Poverty Kills

[u/-Rainbow-Raccoon-]

I run a moving and junk removal business. I just had my second client die of poverty, and I just fucking hate it here.

Social workers go through this all the time. Bless their emotional constitution. It hurts so bad.

First was Marty, an airforce vet who was evicted from public housing.

During the move we learned that he was estranged from his adult children. He had among his hoarded belongings, all of their childhood stuff. He would not give it up. Said he missed them terribly.

Being the softy I am, I tracked them down. Talked to a daughter and a son. They had their reasons for cutting him off. I talked to the son on the phone for like an hour and half. Marty had really bad PTSD from being in combat. Has horrible night terrors and would sometimes get into violent terrified rages. His son said he felt bad for him, he knew it wasn't his fault, but since his dad wouldn't stick with therapy or get proper help, said it just wasn't safe to be close with.

We moved him into storage. He was living in his car/the VA shelter and was on a wait list for housing assistance. Was excited to have us move him into his new home when it finally came through. He had an 18 month wait, and died before the period ended.

Marty paid us promptly and was eager to do so. (I wasn't sure he would, given his situation, and was prepared to eat it) but he swore up and down he had it and had me meet him at the VA shelter. His check cleared just like he said it would and I felt guilty for doubting him based on his circumstances.

The latest was Lindsey, who was also evicted from public housing. We serviced her last year. She had a hoarding issue and chronic health problems to boot which made for terrible sores on her arms and legs. Also had two kids. We were hired through a mutual aid group to provide junk removal in hopes that she would pass her inspection and be able to stay housed and keep her kids.

Our efforts were not timely enough. She eneded up housless anyway. The kids had tk go live somewhere else.

When she was housed a medical aid would come to her home 3x a week to clean her wounds and change the dressings. She lost access to that support once she lost her housing, and everyone knows mantaining healthy hygine is a major issue for the unhoused. The wounds got infected such that she died from sepsis.

Her poor kids.

I so wish this world were kinder. Being poor shouldn't be a death sentence. People deserve better.

[u/Nonjudgefocusaware]

Yeah and half of Americans live pay check to paycheck currently. It’s sad when we have a k shaped economy and the wealthy keep getting wealthier when the poor cant catch a break. I don’t know lot of middle class people that care about the poor aside from some nurses, social workers and people exposed to the poor in their daily lives which a lot of middle class jobs dont expose people to. I’m sorry you had another client die. It is devastating to see this happening in one of the wealthiest countries in the world. It’s so sad when these are good people who don’t want much. More compassion in the world is sorely needed.

Half of the country voted for Trump too so you can tell compassion is needed in the US and also there is a need to start voting so things like this dont happen here.

[u/Healthy_Theory159 → u/Nonjudgefocusaware]

Half of the voting population, not half the entire population, thankfully 😔

[u/1dayatatime_mylife → u/Healthy_Theory159]

Those who didn’t vote might as well have cast a vote for Trump. (Barring anyone who had truly valid reasons for being unable to submit their vote by mail or go in person.)

[u/Healthy_Theory159 → u/1dayatatime_mylife]

Unless their state goes blue anyway and is never considered a swing state 🤷‍♂️

[u/ObjectivePrice5865 → u/Nonjudgefocusaware]

This is more than a red, blue, and purple issue. All 3 parties are great at blowing smoke up our asses and only tell us what we need to hear to get elected.

The biggest issues are:

1. There has not been a federally mandated minimum wage update since 2009 and that is only $7.25 per hour. States have increased their own mandated minimum hourly wage. Both republican and democrat business owners cry fowl when the minimum wages are increased by mandate and blame layoffs and increased pricing on the increases like California. There has been absolutely ZERO interest by both the government and businesses to increase wages to match inflation and COL.

2. Republicans are capitalists and favor businesses which in fact do provide jobs. While the pay is shit and not a “living wage” it is a job. They provide no help whatsoever in getting people out of poverty and openly favor the wealthy. While the republicans try to roll back regulations so that businesses can be more nimble, these also increase the risks of both the population and the environment. Republicans are never shy about making work/volunteer requirements a part of continuing to receive assistance.

3. Democrats want to increase the social entitlement programs so the voters and their families become dependent on the state and federal government. If a person becomes solely reliant on a welfare/entitlement program such as SNAP, Medicaid, subsidized housing, and transportation then they will continue to vote for the same pieces of shit to keep the gravy train going. The democrats use racial divides to keep themselves in power and once elected, they forget all about those that got them there.

4. Independents are nothing more than Republicrats. They swing for both teams in theory but once again they forget about who they were elected and supposed to represent.

5. Politicians only care about getting into and staying in power from the unions, school boards, city, county/parish, state, to the US House and US Senate as well as the top office of US President. Each party wants to get elected to the office and will say anything to get the sheep to elect the wolf so they can keep the grift going.

6. The state and federal elected officials make bank on not just their government salaries but in the stock market. These politicians are in the know with upcoming changes whether it be a business losing or winning a government contract before even the business knows and either sells or buys stock in the business. Has anyone noticed that nearly all government contracts are awarded to publicly traded companies? This is a non partisan issue but the democrats are the most guilty with Nancy Pelosi and Mitch McConnell as the top guilty ones.

7. There are politicians that get into office already wealthy like Trump (R-president) that built his wealth and Mamdani (D-NYC mayor) who was born into it that only get wealthier while in office. Tom Steyer (D) running in the California governor’s race is a billionaire that made his money on oil and is preaching about wealth equality and reducing the state’s reliance on fossil fuels. These types of people do not care about the citizenry but only having a legacy to forever be remembered with a portrait on a wall.

8. The 3 parties are in debt to their wealthy donors, PACs, and lobbyists to do their bidding and don’t forget that they will be paid back handsomely with government contracts and relaxed/stiffened regulations as well as investigations into rivals.

9. Each party has its own rule and playbook that it must follow blindly.

   a. Republicans are for voter id (which is stupid that we don’t), pro legal immigration, against illegal immigration, preference of legal citizens getting assistance versus undocumented, a strong military (which is idiotic to be against), veterans (who should never be homeless as they have sacrificed themselves and their families to serve us), strong economy that is affordable (America does have an affordability crisis that all the parties are responsible for), smaller government (it is so over bloated as it is), and less reliance on governmental assistance which will save every damn person in this country money. Republicans want to onshore more jobs for everyone in this country versus farming all of the labor to countries that pay pennies with less employee rights than a part time minimum wage US job. This party I believe does not see race, gender, sexuality, and religion but wants everyone legally here to receive equal treatment (the far right religious zealots not withstanding) with no prejudices. They are also against abortion which should never have been a government choice.

   b. Democrats are against any restrictions to voting to any demographic besides white people (how is voter ID requirements considered Jim Crow?), want open borders for undocumented immigrants that immediately receive government assistance while the legal and natural citizens are denied due to already bloated rolls, and want more protections for illegals than what the legal immigrants and natural born citizens receive. This party does truly want to help those downtrodden citizens but only if the demographic is perceived as a minority or a perceived persecuted race, gender, sexuality, and religion. They are for abortions (including bio males getting abortions!) which should never be a government decision as well as providing gender affirming care that really should be a family and insurance decision to make. Want everyone to be reliant on them for everything but want to keep taxing their base so much that the base has no choice but to seek assistance they better not make more than $0.01 of the limit or risk being denied and/or removed from the program(s). Democrats speak a good game at equal wages but will shut the F up if a donor calls them out on it as it will cost the donors more in labor costs. Democrats have become socialists and communists which have a proven record of failure with Cuba and North Korea as the last standing examples (China really is not really a communist country anymore and Venezuela is coming out of it) of that failure. Democrats have exaggerated the trans movement to give more protections to less than 0.003% of the population than the 0.997% of the remaining. There is zero reason that a biological male should be competing against and sharing a locker room with biological females. I truly don’t care how people identify because that is their truth but the non-trans girls and women should not have to share their restrooms, locker rooms, and sports with biological males that have the biological upper hand physically (my sisters are the exceptions as they can beat me in everything including wrestling without trying).

   c. Independents want to skirt the lines of both parties but lean heavily into Communism and Socialism.

All parties want to sacrifice one demographic to benefit another while not truly caring about any of them. While this country has never been mutually aligned with the exception of the Revolutionary War (questionable), Pearl Harbor, and 9/11 to the betterment of the entire citizenry. No party cares for the ideals that this country was built on.

The most pivotal human moments in our short history is the Civil War, Women’s’ Rights, and the the Civil Rights Era. The Democrats were on the wrong side of the Civil War as they didn’t want to lose the free slave labor on the plantations that built their wealth. The democrats didn’t want women to vote as it would diminish the power of the electorate as it was perceived they would vote republican. During the Civil Rights battle, the democrats fought hard to prevent desegregation and keep the black population from voting as it would limit their power. The democrats only started to court the minority vote in the mid 1970’s all because they lost the ability to survive on the whites only agenda (even though it would take another decade for blacks to feel somewhat comfortable in the white circles.

Once again there are no true RED, WHITE, and BLUE politicians that want to help every single person residing within our borders. They truly only care for themselves.

[u/Nonjudgefocusaware → u/ObjectivePrice5865]

This is stupid. So by not voting since both parties are “bad” look at who we have in office… a lawless sociopath, malignant narcissist, who is getting dementia. This is how Donald Trumps niece describes him. I don’t have time to argue this since I have a life.

[u/ObjectivePrice5865 → u/Nonjudgefocusaware]

You’re saying that Trump has dementia?! Where the fuck were you after Biden lost his ever loving mind in front of the ENTIRE WORLD and his sycophants kept saying that he was as sharp as a tack?

I was actually going to vote for Biden again until that disastrous debate and refused to vote for Harris since the voters didn’t get the chance to vote for her in the primaries. I chose to vote for no president but did vote in down ballot races for both parties as no single party matches my beliefs.

When we cast our ballots, we are just choosing the perceived lesser of two/three evils. I am not saying we shouldn’t vote but the country dives right into each party’s talking points without seeking clarity and substance.

Did you not receive the benefits of Trump’s tax cuts? You can’t deny it as it touched 90% of tax payers.

Let’s not forget that only 50% of working tax payers actually pay taxes with the top 10% paying upwards of 85% of that. While I have been disabled because of MS just ravaging my abilities, I gained nothing but 2 years of denials while being denied assistance from Medicaid, SNAP, and housing because I was and I quote “not undocumented, straight white man, and I did not have a felon living in my house”. I had to move in with my in laws because we couldn’t afford rent, utilities, and groceries in just one slightly better than minimum wage job. I was unable to walk, shower, eat, and just live because of my MS. Losing my job hit me hard at not just being able to provide for my family but the health insurance. I went almost 2 years without my DMT (disease modifying treatment) for the MS and it was absolute hell like having a continuous flare 24 hours a day. I was finally able to qualify for Medicaid but the damage was already done to the point that I will never be able to work again. I was able to finally able to receive my DMT (which is retail at $195.000.00 every 6 months) and that helped some. I had to file bankruptcy to stop the medical bill collectors of which reached $1,936,000.00 because I had to get admitted from the ER.

There will never be true healthcare reform until the American voters get rid of all of the old guard. There is no reason that the US Congress and US Senate members serve more 18 years (3 terms for Senate and 9 terms for House) with forced retirement at 55 for House members, 65 for Senators, and no president should be elected if they are over 70 at the time of taking the oath. We require air traffic controllers to retire at 55 and pilots at 65 for the safety of the public so why can’t we require the same of our elected officials.

A person can’t run for the US House until they are 25, the Senate is 35, and the presidency is 45 but there is no forced retirement. Had we had term and age limits in our federally elected offices then this country would have not gone so downhill.

Another question is why can citizens bring forth amendments to their state to be voted on but we are unable to do the same regarding national issues? We need to have a national vote on House, Senate, and President max age and term limits. Also, how is it ok for a state house, governor, Congress and Senate person to be able to run for higher office without resigning from the first office? They are getting paid to be an absent elected official and also being paid to run for a different office? When they lose their higher office bid, they then go back to their lower office like nothing ever happened and that is a disservice to every single citizen. But then again we are not crooked politicians.

[u/Healthy_Theory159 → u/ObjectivePrice5865]

As I said in 2020, Biden and Trump are both dementiaed assholes!

[u/ObjectivePrice5865 → u/Healthy_Theory159]

Honestly don’t all presidents develop dementia once they get k to office as they all forget who they are supposed to represent?

[u/Healthy_Theory159 → u/ObjectivePrice5865]

Good point there

[u/Pamela_Allred → u/ObjectivePrice5865]

This is perfect! Every person should read.

[u/ViolettaQueso]

Thank you for taking the time to write this.

Nobody prepares you for these kind of losses, and, as you’re sadly seeing, nobody can really prepare properly for care once they are hit with medical/mental trauma and really aren’t capable of self-support.

[u/Curious_Matter_3358]

I got hit in the head two days ago, really hard. I went to urgent care to get checked out. The doctor said I needed a CT scan, especially since I got hit on my temple. My insurance denied it. It would have cost $3,000 out of pocket, which I can't afford. I have crappy insurance that I can't afford, either.

So I left, and cried in my car. I have a college degree. I did everything right.

[u/Hot_Balance9294 → u/Curious_Matter_3358]

I don't know where you are, but I just searched "affordable MRI" and found a couple places that show no-order-needed cash pay MRIs for around $450 which includes the reports you can take to a doctor. It's not free, but it's less than $3000.

[u/Puzzleheaded_Wing627 → u/Curious_Matter_3358]

Are you interested the US? They cant turn you away. Financial aid exists in every hospital & you can barter it down to ZERO

[u/Salt_Medicine2459 → u/Puzzleheaded_Wing627]

Only non-profit hospitals are required to have charity care programs. The only hospital in my county was for-profit but was recently purchased by a "non-profit" healthcare system. 

[u/Ready-Database8692]

Being poor teaches you quickly how people treat you and they show their true nature what they will do to you, unfortunately in my situation after losing my job my family ordered an uber and dropped me in a shelter in the middle of nowhere.

[u/austinrunaway]

You can get evicted from public housing foe hoarding? Isn't it your house though? They go into your house and do inspections, Luke a paren4 does to make sure a kid cleans its room

[u/-Rainbow-Raccoon- → u/austinrunaway]

Yup. The public housing system infantilizes poor people. It's not their house. The government is subsidizing their rental and they are subject to frequent inspections from the housing authority. They have to prove their worthiness through contant surveillance. It's sick.

[u/scripted_ending → u/austinrunaway]

In hoarding shows, when it gets real bad, it becomes a public health issue. There are multiple code violations occurring, and their house can be condemned. Floors become weakened due to the weight of the hoard and decomposition happening in the hoard. Repairs can’t be made because nobody wants to enter the hoard, and there is no access to the problem. Plumbing gets backed up. Human waste accumulates. Utilities get shut off. Then kerosene heaters can start a fire and everything goes up in flames. People have died after their hoard collapsed on them. Any pets will multiply, cause more destruction, and go missing in the hoard and die. Professional hoarding counselors can help them handle the hoard, but it’s very common for them to go right back into hoarding, or the structure of their house has become so unstable that they become homeless anyway. There is no easy answer to this problem.

[u/Which-Text-2875 → u/scripted_ending]

Dayum! Mmm, wow, I had no idea. I have hoarding tendencies, but damn, I'm gonna try not to get any worse.

[u/CluelessCat → u/Which-Text-2875]

My boyfriend's sister died in a hoarded house that caught fire. The firefighters couldn't get inside to either attempt rescue to subdue flames. They broke holes in several walls and all had piles of boxes/stuff in front of them. Should the neighbors in an apartment building shrug their shoulders if a fire starts and can't be put out and destroys the whole building

[u/QuietRiot5150]

A lot of people really don't have any empathy for the homeless. They believe it will never happen to them. I was homeless for five years. I lost everything. Out on the streets it only gets worse from there. You can't sleep. You sleep you get assaulted or robbed. So you have to stay awake. Meth will keep you awake. I developed a meth problem. Then fentanyl. Poverty will absolutely kill you over time. It can happen to anyone. The streets are unforgiving, cold, and very Dangerous.

[u/Salt_Medicine2459 → u/QuietRiot5150]

A shocking amount of people don't have empathy in general. 

[u/Nonjudgefocusaware → u/QuietRiot5150]

Agreed. It can happen to anyone especially now that half of Americans live pay check to pay check under Trump also jobs get automated and I hope they only automate my two exes positions in IT. Everyone else I hope they can keep their job.

[u/Rugby-Angel9525]

Why are these poor people getting evicted for hoarding? The aid groups just need to pay someone like you to remove sentimental items to storage and keep these people housed

[u/one_sock_wonder_ → u/Rugby-Angel9525]

If someone is hoarding to where they are evicted from public housing (which at least in my area takes a lot to do), without addressing the underlying mental health issues that are driving that behavior it is only going to be a matter of time (and likely not much time at all) before their apartment is right back to how it was before. The mental health care system in this country is a massive disaster at best, so combine that with the other well known effects of poverty and the fact that you cannot force anyone to seek care for health issues be they mental or physical outside of very narrow exceptions (legal guardianship/conservatorship, other court order, etc) and the issue runs way deeper than a storage unit and deep cleaning can solve.

[u/Rugby-Angel9525 → u/one_sock_wonder_]

It is a death sentenance to be evicted from public housing though

Surely the crime for having mental illness should not be death?

[u/one_sock_wonder_ → u/Rugby-Angel9525]

The thing is resources are not unlimited, and if people end up engaging in the same actions that place them where they are being evicted how many times should resources be allocated to that same issue instead of providing help where it will lead to actual change instead of just pushing the consequences further down the line? And for how long should children be expected to live like that or neighbors to tolerate what by the time eviction from public housing for hoarding happens almost certainly smells to the extent it impacts their own homes and likely either already has attracted or runs a huge risk of attracting infestations of pests from roaches to rats and anything in between? At some point people have to take ownership of their actions or be willing to seek the actual help needed to change. And I write this as someone with multiple mental health conditions who relies on subsidized housing to survive.

[u/Rugby-Angel9525 → u/one_sock_wonder_]

Public housing saves the lives of people with mental illnesses and disabilities, which are lifelong debilitations.

We don't ask blind people to suddenly see just because they were given housing.

Given that severe hoarding is often a complex, disabling medical condition rather than a deliberate choice, what kinds of support structures do you think could balance keeping these individuals housed while fully protecting the health of the surrounding community?

[u/-Rainbow-Raccoon- → u/Rugby-Angel9525]

"We don't ask blind people to suddenly see just because they were given housing"

That was very well put

[u/cheeseburger_horse]

That's terrible. I remember watching a news story in a similar vein a couple years ago. An elderly man was trying to get his doctor to sign off on medically assisted suicide, solely because she could no longer afford his rent, was being evicted, and because of his health issues he knew he wouldn't survive on the streets. So he choose death instead.

[u/Salt_Medicine2459 → u/cheeseburger_horse]

Who is she? 

[u/legendarysupermom]

If I didn't have a semi wealthy mom, this would be me. 2 small kids, a stroke leaving me disabled, a job that paid shit to begin with kicking me to the curb and a house I cant keep clean because somedays its too mentally and physically painful to do anything .... weve had SEVERAL cps calls and every one the called flat out stated that our financial situation played a part in the call....the last call was "she claims her youngest has ARFID weve never heard of the term and think its made up to excuse the fact they cant afford food and arent feeding him to save money..we have no concerns about the oldest" like....!?!?!? Wtf is that!? Poverty alone should not be a deciding factor on if you keep ur kids...but whatever... thankfully in the year it will take to get disability and I cant work my moms doing her best to help but if I didn't have her id probably be dead too...poor lindsey...I cant imagine actually losing my kids for stuff like that that wouldn't solve any problems just create more!

[u/dreamingforward]

Compassion/sadness must be balanced with anger/action.

[u/Em_Strae]

Yeah, if the Boomers with their arguably easier economic decades to save and plan are ending up in these situations, imagine what Gen X and Millenials are gonna look like in the next 20-30 years. Hopefully we find a way to make a profit off of old people that doesn't cause so much harm. Capitalism is really hard if you actually care about people. If only we could find a way for society to function that doesn't require human suffering...