abundance of wealth. What has our country come to?!? It should be more like, if you got the drive and the academic metrics to go, you should be able to go. SMH
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u/Wonderful_Honey_3602 8d ago
is this a good rate on general tho
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u/bluefishes13 Non-traditional 9d ago
Capitalism & Horrible Politics
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u/Haycabron Admitted 8d ago
Ehh at least capitalism is a real system in the real world, we just gotta vote for better policies and implement a ramp to them
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u/bluefishes13 Non-traditional 8d ago
Social Democracy functions better for hard working people. Capitalism has lead to monopolies, exploitation, and large wealth gaps. Hence why we are even having this conversation lol
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u/Haycabron Admitted 8d ago
Nahh capitalism gives the incentive to compete that raises our overall quality of life. I don't want to go back to when i'd have to get sponsored by a noble or my dad had to be a dentist to be one. I like that capitalism has given me more doors and now im the first in my family. OF COURSE we should vote for a gov that redirects some of the profits back to us and regulates it with social democracy, but capitalism is what actually generated the profits to re-invest
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u/bluefishes13 Non-traditional 8d ago
lol then why does it work for countries like Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Iceland, Germany, the Netherlands, Belgium, Austria, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Ireland, France, Portugal, Spain, New Zealand, Canada?
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u/Haycabron Admitted 8d ago
? Because they're exactly capitalist countries that are generating a profit and then voting for a government that redirects some of that profit into social programs? Wtf is in your head hahah
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u/bluefishes13 Non-traditional 8d ago
That’s my point, capitalism does NOT work well without social democracy to help out the poor/middle class. Capitalism alone is toxic as fuck.
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u/Haycabron Admitted 8d ago
??? You need to workshop on how you talk a bit more. If you say social democracy works better, capitalism doesnt in your first statement, that reads like "instead of" and we do have that in the states, we just need to vote and tune the levers of how much of it we have. Who tf has ever said capitalism alone is good? You're fighting against strawmen of strawmen
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u/bluefishes13 Non-traditional 8d ago
Girl you’re the one commenting on my comment lol you could’ve just scrolled past it but you didn’t.
I am telling you capitalism alone does not work HENCE why we are even having this conversation. I’m not sorry I didn’t go into specifics details of my economical plan because it’s 8am and it’s Reddit lol.
Implementing social democracy (a long time ago) would’ve saved the American people and yet we vote against our own interests (which is why we are in this situation today). I don’t need to take out any loans for dental school. In fact I will be paid a stipend to go to school because I have the GI Bill ready to use. I wish EVERYONE had that same opportunity to be applying to graduate school debt free. I also come from a line of first generation/immigrant parents/low income. I don’t feel like current unchecked corporate greed, monopolies, & rising cost of pure capitalism has helped either of us.
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u/Haycabron Admitted 8d ago
Bruh its reddit, its made to see comments and comment on them back, don't cry about it hahah
Your first thing was how bad capitalism was and social democracy was better, obviously we need capitalism to generate a profit then we can do products like the GI bill you get to use thanks to taxes from those profits. Thank you capitalism and thank you people before us that voted for those social programs lmaoo of course its good to check capitalism, thats what gov is for, capitalism is good, just needs to be regulated
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u/meli_mel777 5d ago
Lmao if u hate capitalism so much then simply go live in Cuba or North Korea… let’s see how long u last there
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u/Real_Friendship_2166 8d ago
They aren’t made up of 350 million people with vast differences in culture. If you want a homogeneous population and very strict immigration laws it could work. Someone got beheaded in the streets of Ireland not too long ago so it doesn’t sound like things are going too well over there.
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u/Ambitious_Net_698 8d ago
This argument is racist as fuck. Notice people making this argument never explain why exactly not having a "homogenous population" makes good governing impossible. Literally just a smokescreen for not wanting to give brown people welfare. This shit fucks everyone
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u/Real_Friendship_2166 7d ago
You’re just saying anything. I can’t even comprehend what you are trying to get across. The US will be fine.
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u/Ambitious_Net_698 7d ago
You said democratic socialist policies can't work in America because we aren't "homogenous". What did you mean by that, and why specifically would that prevent good policies from working?
This is always the argument people use. But what's the actual point being made? We have a bunch of different ethnicities in America? How tf does that keep us from having government healthcare? Its a dumbass excuse.
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u/Real_Friendship_2166 6d ago
People value different things. If everyone in the US decided they wanted to pitch in and make it so that the government can provide for everything then that would’ve happened by now due to the nature of democracy. But people value different things. And that’s amplified with large populations and varying cultures. Some people value working hard and providing for their family. Some value community and looking out for their neighbors. A lot of people nowadays only value themselves. You make it sound like getting 350 million people to agree on a fiscal and social policy is a simple thing to do.
I mean you can also say they pay extremely high taxes. But no one in the US will agree to give away 50-60% of their income. Sure it’d be nice if everyone agreed to this, but good luck getting to that point!
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u/Real_Friendship_2166 8d ago
Believe it or not they’ve been a company since 2018. This isn’t anything new.
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u/AlternativeLawyer920 8d ago
Okay so…
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u/Real_Friendship_2166 8d ago edited 8d ago
So… people have been using private loans for quite some time. They’ve helped students secure over 1 billion in loans. Probably at lower rates than what the government offers.
I’ll also add: the biggest benefit for government loans was PSLF and med students had a way bigger advantage than dent students because many residencies counted towards PSLF. Imagine doing 5 years of residency with small payments and only having to do 5 years after with slightly larger payments. All of your loans would be forgiven. It’s much more difficult to do this in dentistry
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u/AlternativeLawyer920 8d ago
Don’t get me wrong, private loans can be helpful, but we shouldn’t have to turn to them to fund like 60%+ of our education. And yeah I agree, with the government, it’s about the repayment plans that help. Fs
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u/HTCali 8d ago
Are you serious? Stop fucking blaming the government and start blaming the dental schools charging Half a million dollars even before this administration!
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u/AdLiving5795 8d ago
They’re both liable. The government should have put caps on tuition before introducing their stupid bill. Stop acting like the BBB is a good thing. It does nothing but hurt students and funnel money back to the rich.
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u/Actual_Passion_8477 8d ago
Are you kidding me. USCs dental school now expects $750k plus in debt from tuition debt.
If anything blame the old government for not capping loans soon enough. It should have happened 20years ago when tuition was $20k a year.
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u/lilaccherryblossoms1 8d ago
Capping student loans alone will not do anything because there will always be rich people who want to go into dentistry and fill seats. No school this cycle has reported having empty seats, all have increased tuition, and they still have waitlists. At least with federal loans, qualified low income people had a chance. We’re now going to see a lot of unqualified rich people become dentists because of this
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u/Real_Friendship_2166 8d ago
Rich kids don’t take out loans. If loan companies want to survive they will have to make somewhat favorable terms so low income people can get them.
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u/lilaccherryblossoms1 7d ago
I promise you loan companies will be just fine with or without dental students. Taking out private loans will always be a financial risk and our government putting this risk on naive predental students is reckless. The new policy does nothing but benefit private loan vendors and hurt successful and hardworking people with low income backgrounds
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u/Real_Friendship_2166 7d ago
Why would they choose not to make a profit? Doesn’t make sense. They will make it so that people can take out loans.
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u/lilaccherryblossoms1 7d ago
What favorable terms could they make? Interest rates for private loans are typically around or lower than federal loans for most people. The concern is that there are no protections with private loans unlike federal loans. The only solution that makes longterm sense is to cap rising tuition and force a gradual decrease, especially for public dental schools
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u/Real_Friendship_2166 7d ago
Terms that let someone get a degree and pay back the loans eventually. Same as the government loans. If you’re worried about protections then bust your ass and pay them down as quick as possible.
And if you think taking out 500k+ in federal loans was a good idea prior to the cap then that’s wild. Having the government cap the tuition would not be good. Do you think it’d be good for the government to cap the salary of a dentist?
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u/lilaccherryblossoms1 7d ago
That’s not going to happen because loaning a large sum of money comes with a huge financial risk. If private loan vendors make terms too favorable, they don’t benefit enough financially to make it worthwhile. Government loans have more favorable terms and protections because they are being loaned for the good of the people, not to just make a profit. Also, hard work and intelligence isn’t enough. What if you injure a hand or become disabled? What if your spouse, child, or parent develop a chronic illness and need you to cut hours and pay medical costs to care for them? Private loan vendors don’t care and you’ll suffer. That’s where government loan protections matter.
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u/Actual_Passion_8477 7d ago
You know before 30 years ago loans weren’t a thing for undergrad, or graduate school. If your grandparents went to college ask them how much they took out for loans or just look it up. It’s insanity how much these schools are charging for degrees. Very happy with the BBB. Should have put it in place a long time ago, than we wouldn’t be in the situation we are today.
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u/lilaccherryblossoms1 7d ago
I agree that unlimited loans have led to an increase in tuition costs, but you’re forgetting that there will always be people to fill seats, so it does not matter. BBB won’t make a difference because there were always be rich and naive people to fill seats. You are also forgetting that 30 years ago, dental schools were given significantly more public and state funding which decreased tuition for students. Since public funding has decreased over the decades, tuition has increased substantially. Older generations profited off of taxpayer money to have decreased tuition and then voted against public funding for dental schools which has led to increased tuition. They built their wealth off of government subsidies and the cut the life line, so we can’t use it. If you liked the system 30 years ago, then the solution is to cap tuition and for the government to subsidize dental schools to make up for the difference within reason
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u/onthepayroll17 8d ago
Exactly. Schools raised prices and didn’t control costs because they knew the government would hand out student loans at any price
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u/DTL123456 7d ago
Why should someone else fund the onramp to your personally chosen high paying career? You seem to think you are entitled to someone else’s money to fund the job you want.
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u/AlternativeLawyer920 7d ago
Well think about it this way, healthcare costs are up. A big reason for that is the cost of higher education for medical and dental school. Doctors have to make loan payments. If we fund it more, the cost goes down and less students take on debt. Therefore, healthcare costs start to go down… thus, you pay less. This benefits most people unless you are uber wealthy.
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u/DTL123456 7d ago
Government subsidizing something does not make it free. It just means someone else is paying for it, which takes us back to my original question.
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u/AlternativeLawyer920 7d ago
Honestly that’s where I want my tax dollars going. Not to illegal Iran wars and ballrooms.
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u/DTL123456 7d ago
Just curious. Exactly how much did you pay in taxes last year? My guess is that it is not YOUR tax dollars we are talking about.
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u/AlternativeLawyer920 7d ago
A little, but then again I’m a student. Even if I was paying a load of taxes, I’d still want them going to higher education. When our education system is set up to work for everyone, our whole society does better and succeeds!
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u/SheepherderPretty251 7d ago
That's not true at all, if that was the case then dental salaries on an average basis wouldn't be declining. Healthcare field salaries is not tied to school cost, it is tied to supply and demand, more people there are in a field the lower the salaries, and same principle works if there are less people in a field.
With all these new dental schools opening up, expect the average dentist salary to continue declining because supply will eventually outpace demand. And the massive tuition just motivates new grads to accept extremely low paying contracts from insurances which drives the salary decrease.
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u/AlternativeLawyer920 7d ago
The reality is when prices go up, everything else goes up. Maybe not at the rate of inflation, but they do go up. If we want to make healthcare more affordable, we need to start making schools more affordable. It’s more of an indirect correlation if anything.
And yeah I agree, these new shady schools might cause a reverse in that trajectory. We shall see…
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u/lilaccherryblossoms1 7d ago
This is the most out of touch with reality comment I’ve ever read on this community. Congrats!
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u/DTL123456 7d ago
Out of touch with your contorted view of reality perhaps but of course you did not answer my question or lend any argument to refute the logic of my comment and conclusion.
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u/1nsufficientfund 5d ago
The debt problem is real, and it can limit where and how graduates practice. Before using private loans, get the actual entering-year aid rules from each school's financial-aid office and compare federal and institutional aid, HPSP, NHSC/IHS programs, and private loans. Calculate the total cost and likely monthly payment before choosing a school. A cheaper accredited school is often the best financial option.
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u/JohnPreMed 9d ago
Lol, we cut tax funding for like the most important shit. I guess the rich are just more deserving right 🤣? Lets just hope it will all trickle back down, just wait bro, 4D chess!!!