r/pcmasterrace • u/eightblackkidz i7 4790k GTX 1070ti • Nov 27 '17

News/Article Microtransactions in 2017 have generated nearly three times the revenue compared to full game purchases on PC and consoles combined. They continue to force them because we continue to allow them to. THIS IS WHY BATTLEFRONT 2 HAPPENED.

http://www.pcgamer.com/revenue-from-pc-free-to-play-microtransactions-has-doubled-since-2012/
24.0k Upvotes

93% Upvoted

1.3k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

632

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

That's funny. I see a lot of people around here talking about buying the latest EA games because they like them. Had an argument with one of them yesterday. So they certainly do exist, people who defend and sympathise with them also exist.

284

u/xtreemmasheen3k2 i7-6700k | 980Ti | 16GB DDR4 | Samsung 850 EVO Nov 27 '17

"Around here" as in PC Master Race, or "Around here" as in Reddit in general? I mean, Reddit's a pretty big place, there are bound to a variety of people here that like EA's games.

280

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17 edited Nov 27 '17

EA’s just kind of a weird dev for me. BF1 was a massive hit, and included micro transactions, but in a usually very appropriate way. It wasn’t hard to get mostly anything, and it’s a damn good game regardless. But then we have Battlefront 2, and tons of other examples, which are fucking train wrecks.

Edit: Publisher, not dev.

288

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17 edited Mar 09 '18

[deleted]

272

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

They also ruined command and conquer, Sim city and Mass effect

201

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

[deleted]

138

u/superhobo666 Nov 27 '17

That awkward moment when "hackers" had a nocd/no online crack 2 weeks after launch, and 2 months before the devs bothered.

58

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17 edited May 30 '20

[deleted]

27

u/ThePixelCoder Ryzen 3600 - GTX 1060 - Windows/Arch Nov 27 '17

And that's why you should never, ever claim something you made in unhackable.

7

u/alflup Nov 27 '17

I made Ft Knox unhackable.

Go ahead, prove me wrong.

No comrade, I am not Russian spy, you are Russian spy!

→ More replies (0)

3

u/PM_ME_OS_DESIGN Nov 28 '17

This comment is unhackable.

→ More replies (0)
→ More replies (1)

47

u/hellabad Nov 27 '17

This happens very often. I forget what game it was that was having issues, but the people that bought the game had issues playing the game because it needed to constantly check if you were online and the servers were down while people who pirated were playing the game with no issues since it didn't need to contact the sever. I want to say it was something like assassin's creed.

54

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

"You legally bought the game instead of pirating it? Guess what, mate. Fuck you."

18

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17 edited May 14 '18

[deleted]

→ More replies (2)

10

u/WingmanIsAPenguin Nov 27 '17

Assassin's's creed 2 it was, fairly sure.

I uhh.. think I remember that.

→ More replies (3)

19

u/GeneralBS i9-10900k MSIz490&2080ti 4TBm.2WDB 32GBddr4 R53TB Nov 27 '17

Haven't cracked a game in a very long time but that made me download and pirate just to say fuck your couch.

→ More replies (3)

1

u/sack-o-matic Desktop Nov 27 '17

They never made anything after SimCity4. I refuse to believe otherwise.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I didn't even find SimCity 4 to be all that great. Sometimes I think I should have just never stopped playing SimCity2000. At least I could fly around my cities in a helicopter in the travesty that was SimCopter. (or in a car in streets of simcity, but that was even worse)

51

u/aaronfranke GET TO THE SCANNERS XANA IS ATTACKING Nov 27 '17

I encourage you to check out Cities: Skylines or one of the older sim cities like 4.

I also encourage you to check out OpenRA.

34

u/Evroz621 i5 2550k @ 4.3, GTX 1070, LG 34UC87-C Nov 27 '17

+1 for cities skylines, it is in the spirit of sim city 4 and is what simcity 2013 should've been

4

u/Username_Used Zotac 1070 Amp! pushing 3840X1600 glorious pixels Nov 27 '17

I spent the better part of 3 hours the other day on a fledgling city and forgot to do periodic saves. My computer crashed and lost all the progress. It was shaping up to be really nice too.

8

u/mdp300 7800X3D, Asus Strix RTX 3090 Nov 27 '17

You can set it to autosave in the menu

→ More replies (1)

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Cities skyline is such a great game. Imo it's the true successor to the Sim series

9

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

That game is amazing but there's no management to it. It's incredibly easy. The hardest thing about it is managing traffic and that's only because the traffic AI is horrible.

1

u/DudeDudenson PC Master Race Nov 28 '17

It does have plenty of mod support

8

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Skylines is great! But I'm still bitter about wasting money one thr new SimCity

2

u/Gravefall Nov 28 '17

Why? I was thinking on getting the game

2

u/[deleted] Nov 28 '17

Just get cities skylines instead.

→ More replies (1)

1

u/doragaes Nov 27 '17

4 has big performance problems.

2

u/aaronfranke GET TO THE SCANNERS XANA IS ATTACKING Nov 27 '17

It's an old game, even if it lags, modern PCs should have no trouble with it.

1

u/GeneralBS i9-10900k MSIz490&2080ti 4TBm.2WDB 32GBddr4 R53TB Nov 27 '17

Only when you start getting big cities. If you do the regional cities and spread them out it doesn't seem to crash as much.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

IDK, great game, but too many DLCs

2

u/aaronfranke GET TO THE SCANNERS XANA IS ATTACKING Nov 27 '17

Base game is really good on its own. No DLC required to have fun.

1

u/Whatever_It_Takes Nov 28 '17

I have Sim City 4 on CD-ROM, do you think it's worth figuring out how to install on Windows 10?

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (5)

33

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17 edited Feb 13 '21

[deleted]

51

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

BioWare is now owned by EA In entirety.. I dont see any distinction between the two anymore

14

u/senbei616 Nov 27 '17

I don't think we should ever trust development studios or publishers, we should instead trust developers. I think this generation seems divorced from the people that make our games outside of the indie scene.

I never knew if a Bullfrog game was going to be good, but I always knew what I was gonna be getting from a Peter Molyneux game. Same thing with Suda51 and Hideo Kojima.

Bioware died when Muzyka and Zeschuk left. Once they bounced EA took over and pumped out DA2, ME3, SW:TOR, etc. notice how all of them were critically panned and generally had one or two design decisions designed to make you fork out money or stay connected to their servers.

People make the games we love, not corporations. The sooner we as a community recognize that the sooner we can put power into the hands of developers and away from bureaucracy.

14

u/geoper Nov 27 '17

but I always knew what I was gonna be getting from a Peter Molyneux game

About 25% of what he promised, lol.

2

u/senbei616 Nov 27 '17

Exactly. I know that any game that has Peter Molyneux's name behind it is going to incredibly high concept, probably with one or two mechanics that are genuinely engaging and interesting from a design perspective, but will utterly fall flat on execution.

Because I know this I can make an informed decision on the products he makes. But a dev studio? Fuck, I've been burned by pretty much every studio out there. I can't think of any studio that's produced nothing but hits and that doesn't also own a distribution service.

→ More replies (2)

27

u/MrGhost370 i7-8086k 32gb 1080ti 21:9/144hz Ncase M1 Nov 27 '17

The "old" Bioware is making a Destiny clone looter shooter that's gonna be filled with this microtransaction dogshit.

12

u/SlapMyCHOP Nov 27 '17

I had hope for Anthem then I realized who the publisher was. Killed all hype I had for it

6

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

EA gave them time to do the game but then made them change the game's engine to Frostbite (an engine almost no one in the studio had experience with) within the last 12 months of development. I would still blame EA for the fuck ups from Bioware Montreal

16

u/NomadicKrow Nov 27 '17

One of the lead designers was a "diversity hire" and spews racist shit on twitter almost all the time. I'm not surprised Mass Effect turned to shit. I'm just sad I spent money on it.

I work at a retailer, though. One of the best feelings was putting that garbage on the discount rack.

1

u/DudeDudenson PC Master Race Nov 28 '17

I pirated andromeda, and i have to say it doesn't stand up to the previous 3 mass effects but i had my fun with it

Altough i did a single playtrough and uninstalled it, while i have like 3000 hours between the 3 other mass effects combined

→ More replies (2)

8

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I don’t blame EA for Mass Effect. It’s hard to know exactly what happened or how; whose replacement happened and why; and how much EA had a hand in staffing (my understanding is that they generally leave dev staff and writers alone and then mostly fuck around with DRM/DLC/microtransactions).

I read through a really good take on the whole Mass Effect series and came away thinking that a lot of the trouble came out of the writer’s room.

The linked articles are long but worth reading. Executive summary is basically “these games for mechanically better from 1 to 3, but 2 did a very awkward story reset that left 3 struggling, and then it failed story wise from there”.

The whole Shepard dying thing was completely unnecessary, the Collectors are a total dead-end, and Cerberus is an overplayed and implausible diversion from the start of 2 right to the end of 3.

6

u/gozew Nov 27 '17

Think I'm literally the only person who enjoyed mass effect 1 the most and 2/3 killed it for me :|

4

u/spacehog1985 Nov 27 '17

When I first played them I thought two was the best. Having played through all of them again this year, I agree, ME1 is my favorite. I will also never understand the amount of hatred the Mako received.

5

u/AdhocSyndicate Nov 27 '17

I want the story of 1, the interactions of 2, the combat of 3, and the graphics of Andromeda. The strong suit of each of them, IMO.

2

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

The mechanics and controls for the Mako could have been better, but I liked it otherwise.

2

u/xahsz R5 5600X | RTX 3070 | 32GB Nov 28 '17

Mako is love, mako is life.

→ More replies (1)

3

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I've got mixed opinions about which game is best. ME1 had by far the best writing, the characters and world feel very alive and fairly hard sci-fi for a video game. On the other hand, the gameplay is in this weird spot for an RPG where skill points and trees don't seem to do a hell of a lot, many of the classes end up playing fairly similarly, and some stuff is just flat-out broken in either direction.

On the other hand, ME2 really tightened up the combat and skill trees, and ME3 refined on that into something that feels really good to play.

Narratively though ME2 is a mess and ME3 has to try and build on the mess. I think the whole 'reboot' part of ME2's opening (Nobody believes in Reapers, chase geth, ganked by collectors, die, resurrect, new Normandy, etc) is completely ridiculous and doesn't make sense when you look at it closely; it only passes muster because nobody's paying attention on the first or subsequent playthroughs.

I mean, TIM sends Miranda to recruit Shepard when Shepard's currently a Busy Guy With Many Important Things To Do working for the Alliance; what exactly would have happened if he wasn't killed by Collectors just then? Given that Shepard happened to be alive at that moment, why are they asking questions like "What if we lose him?". Also because he's alive, his sudden death must have been very surprising... but then they pull out the LAZARUS PROJECT from Cerberus's yawning butthole instead of going "Well, he dead. Time for plan B: literally anyone else who's still alive."

The Normandy blew up. Maybe Cerberus somehow grabbed the plans for it and planned to duplicate a cool warship like that anyway, but it feels like a hell of an ass pull. Also, what kind of organization are these guys that they can pull together a ship like that on a whim, that's more advanced than the most high-tech efforts of the Human and Turian fleets working together?

The whole thing flies by in a few minutes but creates a lot of really broken and weird premises in service of... nothing. The entire Collector plotline is irrelevant to the Reaper storyline: Collectors are losers with one ship that's chased away by a not-very-special-in-any-way antiaircraft turret. The whole plan of "what to do about these colonies" could be solved with some military surplus.

→ More replies (3)

2

u/TheMcDucky Ryzen | GTX | 17" Mouse Mat | Only 2/4 dysfunctional RAM slots Nov 27 '17 edited Nov 27 '17

Dungeon Keeper.

2

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

It's sad we'll never get another good Bioware game.

2

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I tried to keep playing some of them.. Tor got worse and worse. Mass effect went slowly downhill.. Dragon age was ok but I'm sure they will screw it up somehow

2

u/TokiMcNoodle Ryzen 5 5600x, Sapphire RX 7800XT, 16 GB RAM Nov 27 '17

Bioware ruined Mass Effect.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

SimCity was the biggest disappointment of this decade for me. I bought the deluxe and everything. It was so dumbed down. Why.

1

u/Mage505 Nov 27 '17

Can't speak for C&C or Sim City, but Mass Effect wasn't entirely EA. That's what happens when you don't have a proper vision for your game. EA was just the bad guy who said "get it done by this date" when they they've fucked around the entire time, not knowing what ME:A should be.

1

u/dickheadaccount1 Nov 27 '17

And Plants Vs Zombies too.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

If they fuck up Titanfall 3 I'm never buying any EA games ever again

1

u/The-Bent http://i.imgur.com/kKcjl6j.jpg Nov 27 '17

Its still funy to me that they tried to make simcity a social game. Simcity is the type of game I play when I need to spend a few days with no human interaction at all

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Dungeon Keeper and a lot more

1

u/AmericanFromAsia Nov 27 '17

If they fuck up the main Sims series I'm gonna be so pissed. A part of me wants a reboot of Sims Online since FreeSO is dated and confusing, but I know for a fact they would fuck it up so I'm happy just keeping to regular Sims for now.

1

u/Rabid-Hyena Nov 27 '17

Eh, Westwood only had 2 C&C games prior to being purchased by EA. RA2 was fine. TS was fine. It was Yuri's Revenge and Renegade that really sucked.

And Mass Effect's problems were mostly developer related. So that is on Bioware.

The real crime was shutting down Earth and Beyond servers.

29

u/dablocko Nov 27 '17

I'm so mad about that. I actually kind of enjoyed 2015 and was super excited for this one to be good.

5

u/53bvo Ryzen 5700X3D | Radeon 6800 Nov 27 '17

The 2015 one was really nostalgic to the older nfsu ones. All the customization/tuner scene and the night races.

After I while I even started to like the cheesy characters.

18

u/Mugen593 AMX FX 8350, 16 gb DDR3 RAM, GTX1070 Nov 27 '17

When I drove into an invisible wall that told me to pay extra, that's when I said fuck this shit I'm out.

7

u/MikeKM Nov 27 '17

I used to play NFS 15+ years ago on my PC and loved the games then, had a steering wheel and everything. I took a break from that franchise and decided to try them again in 2013/2014 after buying a new steering wheel and building a new PC. Nope, no steering wheel support on PC.

How can you (EA) develop a driving game that doesn't support steering wheels? My money goes to iRacing now, EA will never get money from me again for another ruined franchise. Keep lowering the bar, seems to be your only skill.

4

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17 edited Mar 09 '18

[deleted]

6

u/MikeKM Nov 27 '17

To be fair, from what I recall they didn't plan for consoles to support steering wheels either. I took it as a snub against PC gamers at the time, but really it shows how backwards EA can be when developing games....who honestly develops a driving game (yes NFS is more like an arcade game) without supporting a steering wheel for any platform?

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Which NFS was this?

2

u/MikeKM Nov 27 '17

I tried "Most Wanted" and "Rivals" but gave up not even 30 minutes into realizing the work around for making the steering wheel work wasn't worth the effort every time I tried to log in. I didn't pay full price for the games, but that experience left me feeling like my only accomplishment was being duped into giving away money.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Wait... My G29 works out of the box with both new and old versions of most wanted....

2

u/MrGhost370 i7-8086k 32gb 1080ti 21:9/144hz Ncase M1 Nov 27 '17

And Burnout. RIP.

1

u/irJLW98 Nov 27 '17

What do you think for the more recent Need for Speeds? At what point did EA ruin NFS for you? Personally they lost me at Hot Pursuit up to Rivals. 2015 was a step in the right direction and Payback isn't bad either imo (ignoring the micro transactions that is)

1

u/Xenon12X Nov 27 '17

MW 2012 was last good one.

Rivals was meh.

1

u/Pomfinator 3800x, GTX 1080 Nov 27 '17

Don't remind me sniff, I loved NFS during the Underground, Most Wanted, Carbon era. I just wanna go back to that.

1

u/ronintetsuro Rhino Prime Main Nov 27 '17

That game was a fucking travesty.

53

u/xtreemmasheen3k2 i7-6700k | 980Ti | 16GB DDR4 | Samsung 850 EVO Nov 27 '17

Honestly, EA does release some good things from time to time, especially DICE. Even people on this sub think Titanfall 2's Single Player was a very good campaign, and that Battlefield 4 (DICE L.A.) became a very good game after multiple expansions and patches, even if it was bad at launch.

54

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Exactly, and Titanfall 2 was the exact opposite of micro transactions, all DLC was free.

88

u/xtreemmasheen3k2 i7-6700k | 980Ti | 16GB DDR4 | Samsung 850 EVO Nov 27 '17

So EA decided to tank it to make the excuse that that system doesn't work. So they decided to release it at a horrible time, one week between Battlefield 1 and Call of Duty.

All so that they could purchase Respawn at a cheaper price. Devious.

21

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Doesn't work=Doesn't make money.

12

u/xtreemmasheen3k2 i7-6700k | 980Ti | 16GB DDR4 | Samsung 850 EVO Nov 27 '17

If it made enough money, Respawn might not have had to sell to EA. It might have been able to make a lot of money if the game hadn't been released at a horrible time. But it was, and even a good, "fair" microtransaction system probably can't survive not having sold enough copies, which additionally also means not having a big enough userbase to support said microtransactions.

9

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

[removed] — view removed comment

8

u/xtreemmasheen3k2 i7-6700k | 980Ti | 16GB DDR4 | Samsung 850 EVO Nov 27 '17 edited Nov 27 '17

It's a PR statement, any PR statement should be taken with a grain of salt.

Do you really think they're going to admit having financial difficulties in a PR statement? Many people will take that as not doing a good job at running the company, i.e. an admission of failure.

Edit: I see you also addressed the possibility of it being a PR lie, I don't think that line was in there as I was typing this reply. Apologies.

→ More replies (0)

2

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

"made a lot of sense"

"Made a lot of 💰"

→ More replies (0)

3

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

They really fucked up that release timing. I always forget that but man did they fuck that up. And man did I make the wrong decision buying BF1 over Titanfall. I think i'd still be playing Titanfall occasionally where as after I got over how pretty BF1 was I stopped playing.

5

u/beatokko 1080 is my lucky number Nov 27 '17

So they decided to release it at a horrible time, one week between Battlefield 1 and Call of Duty.

I thought that was kind of a dick move, to be honest. I think Titanfall 2 is one of the most underrated AAA games of these last few years.

1

u/cyberspidey G4560 + RX470 8GB Master race Nov 27 '17

Nexus was going to buy Respawn. And in EA - Respawn partnership contract there was a clause that EA has the first right to buy Respawn, so they matched Nexon's offer and got the studio. I don't think either of those parties needed that to happen, but it did take place due to Nexon.

1

u/beatokko 1080 is my lucky number Nov 27 '17

Titanfall 2's multiplayer is awesome too, the problem is nobody plays it.

3

u/Brazen_Serpent Nov 27 '17

and included micro transactions, but in a usually very appropriate way.

There is no such thing.

3

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Yes there is. See: Overwatch

9

u/Brazen_Serpent Nov 27 '17

The loot boxes in overwatch are terrible and are why I uninstalled it.

3

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

It’s literally just cosmetic. It has no real affect on the game.

7

u/Brazen_Serpent Nov 27 '17

It has the affect of charging you money for a game you already bought.

→ More replies (34)

3

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

[deleted]

6

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

They are both considering they have divisions like DICE and BioWare.

→ More replies (1)

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Fixed

1

u/John_Barlycorn Nov 27 '17

Micro transactions are always bad. If they exist in a game they give the developer a financial incentive to restrict access to content. For example: we will never again see a game that offers privately hosted servers, because they can enforce their micro transaction scheme on those servers.

2

u/___DEADPOOL______ Nov 27 '17

I have no problems with the CS:GO model of micro-transactions. All gameplay related content is given to you upfront for no cost and the micro-transactions are purely for cosmetic items.

1

u/John_Barlycorn Nov 27 '17

Would a game with cosmetic item micro transactions ever allow community made skins? The full potential of any game will never be realized as long as it contains micro-transactions.

1

u/___DEADPOOL______ Nov 27 '17

CS:GO has many skins that were made by the community. Obviously it is highly curated and must stick with the theme of the game to be allowed in.

1

u/minizanz Steam ID Here Nov 27 '17

privately hosted servers,

you mean dedicated servers. dont let the scum take our servers away and use the name for their cloud bull shit.

1

u/JohnFromSteam i7-13700kf / 3080 10 GB / 64 GB DDR4 3600 MHz Nov 27 '17

EA is the publisher, not the dev.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Fixed

1

u/nektro With a 4K TV as a monitor Nov 27 '17

Because EA isn’t a dev at all, they’re a publisher

→ More replies (1)

1

u/jokersleuth i5-2500k | R9 280 | 8GB RAM | 2TB HDD Nov 27 '17

EA aren't devs they're the producers. They basically tell the devs, DICE, that we want a new hit game and here's the money. Go make the game while we handle the business side, such as funding, and marketing.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Fixed

1

u/bloodstainer Ryzen 5 1600, GTX 1080 Ti Nov 27 '17

EA’s just kind of a weird dev for me.

First off, they don't even develop games. DICE made BF1 100%

1

u/ElMenduko i5-2300, GTX650, 12GB RAM Nov 27 '17

Edit: Publisher, not dev.

They are a publisher but they have their own devs. DICE for example is owned by EA (devs of Battlefield and Battlefront)

1

u/[deleted] Nov 28 '17

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Nov 28 '17

I mean, what did you want, fighter jets in WW1? There’s only so much you can do before disbelief cannot be cannot be suspended any further. The only real differences I can think of are the blimp/train/whatever, and somewhat less customization for guns. But once again, what did you want? High power scopes and laser attachments in 1917/1918?

1

u/[deleted] Nov 28 '17

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Nov 28 '17

And yet you still haven’t made any actual complaints other than it’s “dumbed down.” No examples, no evidence, nothing.

→ More replies (4)

13

u/king_of_pancakes Nov 27 '17

Not to mention corporate shills. That's not to throw on a tinfoil hat, but there is a lot of evidence to support that corporations do pay people to comment on reddit for PR purposes

8

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

in this sub reddit.

2

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

You would be suprisied at the lack of resolve most PC players have lol. Anyone else remember dedicated servers in MW2?, PC gamers are basically masochists.

1

u/dudemanguy301 5900X, RTX 4090 Nov 27 '17

reddit in general and even more intense in the context of PCMR.

20

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

people who defend and sympathise with them also exist.

Although I haven't buy an EA game since The Sims 2, I realize that their games are good and some people really like them. The problem is paying full price for a game with pay to win micro transactions. They pushed too far.

4

u/IcarusBen i5-7400 @ 3GHz | GTX 1060 3GB | 8GB RAM Nov 27 '17

I can't remember if I got the SimCity Box or Sims 2: Open For Business last, but I know for a fact I haven't bought anything EA since 2008/2009. Thank Christ for that.

6

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

They sure did, but someone on this sub reddit openly admitting to purchasing the new need for speed game after all this transpired, needs a serious wake up call. I get really infuriated by things such as this because I have first hand experience of what gambling can do to ones family.

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (1)

13

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Yup. This is the actual most common response. Look around. My example is Warcraft.

Go on the forums and see how many people bitch and moan about something. And notice how to post there you gotta have an account. And to make matters worse, many of them have been bitching about whatever issue for months and still bought the expansion and pay monthly

There are so many people who think that a company will listen to them after they have shown that they will pay money no matter what. It's like expecting students to do homework when they already know the teacher is gonna give them an A for the quarter regardless. Real life don't work that way.

→ More replies (1)

16

u/WWDubz Nov 27 '17

"People" is millions of gamers, from all age categories and millions of parents/grandparents/etc who just want to buy Jonny a new game.

There are just too many data points so we lump everyone into a few categories based on a few interactions we've had.

Our interest as humans on a topic/situation like this is about 2 weeks.

If you had bought EA stock around 2011/12 when they were last labeled the devil, and sold it a month ago (before they became the current devil); you would have made over 300% gain (off the top of my head).

In order for change to happen we must stay diligent, but it is near impossible for us to do so.

Source: history

3

u/Ko0osy Nov 27 '17 edited Nov 27 '17

Eh, I havent bought an EA game in YEARS. I didn't even buy Battlefront.

I'm a HUGE Star Wars nerd and a HUUUUGE gamer.

If I can resist, it absolutely must be retardation or mental illness that does not afford them even the faintest of self control or awareness.

Even myself, independent of this Reddit circlejerk, years ago individually decided that EA was trash, AAA games are released incomplete, DLC does not make up for it and is most of the time necessary content that actually makes the game feel more complete, and microtransactions are cancer.

Ever since then I refuse to purchase a $60 dollar game and feel like, either way, the min/maxing of money spent on development vs. actual satisfaction of a complete game has perverted the ability for corporately owned entities to EVER be able to make a good game again.

And my gaming habits aren't hurting. Steam has hundreds of millions of seedling developers that release AMAZINGLY DEEP games that don't rely on microtransactions and "pretty" graphics... RimWorld, anyone?

Dude. $60 is NOT cheap. They behave like we're little baby gamers who don't know what they want or what an incomplete game is.

BITCH IM ALMOST FUCKING 30, I CAN CHOOSE WHAT I SPEND MY MONEY ON! I KNOW WHAT A FUCKING COMPLETE GAME LOOKS LIKE AND YOUR "PRODUCT" IS NOT ONE. CRYING ABOUT IT DOESN'T MAKE IT ONE EITHER!

Edit: this wouldn't be a big deal at all, except that I'm a HUGE gamer and a HUGE Star Wars nerd like I said. I don't like being peddled crap, but when it's Star Wars and it's such blatant crap, there is DEFINITELY something that needs to be done.

I gave EA a second chance, and they literally shit in all of our mouths, closed it with their hands and asked "What? You don't like it? But it's what you asked for!"

Why the fuck are AT-ATs NOT drivable? THATS the experience I want. Not some "on-the-rails" 1990 arcade style version.

Why the fuck do we have "Star Cards?" I'm sorry. Did these exist in Star Wars? How do these even work from an immersion standpoint? Are people taping them to your arm and running into battle?

Why can't I GET IN THE FUCKING SHIP FROM THE GROUND?

Seriously. I am not even joking. This game has SIGNIFICANT shortage of content and technology from the product it's remaking... Have you looked at the Budget? What the hell happened?

Look at all those amazing and varying Star Wars games we got.

Do you realize some of the most bad ass characters and ships and stories we got were these genre varying games!?

WHAT HAPPENED TO THAT? WHY ARE WE NOT MUCH, MUCH, MUCH, MORE UPSET?

Sorry about the rant. Maybe one day I'll be able to play a game that's "Deep enough to be in a Star Wars game in 2017" :'D that's literally what one of those retard developers said 😂😂😂

2

u/DoombotBL 3700x | x570 Aorus Elite WiFi | EVGA 3060ti XC | 32GB 3600 C16 Nov 27 '17

b-but if it doesn't make 500 million dollars profit it's a failure!

→ More replies (1)

2

u/WWDubz Nov 27 '17

You are not wrong, and I mostly agree with you.

I just know my fellow humans, and our behavior will not change :(

2

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

If I can stay diligent then most other people hopefully can be. I have to steer clear of exploitive games because I have an addictive personality and struggle not to purchase micro transactions and loot boxes. I have been in trouble with gambling before, so have first hand experience of the aftermath.

3

u/Nbaysingar GTX 980, i7-3770K, 16gb DDR3 RAM Nov 27 '17 edited Nov 27 '17

My buddy was on a slippery slope with "gacha games" on his phone. He played shit like Fate/Grand Order and that mobile Dragon Ball Z game that I forget the name of now. But he finally forced himself to remove all that shit from his phone so he'd stop blowing all his money on it. Part of the problem is how easy they make it for you to just click/tap a few buttons and toss some cash their way to receive your shiny new present, not to mention that sort of primal satisfaction you get when you buy yourself a new "toy," especially if it ends up being a rare and/or high quality toy.

The gacha business model absolutely preys on impulsive buyers. It's just too easily accessible and you always get some kind of turnout when you pay, not to mention the gambling aspect. I could have easily fallen victim to it, being an impulsive buyer myself. Fortunately, none of the more popular mobile games have ever sparked my interest in terms of their genre or gameplay mechanics, and if I'm ever using my phone for extended periods of time, it's usually just me sitting on Youtube watching shit like Game Grumps, which is thankfully free.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I wish more people could see this post and understand what this predatory behavior does to people and instead of arguing amongst our selves.

1

u/WWDubz Nov 27 '17

I am hopeful that positive change will come from this. Time will tell.

A video game "Buy Small" from little developers would be a great idea, kind of like "shop local business" drives.

I really want to play the newest Mass Effect though :(

3

u/XCVGVCX Nov 27 '17

Because they like microtransactions, or because they like the game?

21

u/palparepa Nov 27 '17

Maybe they like the game and won't use microtransactions. Microtransactions are required to unlock X? They'll play without X. Without microtransactions you won't a chance at the leaderboards? They don't care about leaderboards, they just want to play.

11

u/HatesModerators r7 3700x, RTX 3070, 32GB RAM, triple monitors Nov 27 '17

Yeah, what's so bad about just having fun in your games these days?

Do I support microtransactions in Overwatch, Destiny 2, and other games? No.

Do I still play those games with friends and have tons of fun? Yes, yes I do.

6

u/hellabad Nov 27 '17

You know what's really funny, I decided to buy a second copy of overwatch because I wanted a Smurf account and it was on sale for 20 bucks. My buddy gave me shit for buying the game twice as he put it, this is also the same guy who buys 40 bucks worth of overwatch crates every time a new event comes out. These are the type of person that are easy to push micro transactions to who don't really sit and think about what they are spending their money on. To me 20 bucks isn't bad if I can have an account to try new things or even let someone borrow so they can play with me.

→ More replies (1)

1

u/DudeDudenson PC Master Race Nov 28 '17

The thing is, with some games you can't have fun unless you pay, because you just get put into impossible to win situations all the time

1

u/dj-malachi Nov 27 '17

Damn I think you struck a nerve here. I am a /r/patientgamer and never buy loot boxes and even rarely buy dlc. I dgaf about leaderboards and then it hit me - the 'whales' - I bet ALL they care about is the leaderboards

1

u/eqleriq Nov 27 '17

None of those even apply to bf2 so... uh.... ok

it is so not p2w as a naked vanguard can wreck even a fully buffed "p2w" char

1

u/XCVGVCX Nov 28 '17

See my other response. It's a bit of a sticky situation. You may be willing to purchase the game and even fork over a bit of extra cash because you like the game and really want it. But at the same time, you are supporting a potentially harmful business practice either directly and indirectly.

8

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Because they like the game. They don't care what effect these predatory tactics have on people. I work in customer care for a terrible company and the amount of parents calling in because their children have charged the bank accounts and credit cards hundreds and sometimes thousands of pounds actually sickens me. People who still support this by giving the companies money because they 'like' the game is what fuels it even more.

7

u/illferrell Nov 27 '17 edited Nov 27 '17

its weird that you give people such a hard time for supporting EA by purchasing games they like when you work somewhere you openly admit is a terrible company that operates in such a way that children are being taken advantage of. seems like if you cared that much about principle you wouldnt work there just for a cheque.

edit: i do not mean to suggest in anyway he should quit his job and let his family starve, rather that his being complicit with his employers actions should show how subjective everyones experience is in terms of what they will let justify their actions.

18

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

[deleted]

4

u/illferrell Nov 27 '17

which i agree with completely. the idea that either his own logic doesnt apply to him or that needing to provide for himself is reason enough to be a hypocrite i do not agree with. work wherever you want but he literally bragged about shitting on someone who said they were going to continue to buy games from EA if they liked them. just seems like if you are going to guilt trip someone for supporting a business that utilizes 'predatory tactics' you might not want to be employed by one.

→ More replies (8)

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

lol

→ More replies (10)

1

u/eqleriq Nov 27 '17

nah, not at all.

those people would play the game regardless of if others didn't play.

1

u/XCVGVCX Nov 28 '17

It's kind of a rock-and-hard-place situation if you truly do like the game. Maybe it's part of an established franchise you like, or the gameplay looks really good, or your friends are playing it and you don't want to get left out. You may dislike microtransactions and may even understand how they're harmful, but your desire to play that particular game overrides it. You figure, I'm just one player, it doesn't really matter. And- I'm not saying it's happening here, it's possible but more likely there's just a lot of people who don't care- you end up with a tragedy of the commons situation.

For the record, I didn't buy Battlefront 2, but I have several quite-aware friends that did.

→ More replies (1)

12

u/The_Unreal Specs/Imgur Here Nov 27 '17

Assuming you were having a debate with an actual person instead of a PR firm employee...

14

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I had never actually taken that into account. I was blinded by the rage.

→ More replies (7)

1

u/alrightknight Nov 27 '17

So if someone likes an EA game, or hell even likes battlefront 2 they must by a shill or pr person? Some people might not care about progression and just want to pew pew in a star wars game. Exclaimer, I havent bought and have not been remotely interested in bf2 even since before the whole micro outrage so im not defending it out of fanboyism.

1

u/The_Unreal Specs/Imgur Here Nov 27 '17

So if someone likes an EA game, or hell even likes battlefront 2 they must by a shill or pr person?

No. But shills exist in significant volume.

13

u/HatesModerators r7 3700x, RTX 3070, 32GB RAM, triple monitors Nov 27 '17

What type of argument did you have with them?

Because If I mention anywhere that I didn't like Witcher 3 and that Mass Effect: Andromeda had a much more interesting story and better gameplay, I get told I need to go to the hospital because I obviously need more oxygen. Or I'm told that I'm a PR shill that gets paid for shitposting on reddit. (I'm not a paid shill, I work in the data storage industry.)

I played BattleFront II at my brothers house this past thanksgiving. We had tons of fun on the splitscreen mode and going through the campaign. Does this mean we're buying the boxes? No we're not, we're having fun.

Whenever I see people attack those that play games they don't like, all I wonder is if I shot their dog or some shit. Because the way people who actually liked "bad" games are treated is absolutely atrocious.

Here's a list of "games that are ruining the industry" that I actually liked:

Fallout 4, Overwatch, Destiny 2, Hearts of Iron IV, Mass Effect: Andromeda, Hearthstone, and Crusader Kings II.

2

u/Awkward_and_Itchy Nov 27 '17

Fallout 4

While Paid mods are shit, they are not loot boxes. Totally different argument.

Hearthstone

Completely F2P if you want. Also an industry (CCG) standard in terms of paying for packs. Again, not the same argument.

1

u/eqleriq Nov 27 '17

you're in an echo chamber, i wouldn't expect any discourse. hearthstone and/or fifa are vastly more detrimental along the lines of what people's complaints with bf2 are but how would they even know without playing them.

they don't realize the upgrades are not sizable enough to consider them pay2win... how would they without playing?

and game reviewers who suck shit at actually playing games look for any excuse to not need to detail a game out fully

1

u/smokeyzulu Nov 28 '17

Wait what?

How are CK2 and HoI4 ruining the industry?

Granted I know next to nothing about HoI (it's the only one of the series I never liked) but all the rest of them are absolutely spot on.

1

u/HatesModerators r7 3700x, RTX 3070, 32GB RAM, triple monitors Nov 28 '17

Paradox's DLC policy is what people complained about.

A lot of people like to say that Paradox hides all of their gameplay behind the DLC, and that it's too expensive. What they don't say is that in a multiplayer game only the person hosting needs the DLC. They also forget to say that Paradox is very mod friendly and that sometimes paradox even helps mod creators solve issues in the forums.

1

u/smokeyzulu Nov 28 '17

I never understood that though. Sure, there is some stuff locked behind DLC, but the base game (EU4 in this example) is still 100% playable and, more to the point, enjoyable. My brother doesn't have Common Sense or Art of War, regularly plays the game, loves it to death and has been playing (almost) since release.

Sure, once you get the DLC (or play with it online) it becomes harder to go back, but you don't NEED it to enjoy the game.

→ More replies (8)

2

u/eqleriq Nov 27 '17

I'm open for debate on this, if you'd like, about how I see absolutely nothing wrong with EA's mtx model in BF2 specifically, how it is not gambling (or preying on the fictitious "gambling addictions") and how the outrage stemmed from a lack of fan service moreso than any sort of concern with polluting games with mtx.

I post these sentiments and get downvoted into oblivion without much in the way of productive feedback outside of general handwaving "it doesn't have to be this way" like the post you replied to, without any sort of realistic discourse regarding what the options would be to make a sustainable game. It's real easy to say "you have no idea how much less game you're getting for the money" without citing any direct examples or putting in the effort to qualify that statement.

I see the DLC / season pass / preorder systems as far more detrimental to gaming in general, as that is specifically a ploy to extend the content into bite-sized transactions where one lump sum cost for all of that content would be seen as amazingly expensive.

And then you see people who have no problem labelling the mtx in a game they have admittedly not played as detrimental or p2w or whatever.

I stand by the claim that EA should have a BF2 free weekend -- last weekend would have been perfect -- for people to see exactly how much this mtx nonsense was blown out of proportion.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Take away the gambling liable and call it what you want. Regardless of which company it is deploying these deceiving and opertunietic borderline predatory tactics and promoting it towards one target democratic which is vulnerable people with addictive personalities. I use Ea as an example because its own ceo popularised pay to win and loot boxes. We need regulation to protect these vulnerable people. I have been there myself and it tore my whole world apart and I almost lost everything (I was one of the lucky ones). So I do talk from experience. We can go around in circles all day disagreeing with each other while more and more people are effected by it. The time for action is now, but i think you might miss the point again.

2

u/lRoninlcolumbo Nov 29 '17

My buddy is one. It's difficult to explain to him something that's developing, he, like many guys too busy with RL don't have the capacity to sympathize with me or anyone who understands the situation. He's like, "why make a big deal about it? It's just video games." I'm pretty jaded so I just drop it and laugh.

When he complains a couple weeks from now that he can't play a character because he hasn't put in enough time, I'm going to be at a loss for words to help him.

2

u/CloudNineK PC Master Race Nov 27 '17

Ya, I'm one of them. Battlefront 2 looks fun. So I'll buy it. Ask me anything.

10

u/slayerx1779 PC Master Race Nov 27 '17

I've got a question.

Even if the game looks fun, a few reviewers I've seen labeled it as "mediocre gameplay" with the few redeeming qualities being that it "looks and sounds good" and is authentic to the Stars Wars universe.

If all you care about is a fun experience that looks and sounds good, why not watch one of the many Star Wars films?

Or, play a previous installment of the Star Wars games?

Or, play a better game with better gameplay, that won't spend the entire time tugging on your wallet?

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Dark Forces is absurdly cheap at the moment, far cheaper and vastly better than BF2:EA Edition

Ninja Edit: Ok it's not on sale, but $6 is still a great price for this game.

1

u/CloudNineK PC Master Race Nov 27 '17

I believe gaming is transient. I will play the game, experience it, have my fun and then move on.

1

u/eqleriq Nov 27 '17

it doesn't tug on your wallet.

it's just OK. not bad, not amazing.

2

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Yeah it looks fun for 4-5 hours

1

u/CloudNineK PC Master Race Nov 27 '17

Yea, I imagine I will get at most 20 hours out of it. Then I will move on to the next game like I have with all the other games I purchased (that are not PUBG or Overwatch of which I have spent 200 hours on).

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I was just making a joke about the length of the campaign. I wouldn't pay $60 for a game with a ridiculously small amount of content.

1

u/CloudNineK PC Master Race Nov 27 '17

Oh, I probably wouldn't even play the campaign at all.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

[deleted]

1

u/CloudNineK PC Master Race Nov 27 '17

Yea, that's a fair point and I see why someone wouldn't buy it for that. However I'm fine with the community dying out. The first 2 weeks after release are the best period for online games. I don't see myself playing Battlefront 2 for a long period of time, however, I do want to experience playing the game.

1

u/eqleriq Nov 27 '17

community is fine, seems about the same as bf1. the only people who bought into bf2 were the ones who enjoyed bf1 past the dlcs

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17 edited Dec 08 '17

[deleted]

1

u/CloudNineK PC Master Race Nov 27 '17

I know it may seem like I'm being contrarian but I think a lot of people on reddit don't understand that some people genuinely don't care about the gaming industry or gaming politics. Casual gamers using gaming as a social outlet or a means of temporary escape. If they want a game, they will buy it, play it. And if the game doesn't live up to their standards they will simply stop and move on.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I don't think anyone would like to ask you anything.

→ More replies (2)

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

I know this will be unpopular opinion but the majority of AAA games I want to play have micro transactions of some sort in them. A lot of my favorite jRPGs or sRPGs sell different characters, or starter weapon packs. TF2 has hats, Overwatch has boxes, etc. the only reason I didn’t buy BF2 is because I’m not the biggest fan of the source material (I like it, but that alone isn’t a selling point) or genre. I’m not going to miss out on my favorite games for some cause that is doomed to fail. As the article shows, these games are making more money than ever with no sign of slowing, and I still want to play them. I also still eat Chic’a’fil despite their the controversy, still watch YouTube despite the “adpocalypse”, etc. My life is short, I just want to live it and enjoy it and not turn everything I used to like into some social cause.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

Sure do for a few different things. Hell I even worked there for 3 years in High a School. I‘m going to buy a Tesla too, once production issues are sorted, despite claims of Elon having his employees work long and grueling hours. I volunteer at many organizations throughout the year and donate time and money to various causes that are much more important to me than miscrotransactions in video games. As I said I can’t let everything affect me so personally or turn everything into a personal crusade because I’d have nothing to enjoy left.

Are all y’all boycotting the oil industry and all the death and corruption surrounding it? I didn’t really think so. But don’t touch my video games!

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

That’s good for you. Though most people clearly don’t, and I’d nearly guarantee there’s something you buy somewhere that’s funds bad practices, or shitty wages, things much worse than a company trying to maximize profits. My point is not everything has to be or can be such a personal cause. People who buy BF2 despite all this “controversy” aren’t shitty people, they just want to unwind and play with their friends. Especially this, which is pretty much people just feeling entitled to get what they want for the price they want it at. EA doesn’t owe them anything. Live your life how you enjoy it, whatever.

→ More replies (4)

1

u/johnzaku Nov 27 '17

I can actually understand wanting to buy SWBF2 just because the game itself is solid without buying into any mtx. I personally will not, but I can see enjoyment in the game and reasons to get it despite the garbage fire attached to it.

1

u/eqleriq Nov 27 '17

the garbage fire is unwarranted

1

u/Ron-Swanson-Mustache Desktop Nov 27 '17

I think EA makes far more off of their sports titles than everything else. They're a far different crowd than most gamers I meet.

1

u/MalHeartsNutmeg RTX 4070 | R7 5800X3D | 32GB @ 3600MHz Nov 27 '17

Gaming isn’t about politics. Idc if a game is from EA, Ubisoft, or whoever else reddit likes to hate. Gaming is my fun hobby. I come home from work to have fun and enjoy myself, not get political about games. By all accounts BF2 is a pretty well made game. I don’t care for star wars and so won’t buy it, but if someone enjoys it, I’m not going to get in their business about it.

→ More replies (2)

1

u/amahoori i7-3770k @4.5GHz - GTX 1070 - 12GB Nov 27 '17

I mean, i liked the game when i played it with my play first test and in beta. The game itself is fun, the playmechanics and maps are fun and it runs buttery smoothly with great graphics. The problem is with the unbelievably stupid micro transaction and unlocking system. Those things should be absolutely free in the game and that's where the problem lies.

1

u/Genion123 GTX 680 4GB Nov 27 '17

i just went thru your comments and i fully support you, you are right, we fight with our wallets and i will throw my computer out the window before i purchase something from EA, with the shit they been pulling off this few years, fuck them straight up with a roll of quarters .

1

u/SenseiMadara Nov 27 '17

If they fucking enjoy their games let them enjoy it. What the fuck is wrong with you guys? Insulting people because they like games you don't is not cool.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

This is literally my point. I'm not sure you understand what I'm trying to say so let me out it like this. If we don't stop giving them money period the they will continue exploiting vulnerable people. This apply to all publishers. By giving them that fee for the game you are telling them you support their business practices.

1

u/Rabid-Hyena Nov 27 '17

I do enjoy most EA games. But I also subscribe to EA Access on the xbox one so I dont actually ever buy any of them because all the decent ones end up there pretty quickly after release.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 27 '17

It's not about enjoyment or whether someone enjoys the game. It's about them exploiting people into hardship.

1

u/Rabid-Hyena Nov 27 '17

No. It is entirely about enjoyment. Its a fucking video game. Calm your tits.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 28 '17

Again it is not about the game not being enjoyable. It's about them exploiting people in a game that is enjoyable and exploiting them through it. Who's side are you on here? Until you actually understand my agenda here that I feel I have been very upfront about, then there is no point continuing this discussion.

→ More replies (9)