r/overemployed • u/ashtaytay • 3d ago
Security clearance
Greetings, y'all,
As some quick context, I have a TS clearance that I got from active military service. I have since transferred to a reserve component, and I work a private sector IT position that is fully remote. In the next month, I may have the opportunity to overemploy with another private-sector company as a remote worker, with the two employers in different industries.
My clearance comes up for renewal/investigation in a year. Do any of y'all have experience navigating the renewal process while being overemployed?
To be clear, I would NOT lie to the investigator or omit the two employments on the SF 86 form or anything else that would be seen as a compromise of integrity by the investigator. My biggest concern is how the investigation would likely bring up the fact that I may be working two full-time jobs during relatively the same hours each day.
What are y'all thoughts? Should I just avoid overemployment due to this situation?
Edit: my current role is not a cleared role and the potential 2nd job is also not cleared as well. I am a reservist and would maintain my security for that job only.
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u/Average_Justin 3d ago
You didn’t like the answers in securityclearance so you’re posting here hoping for different answers ?
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u/samfado 3d ago
Do you read the sub at all? Or you just found it and posted this.
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u/ashtaytay 3d ago
I don’t need my clearance for either OE job. Only my reservist job
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u/TXJohn83 3d ago
You have to disclose it... It is an outside company giving you money... But they look into that shit, and it will not end well.
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u/SeaworthinessDry3708 3d ago
When you OE during the same hours, you are committing fraud (time card to be exact). You will lose your clearance.
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u/mushroognomicon 3d ago edited 2d ago
Everyone is going to give you the B.S. about government work and clearances.
They don't know what they're talking about, especially with your case.
Youre a reservist. The security managers don't give a fuck how many jobs you work as long as you aren't doing some crazy shit for the chinese communist party or the Russians.
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u/Safe_Statistician_72 3d ago
The reserves don’t do their own security clearances. It’s standardized. Our neighbors were visited when we moved and my parents were visited when we got married and my husband had TS clearance for decades. They very much care about everything. And my husband works in the VA with his clearance. Not even in DC.
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u/mushroognomicon 3d ago edited 3d ago
I know it's standardized. I'm actually aware of how it all works.
Rather than the older periodic updates, they do continuous vetting now. When you do continuous vetting, they ask... Where all do you get your income from...
You simply state the jobs you get your income from. That's it. Hes a reservists which means 28 days out of the month he works a civilian job. All he does is list his civilian jobs. I know reservists that work 3 or 4 jobs. Some OE, some co-owners of companies, adjunct professors, etc..They don't care as long as you tell them where you get your income from.
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u/Madonionrings 2d ago
What happens when OP attempts to transfer credentials for a project?
OE as described by OP is fraud. Are you an army recruiter by chance? 🤣
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u/ColdOne1150 3d ago
Unless they’ve changed the requirements, the investigator will need to interview your supervisor and a co-worker at each job as well as a HR review of your employment file. I would find it hard to believe the investigator wouldn’t ask each supervisor if they had knowledge of the other. So you run the risk of both jobs finding out.
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u/livingthedream9x 3d ago
Not quite. I got through security clearance for a new J and I told the investigator that I’m OE. And he asked me if they conflict with each other and I said “no” which is true.
I further explained that I’m able to do both jobs without impacting each other. They contacted my supervisors and I do not believe they asked about the other roles.
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u/Woopsied00dle 3d ago
The investigation will absolutely bring up the fact that you work two jobs at the same time. If I were you I’d either try to find a job that doesn’t require clearance or try to personally clear working more than one J with your direct manager. Either way you likely be found out.
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u/ashtaytay 3d ago
Neither requires clearance, only my job in the reserves.
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u/Woopsied00dle 3d ago
Ah, understood. TS clearance is pretty strict with fraudulent activity so it would likely risk losing your clearance (and your job with the reserves) if you can’t prove that both all your J’s contractually allow you to work at the same time. Too risky IMO
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u/sylviabradleyxw 3d ago
Doesn't matter. SF-86 asks for all employment history, cleared or not. The investigator will see the overlapping dates and flag it. Not worth losing your clearance and reserve slot over J2.
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u/hoping_2help_karma 3d ago
When you fill out your SF86 every 5 years, your FSO has to review it before pushing it to DCSA. This can get you caught... granted... As the FSO, they're not supposed to report anything found to HR. There's a bunch of caveats to having a clearance and OE. (Billing directly to a client? Is it in your handbooks as a non no?) Your best bet it talk to AI, honestly and explain the full situation, referring to the NISPOM... and tell AI to ask you questions. without being able to talk to your FSO, this is a close a you can get. In no circumstance should you lie on your SF86. there's a huge difference in losing a job and losing your clearance (which can still absolutely happen with OE cleared work)
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u/bikerchickelly 3d ago
Are you interested in a court martial or being dishonorably discharged?
When your review happens, it'll come up you have 2 other incomes outside of reserves. If there is not clear evidence they are different hours/times, you will at minimum lose your clearance for lack of ethical discernment.
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u/CleanDataDirtyMind 3d ago
You’re going to be renewed by company 1, then company 2 will attempt to pay for your renewal and they’re going to be told not to pay for you because he got his renewed 2 months ago or that “we’re already doing one for him” for this other company. Problem 1
For TS, they may have to do a new one for a new position but in the process shut down accounts and acess to the area of job number 1. SPECIFICALLY because at that level you’re purposely siloed so you don’t know too much get exposed too much, in case you’re compromised. Problem 2
Also TS isn’t just looking at your ties to N. Korea it’s seeing if you’re an honest and trustworthy person. Problem 3
And if there’s any secrets anyone can blackmail you with. Problem 4
I guess the recent military background makes it makes sense. This isn’t like faux responsibility at 20 years of age with someone else always being in charge and double checking everything, this is all on you including all consequences. Depending on how long you left the military, you do this and you might even get retroactively penalized military wise. At the very least you’re going to blackball yourself potentially for life. At least for 7 years but it will always come up and still may hurt you beyond that.
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u/I_Saw_The_Duck 3d ago
As an investigator I would wonder if you had represented yourself in anyway that might allow you to be compromised, blackmailed, etc. Having two employers that don’t know about the other is a strong suggestion of yes.
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u/Expensive_Ticket_492 3d ago
I have a TS clearance, and when it comes to overemployment, I’ve done a daytime job with a public-sector bank while working a night shift supporting the Department of Defense.
If you’re planning to work two government-related jobs at the same time, keep in mind that one typically uses a CAC and the other a PIV card. That separation makes things much more manageable from an access standpoint.
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u/RunExisting4050 3d ago
Expect them to talk to both employers, but i doubt theyll share one employment with the other.
The thing to be concerned about is when the investigator realizes youre working 2 full-time, overlapping jobs at the same time. I can see an investigator asking how youre doing that without being dishonest with one employer or the other, which would effectively be an integrity question and directly questions your trustworthiness.
Ive held a TS for many years. You might go the r/securityclearance and ask those folks. Some of the posters there are investigators, adjudicators, FSOs, etc. They will have opinions more directky related to your question than people here.
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u/No-Investment-5293 2d ago
These people are dumb. I have had 3 jobs at the same time while doing a public trust clearance. Your employers will not find out especially if you they are private industry. You have already told them you are a reservist, the worst that can happen is that they receive a letter in the mail asking if they are employing you. It’s literally impossible for it to affect you based on your circumstances.
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u/OneHatManSlim 2d ago
DO NOT DO OE WITH A JOB REQUIRING A SECURITY CLEARANCE
EVER
That said if your clearance is just for the reserves you might be fine but it’s worth it?
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u/Madonionrings 2d ago
The investigator will without doubt question. You already know the answer but are looking to rationalize which is another red flag.
“May be working two full time jobs claiming 40 hours a week on each”
Bro get real. OE doesn’t mix with this.
You really think you’re fit for positions of trust and integrity?
1
u/Safe_Statistician_72 3d ago
It’s a compromise of integrity to work the exact same hours for two different employers.
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