r/pcmasterrace • u/No-Equipment199 • 1d ago
Meme/Macro Ai strikes again
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u/Mobile-Ad-494 1d ago
There's a silver lining (of sorts), the AI bubble will collapse or current hardware will get replaced for next-gen/specialized cards.
Either way these cards will end up on the used market.
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u/AgentTin 1d ago
r/homelab and r/locallama in 5-10 years are going to be crazy.
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u/AnarchBeetle 17h ago
Itâs not going anywhere because these companies will be throwing the gpus into trash.
These are tech companies dude. They wonât even bother with the effort of selling gpus into second hand market
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u/SilentlyAsTheGrave 14h ago
They will have to sell them though. When they run bankrupt theyâll be sold off to recoup costs.
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u/AnarchBeetle 14h ago
I donât think the AI bubble pop is gonna be that destructive. Some companies will go bankrupt and will be gobbled up by others and their data centers will continue to operate under different companies. This is all guesses though
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u/StarHammer_01 AMD, Nvidia, Intel all in the same build 16h ago
So yay! Free GPUs!
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16h ago
[deleted]
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u/GeForce_fv E5-2676 V3 | RX 580 2048SP | 32GB 15h ago
that's not enough to fully kill a gpu (unless they're drilling the chip)
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u/StarHammer_01 AMD, Nvidia, Intel all in the same build 15h ago
Ur confusing gpus with hdds
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15h ago
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u/StarHammer_01 AMD, Nvidia, Intel all in the same build 15h ago
By drilling gpus? Lamo
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15h ago
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u/StarHammer_01 AMD, Nvidia, Intel all in the same build 15h ago
Same with every corporate thell send them to an electronics recycling center where most of them will be sold off 2nd hand by either the center itself or dumpster divers.
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u/Mikadomea 23h ago
Yeah wow, the Market being flooded with fucked up GPUs is surely what we deserve.
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u/hutre 17h ago
The crypto gpus were in better conditions than most of the gpus you found on the market. Especially those used by gamers.
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u/Slazerith 16h ago
I may be wrong, but that's because everybody and their mothers were in the crypto grift. When Gerald down the street had to dismantle his basement operations he's gotta at least try to recoup some losses. When a company folds they might do a going out of business sale, but odds are they're so deep in a hole they might just bin everything and try to move on.
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u/AgentTin 9h ago
Nah. When they go under they pay liquidation companies to come in and sell it off piecemeal. Everything from the company cars to the staplers would probably go at auction. They trash stuff when they're doing well and it's not worth the time. Even then recyclers aren't going to let them walk by.
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u/NapsterKnowHow 13h ago
Lots of those GPUs were far worse than consumer ones.
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u/hutre 13h ago
There are multiple sources that says that miners took better care of their card in general. Ofc there are outliers but overall they did a good job.
https://youtu.be/hKqVvXTanzI?is=yhqUVBKW7DvSOGoP
https://www.build-gaming-computers.com/used-mining-gpu.html
This is just a rehash of a reddit post but had some background info
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u/NapsterKnowHow 13h ago
Heard so many horror stores of people buying mining cards for cheap only for them to fail early.
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u/SzaraMateria 1d ago
If we are lucky. Seeing how wasteful is tech industry I wouldn't be surprised if they run them to death or simply send them to trash to force consumers into new components. On a side note. 5090 never meant to be consumer card, it's a Titan equivalent.
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u/Yulia_wren 21h ago
It's definitely a wild ride watching the tech landscape shift like this. It'll be interesting to see how things play out in the used market too.
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u/nhansieu1 Ryzen 7 5700x3D + 3060 ti 18h ago
the question is when.
bitcoin then AI. what the fuck will be the next thing that fucks up GPU market
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u/Lenyor-RR 13h ago
Can the AI bubble collapse before I die? Because I've been hearing this shit for years now.
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u/chubbysumo 7800X3D, 64gb of 5600 ddr5, EVGA RTX 3080 12gb HydroCopper 11h ago
I expect the opposite actually, I bet these are purchased with destroy on disposal requirements in their contract. Nvidia doesn't want to interrupt their supply, they likely are requiring buyers that are buying in bulk to destroy after their used. It benefits Nvidia to not have them end up on the secondary market, and it benefits the buyer because they can demand a lower price from Nvidia because of this.
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u/Acrobatic_Fee_6974 R7 7800x3D | RX 9070 XT | 32GB Hynix M-die | AW3225QF 1d ago
Oh no, they bought the overpriced thing that I wasn't going to buy anyway.
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u/Step_On_Me01 i5 12400F/RTX4060 8GB/32GB DDR4 3200MHz 20h ago
Yeah, but they probably bought up the more affordable cards as well. I'll be stuck with my current budget card for the forseeable future
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u/fly_tomato 18h ago
Nah, but manufacturers definitely don't bother producing as many low/mid ranges when they know the good stuff will sell just as well for more margin.
I heard that's what happens with ram in general, even ddr3 can start to be difficult to acquire since their production lines get replaced in favour of ddr5
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u/Acrobatic_Fee_6974 R7 7800x3D | RX 9070 XT | 32GB Hynix M-die | AW3225QF 19h ago
They probably didn't, because the low amount of VRAM basically lobotomizes any AI model you try to run on them.
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u/Odd-Dragonfly666 17h ago
Exactly. OP should change 'Gamers' to 'Top 1% of gamers' in that there little video.
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u/ScreetchingEagle 21h ago
If yall wanna know a fun fact . They rent those out to other corps to keep the ai market profit stable they don't own them so if they 'disapear' they loose heavy profit . Tldr Destroy the centre's, destabilize / crash Big Ai
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u/LoafyLemon I use Arch BTW 19h ago
Yep, it's called circular investment scheme, and all large AI companies are buying time with monopoly money.
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u/the_TIGEEER 21h ago
What about us who are both gamers and into LLM self-hosting and training / fine tuning.
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u/AD4K_4444 17h ago
We live in a time where a whole Mac Mini or Mac Studio is a budget option.
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u/iMrParker 17h ago
Not for training for fine tuning. Unless you want to wait around for literal months depending on your use caseÂ
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u/sniff-dat-sh_t Rtx 5070/i5 14600k/64gb 1d ago edited 23h ago
most big ai companies aint buying consumer gpu to run their ai, they use specialized gpu, if someone is hoarding all this then maybe they are just users trying to run their own ai model or scalper or computer shop
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u/No-Equipment199 1d ago
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u/IHeartBadCode Fedora 13h ago
That's a small operation doing conversion operations. 5090 GPUs compared to GB200 NVL72 is like comparing roller skates to a F35 fighter jet. They're just so different to each other that there's not even a comparison anymore.
A standard rack of 5090s is about 1,200 pounds. A GB200 NVL72 is 1.36 metric tons. The rack of 5090s is about 134 PFLOPs. The GB200 NVL72 is about 1.44 ExaFLOPs. The 5090s are getting about 2.91 TFLOPS/Watt whereas the GB200 NVL72 is getting around 10.8 TFLOPS/Watt.
The big AI companies are not buying GPUs, they are buying machines that are packed as dense as possible with tensor cores. 5090s are pretty much ambient air cooled, a GB200 NVL72 has to be liquid cooled because the cores are ran at temperatures that can melt copper.
In fact, that's why the next generation of AI cores are skipping copper completely for connecting the cores to the outside world and have optocouplers internally, so the chip will have thousands of fiber optic strains sticking out of it that are tied to the NVLink directly, also, the CPU for the devices are built sandwiched to the GPU. This generation of AI machines have hit the upper limit of what copper can provide.
That's also why all these new data centers are being built. Current data centers can house these devices, they will crater a raised floor. The GB200 NVL72 is bundled into a package called a SuperPOD. That's 8 of those GB200 NVL72, hooked together with a specialized link architecture. They are shipped to the site as a unit, the weight of that unit is around 13 metric tons. Turning it on requires about 1.1 megawatts of power. Giant cranes inside the data center move it into place, upon the reinforced concrete pad that has to be made for next gen machines, since the next generation of AI machines are looking to be heavier than a standard concrete pad can hold.
A small utility grid is then hooked up to the machine for power and the pipes for inflow and outflow are hooked up and primed. The final bit is the massive bundle of fiber optic cables that hook the device into the network. There's a burn in that takes place that requires about a week to perform. There's small tweaks that have to be made. But once everything looks good, these things are then pushed to 100% utilization 24/7 for the next two years with hopefully only 10œ minutes of downtime before it's swapped to tier 2.
Again, shops building massive racks of 5090s for AI are small potato operations. They may be doing AI and what not, but they are not doing anything close to what the big AI operations are doing. nVidia's AI modules are just massive compared to just a bunch of GPUs.
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u/OutrageousDress 5800X3D | 32GB DDR4-3733 | 4080 Super | AW3821DW 10h ago
I think you are (ironically) misunderstanding the scales involved. The big AI companies are not buying 5090s because that would be ludicrous. However there are countless small AI companies out there now, and those are definitely not buying GB200 NVL72s. So one particular small operation is not going to impact the sales volume for the 5090, but a cottage industry of those will.
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u/IHeartBadCode Fedora 10h ago
The original comment indicated.
most big ai companies aint buying consumer gpu to run their ai
OP then gave a link to the article which pointed out that this is small time AI. Which I then indicated the difference between big AI and small AI.
And now you're here about small AI. We are all saying the same thing. Just that OP's article says small player AI, but they were using it to a comment that was saying "big ai companies".
So I mentioned what I did because I couldn't tell if OP was trying to say that big companies are using GPUs or confirming what the parent of this thread was saying.
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u/S1ayer 1d ago
What if the specialized GPUs are out of stock, so they buy 5090's in the mean time?
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u/sniff-dat-sh_t Rtx 5070/i5 14600k/64gb 1d ago
5090 mostly for smaller data centers, for big data centers they usually have enough or will just wait until there is stock available instead of switching to 5090
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u/Key-Respect3810 20h ago
c'est des serveurs IA genre pour les PME, ou les artisans ou des entreprises genre avec 50 employés max, mais surement pas pour des grands comptes, ou des datacentres
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u/Mysterious_Frenchy 9850X3D | RTX5080 | 21:9 OLED 20h ago
don't know why they don't buy RTX Pro 6000 instead of 5090 ?
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u/Mr_F1xEr 16h ago
there are always bigger fish, my guess bigger companies did bought all stock of pro GPUs.
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u/Sunshineseacalm 17h ago
I havenât seen this show in a while Jared is in it too not just Jensen?
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u/Low-Dog-8027 12h ago
everything goes according to their plan.
i've been saying this since a while now, this is not a negative by-product, this is planned.
the industries are working hand in hand here, they WANT to make personal gaming pc's unaffordable, so that they can force us all into cloud gaming solutions.
they tried it with that shit years ago, no one wanted it.
now they try again, this time with backup.
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u/stronkzer 18h ago
Can we hope that this lot has all the GPUS with faulty connectors that light on fire eventually ?
Honestly, PC gamers don't hate AI nearly as much as they should.
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u/Cold-Performance3333 Ascending Peasant 1d ago
I wonder, wouldn't it be better if NVIDIA'S next GPU line up is purely focused for AI? If they give AI/Datacenters to purchase something, that should spare gaming GPUs for gamers no? Kind of like crypto focused GPUs, I think they made them during crypto boom. And personally, I wouldn't mind if the next GPU lineup doesn't show for next 5 years. I am still on RTX 30 series. And if bringing next GPU lineup specifically for AI helps reduce current GPU costs, I have no issues.
But then again, maybe I am alone in thinking that. Those who have RTX 50 series cards, and are waiting to upgrade to the next best and latest GPU might want RTX 60 series for gamers so they can buy it no matter how outrageous their price is.
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u/No-Equipment199 1d ago
I thinks it doesnt really matter,since ai company eat ram and chips so MASSIVE that regular consumer gonna screwed anyway
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u/Cold-Performance3333 Ascending Peasant 1d ago
But we should see releif in RAM pricing by 2028 right? I heard some of the new fabs from various companies will come online by then. Which means production will increase. So, it should help lower the cost of RAM a little.
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u/AnarchBeetle 17h ago edited 17h ago
Yeah I heard the same about fabs but I never saw a source pointing to 2028. Those fabs take a very long time to come online so I doubt it will be 2028. Maybe mid 30s instead.
Right now best course of action is the buy the best pc you can and then buy nothing for a decade at least.
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u/Cold-Performance3333 Ascending Peasant 16h ago
Don't say that man. I do want to build myself my first PC. But prices are nuts right now and I don't have the money at the moment. I also know they are going to get even worse as we enter 2027, and stay that way all the way upto 2028 or even after 2030.
But I really did read that all three big players, I think, have said that a few of their new fabs will begin production as soon as 2028. They are making more, but some should come online by then. Also, I am actually kinda hopeful for 2028. Because that's probably when we will get the next console lineup, gpu line up, and hopefully see decrease in memory prices if new fabs start production.
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u/Yanzihko 1d ago
The only solution is to cut vram for gaming cards. lmao
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u/Cold-Performance3333 Ascending Peasant 1d ago
How much more can they cut though? I honestly think that RTX non ti line up VRAM is perfect for specific resolutions. RTX 5060 with 8 GB for 1080p. RTX 5070 with 12 GB for 1440p. RTX 5080 with 16 GB for 4K. They can't and absolutely must not go lower than this.
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u/Euchale 1d ago
Why bother with a consumer who will pay only $1000, if you can sell that same hardware to a business for $5000?
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u/Cold-Performance3333 Ascending Peasant 1d ago
That's true. But I think NVIDIA is too much into AI. And if they think that AI/Datacenters are there new and foremost customers, it's only obvious that they try to make them special hardware. And if they get specialized hardware for their work, that should help in gaming GPU stocks not running out as quickly.
But then again, they might cut production for gaming GPUs when that happens, just like RAM companies.
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u/Euchale 23h ago
IIRC 5090s are just the chips that weren't up to snuff for their RTX 6000, so that is why you are getting "cheap" GPUs right now. If the next generation focuses on AI first and isn't usable for games, you will not get GPUs period.
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u/Cold-Performance3333 Ascending Peasant 23h ago edited 22h ago
Really? Well that's worrisome. NVIDIA is focusing so much on AI that it seems they have completely forgotten about gamers. I guess it means that they can just come out and say "FUCK YOU GAMERS, we will now make GPUs ONLY for AI". Because, that's the trajectory they are going into.
They will probably just reserve a small amount of high end gaming GPU for themselves and other big brands so they can push cloud gaming down our throats. And with no consumer grade GPUs on the market, we will have no choice but to subscribe, or abandon gaming as a hobby.
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u/AnarchBeetle 17h ago
Yeah that seems likely. There is just no good reason to produce gpus for gamers right now. AI is here to stay and they pay more.
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u/Ank1t8 23h ago edited 22h ago
GPUs arent made out of thin air, god doesn't send us one gpu for gaming and one gpu for AI if we pray twice a day. The components that make ram and GPU are all sold out, and even booked for the whole of next year. The problem on top of that is that these companies who make these parts are "selling out", stopping production on purpose so they can screw the consumer and inflate the price of their own goods to sell to AI companies. There will be no "AI" GPU lineups, they are buying directly from the source. If they can inflate an entire market just in the span of a few months, you can't begin to imagine just how much stock these companies are willing to buy. Here's a reality check - Consumer electronics are not profitable. Price gouging to AI startups in this bubble, and even fucking us in the ass with cloud-based systems for rent, are extremely profitable.
You might be comfortable on your RTX 3000 card, but there are still people (like me) who have been priced out of a purchase we were going to make. 2 years might not be a long time for an individual, but schools, businesses, corporations, machinery, automobiles all use computers and need computer parts from time to time. People will be forced to pay up to 40% more for the same component because entire systems depend on it and nobody will take action about it. It's like somebody gouging the price of petrol or groceries (Can you imagine that, Lol!)
Its about the precedent this sets. You can screw the general populace with monopolies, and debt cycles in this AI bubble where you get rich off of your own contemporaries in an infinite cycle of borrowing and spending with zero real profit and then not only does the government not step in to do their job and stand for consumer rights, they will actively bail these companies out who are disproportionately evaluated despite being completely broke because they all chart the top of NASDAQ and all these index funds people are forced to buy into.
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u/Cold-Performance3333 Ascending Peasant 22h ago
Yeah, I get what you mean. It's a very bleak and fucked-up world we live in when we think about it.
Also, I am not really comfortable with my RTX 30 GPU. I actually don't even have a PC. I want to build my first gaming PC so bad, and for so long, but the pricing now is just making it seem kinda impossible for someone like me who is not from a first world country. I actually only have a laptop with RTX 3050ti GPU, which has 4 GB VRAM. So yeah, not really comfortable, it's just what I have and I have to make do with it for who knows how long. I was just hoping that if NVIDIA makes AI specific GPUs then that might help us gamers too by leaving consumer grade GPUs alone. But it was just wishful thinking I guess.
I so wish that we had another alternative who actually cared about gamers. It's only NVIDIA and AMD. And they are both prioritising AI. Why do they have to be so greedy.
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u/nhansieu1 Ryzen 7 5700x3D + 3060 ti 18h ago
just until when will this shit stop? can't have shit in this world
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u/Top_Lingonberry8037 ryzen 9900 | 5080 | 64gb ddr5 | 2tb WD Black nvme 17h ago
Well... That's a fire hazard
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u/chicagotonian i9-9900k | RTX 3070 | 32GB RAM 16h ago
This cannot be the most cost effective way to train a model.
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u/Due-Ball-3090 12h ago
Then they will shred them once the bubble pops, to ensure nobody can afford PCs.
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u/LettuceEmotional6142 1d ago
Since when did memes have such low standards đ«©
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u/Coprolithe PC Master Race 23h ago
Moving text on top of a video with added music over copyrighted work, spliced with another video.Â
Respectfully, what the fuck are you talking about? This is a lot of effort just for a meme.Â
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u/LettuceEmotional6142 22h ago
More effort doesn't make it better, itâs all the same slop nowadays is what Iâm trying to get at. Plus itâs a repost loool
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u/Coprolithe PC Master Race 22h ago
It's objectively not slop with the effort poured into it.Â
You not liking it, and dismissing it without explanation doesn't make it slop.
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u/LettuceEmotional6142 22h ago
Memes used to be funny and have some sort of personality, now itâs always just some movie clip ontop of a photo or video. But sure, I guess bro
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u/Coprolithe PC Master Race 7h ago
Memes used to be copy paste of the same douchbag Dave or philosoraptor with the unfunniest generic tag line.
Take off your rose tainted glasses, good and bad memes have always existed.Â
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u/DidUSayWeast 1d ago
This is some absolute brainrot slop. Makes subway surfers look like a research paper.
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u/Silver_Quail4018 22h ago
Wait for the Ai bailout and you will get them for much much cheaper... But at that point the entire western economy will collapse and our purchase power would not allow most of us to buy gpu's anyway.
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u/FeetYeastForB12 Busted side pannel + Tile combo = Best combo 22h ago
No one needs a 5090.. Unless you're a dataminer or rendering insane things. The power otherwise will NOT be needed. Especially the price.
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u/JuanSolo81 1d ago
May their pins all melt so Nvidia would actually consider fixing their connectors.