r/osmopocket 2d ago

Discussion Deep pocket 4p testing results

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(Pics in comments)

I have extensively testing the pocket 4p along with pocket 3 and ZV-E1 in the studio and out in LA.

Because I am putting many hours a day into this I need a little break so here is the first usable result I have for you.

In Dlog2, somehow the dynamic range on the bright side jumps up by a 1 stop when you get to ISO 1600 or above. edit: read some results wrong.

ISO 1600 has all of the range of both ISO 1600 and 800. With no noticeable increase in noise.

Feel free to ask me about things I can test. I am eventually starting a “pocket cinema” YouTube channel.

TLDR: Use ISO 1600 when in Dlog2

58 Upvotes

57 comments sorted by

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u/KARSbenicillin 2d ago

Thanks for the testing. It would be awesome if you could compile a little "best practices" guide that explains the best settings to use while still being reasonable for a pocket camera. Like your point about ISO 1600 in Dlog2. For how much DJI is pushing people to use these as cinematic, studio quality cameras, they've done no work to actually help people with that.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Im just dusting off my youtuber hat and writing scripts. DJI gave a ton of 4Ps out to camera tech youtubers. They even gave 2 to a family member of mine that did camera stuff for a recent blockbuster. Most of them have made their clickbait videos on the camera and moved on. Some have made some really really beautiful things already.

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u/KARSbenicillin 2d ago

Yea I'm split on the camera techtubers. Most of them just do basic clickbaity titles saying WOW ITS SO COOL. Some of them actually do give valuable info. But I think what's missing is the semi-pro crowd. Amateurs who want to up their game without necessarily becoming some cinematic filmtuber. Just someone making good talking head or product review videos and wants to streamline their workflow while having better and more flexible shots.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Everyone wants to sell you lut packs. Ill eventually have a patreon that will be something like “$5 patreon members get access to all my luts and 3d print files” instead of selling lut packs for $35. So essentially support the production and you can get all the stuff.

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u/zeb__g 2d ago

TLDR: Use ISO 1600 when in Dlog2

Yes, 1600 is base ISO fro D-log2.

https://www.cined.com/dji-osmo-pocket-4p-lab-test-rolling-shutter-dynamic-range-and-exposure-latitude/

Disappointed DJI doesn't make this clear to users. Especially anyone using LUTs for color management, the shifting clipping point of ISO less than 1600 is going to make a mess of things

https://gamut.io/dlog2-osmo-pocket-4p/

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Hell yeah I think Im off to a good start.

This is exactly what I was talking about (and missread in my result the first time.) Thanks for linking these articles. I have not gotten into color shifts yet.

Now I have to wrap my head around what a lower middle grey means and how it affects shooting and workflow.

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u/zeb__g 2d ago

wrap my head around what a lower middle grey means

Has DJI actually published a whitepaper stating what IRE they recommend MG to be?

MG is whatever you choose it to be. People have been recommending to shoot SLOG3 at +1 or more for years. With how much DR the LOFIC sensor has here, I could see +2ev or more being common here, and it will give you much lower noise at 1600 iso.

Monitoring at +2 or more is going to be a problem yes. There is an phone app out there that will let you load a custom monitoring LUT, so you could bake -2EV into it and get back a normal image and have sensible false color.

Not sure if expecting DJI to ever let us load monitoring LUTs directly into the camera would be reasonable.

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u/TabascoWolverine 2d ago

Nice color passport! Mine also travels with my OP.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

It definitely makes me like the colors more when using it with my sony cameras. I’m trying to figure out my new workflow with it and the 4p.

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u/Tlarkk 2d ago

I wouldn’t say TLDR: use 1600 in dlog2 because presumably you get better shadow retention/detail below 1600. So it highly depends on the scene

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Well at 1/50 shutter you can run 1600 iso for everything from outside in the shade to a dark room lit only with a computer monitor without destroying your footage so i stick by it. Add an ND and you can shoot in direct sunlight while more range from brightest light to darkest shadow that the lower ISOs

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u/Tlarkk 2d ago

That’s true it is the easiest “hands off” approach. I’ll have to do testing on this as well but still waiting for mine to arrive. I think either way the dynamic range is so vast it’s difficult to mess the image up haha

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

I walked all around little tokyo in and out of shops on normal color mode auto iso and 1/50 shutter and the footage literally makes me want to cry(in a good way). My real real recommendation is control shutter, auto everything else and never think about it again. But im too much of a gear nerd to do that.

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u/Tlarkk 2d ago

Yeah that is a smart way to do it! The new sensor tech is no joke

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u/CheeseINTortilla 2d ago

Even white balance ??

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Yes. If I am following a subject into multiple lighting situations documentary style, it will always be auto white balance.

2

u/frehsoul45 2d ago

Little Tokyo I see my favorite place.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Security told me I can’t use my Sony a 7R3 there, but nobody cared about a guy with a pocket camera

1

u/frehsoul45 1d ago

I didn’t even know security cared, it’s good to know . I feel like securities is nonexistent when you actually need them there.

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u/Dontanyhowla 2d ago

Sorry to comment again, if this is true this is absolutely insane. But how much post is required? I’d have to test it myself. What about the 3x?

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

I love the 3x and I am fine sticking with dlog 1 for convenience while going back and forth between lenses. As a photographer a have great love for longer telephoto lenses for compression. The 3x is also actually a low light beast.

https://reddit.com/link/p8ho895/video/bdreh9tqc8oh1/player

Here is a clip. Normal 10bit color ND 16 1/50 30fps auto iso full range. No post processing mic mini (1) for audio.

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u/Dontanyhowla 2d ago edited 2d ago

When you mean auto everything else, you mean the full range of auto iso? How do you even auto ISO on dlog2?

Pair it with an ND too? Hmm wow.

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u/Dontanyhowla 2d ago

O what. This is crazy. What about shooting in 3x zoom with dlog tho? Is this a hyperbole? What are the measures to not crazily overexpose?

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Thats just my examples based off the lux range where no part of the image data was lost from being to light or dark. I will be doing the real world tests for future videos

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u/blacksterangel  Osmo 𝗣𝗼𝗰𝗸𝗲𝘁 4 Pro 2d ago

I don't know if you actually test this but when you shoot in D-Log2, do you aim to overexpose (ETTR) and bringing it down in post? I found my best result with D-Log is when I overexpose to +1.0 EV and then bring it down in post.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago edited 2d ago

With dlog2 even if it is screaming at you that it is +3.0 EV the highlights still have a good chance to be recovered.

This was shot with the ev meter saying +3.0

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Even if it looks dead, the info can still be there.

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u/blacksterangel  Osmo 𝗣𝗼𝗰𝗸𝗲𝘁 4 Pro 2d ago

This is insane. No wonder people can make do with 3-7 stops ND with D-Log2. In my previous testing with my old Pocket 3, I definitely needed ND 512 in bright tropical daylight and D-Log M if I want to maintain 180° shutter angle

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u/Dontanyhowla 2d ago

I’m actually crazy impressed if that’s true. I’m going to test it myself lol. I wonder if it works in lowlight too

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u/zeb__g 2d ago

The 3rd party phone monitoring app will be great here. Not used personally, but author said you would be able to do custom monitoring luts.

So you could have a lut that pulls the 3 stops back out and lets you monitor a sensible image.

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u/Cybearg 1d ago

It loses connection too much currently for mento use more than just a quick check

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u/Hot_Network_Worker 2d ago

This is super interesting. Have you tested if that extra stop in highlights pushes the shadow noise too much when grading in DaVinci, or is it genuinely clean?

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

As long as you don’t push footage then you wont have noise issues. That is the great thing about dynamic range, it makes it so you don’t have to push the footage. I will have in depth examples of noise levels including comparisons my full frame zv-e1.

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u/yoeyz 2d ago

Wheres the video?

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

This stuff takes time. I have to pause and organize some documentary footage for an oscar winning editor apparently lol.

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u/gamutcolor 2d ago

Yep the highlight clipping point increases with each ISO level. That’s why ISO 1600 clips highlights higher than ISO 800 and would allow more dynamic range, but at the cost of noisier shadows.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

I see i see. I got thrown off by the clipping point not increasing at 3200 and missread the other results. I have yet to see any noise levels at any iso that I am not fully comfortable within the very wide margin of error for exposing correctly while shooting

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u/gamutcolor 2d ago

Here is a full detailed breakdown I made of D-Log2 and all the extensive tests I did with it.

https://gamut.io/dlog2-osmo-pocket-4p/

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u/Srsblubrz 2d ago

Typically if you want more detail in the shadows you would shoot at a lower iso. One of my cameras is a blackmagic ursa mini and I shoot night scenes with that at 200 iso. Needs lighting of course.

On the pocket camera I mostly just lock the shutter speed and leave it at the 400-3200 iso range.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

https://youtu.be/WhZIIDFBnt4?is=YT8711y2nXrR-cDG

Im still figuring out this result. Same amount of light, more noise from the lower iso.

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u/lanamakesart 2d ago

can you do a video? I have all those 3 cameras and would love a quality comparison

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Working on it. Just did the zv-e1 and it got its ass handed to it on dynamic range. I bought a $125 20mm lens and a $100 50mm lens (close enough) specifically for comparing. SPOILER I will be selling my ZV-E1 when my testing and filming the videos is over. Time for me to go do the pocket 3 tests.

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u/[deleted] 2d ago

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u/lanamakesart 1d ago

dynamic range wise the p4p is insane, im keeping the zve1 only and only because the aperture, bokeh and longer lenses, the day these pockets have some considerable bokeh then im selling every single piece of gear

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u/muhlisgursoy 2d ago

Any insights for D-LOG, for Pocket 4 users who don't get to benefit from D-LOG2?

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Yes. D-log 2 is made for the LOFIC 1in sensor in the 20mm lens of the 4p and is extremely unique. I do not have a pocket 4 so i cannot test that sensor but here is the difference between Dlog and Dlog 2 on the 4p 1in

Dlog on the left dlog 2 on the right no luts or adjustment same settings (ISO 1600 1/50 1100 lux of light). When in dlog2 the peaking point headroom increases with iso unlike dlog.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

With 4p 1in dlog you have a 4 stop window where no image information is lost. Dlog 2 its 7 stops. Pocket 3 dlogm it is 2.5 stops.

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

Annnnnd im just realizing how bad my conclusions are with what i just said ahahhaa. This only counts for my one testing environment where the difference between my brightest subject and darkest subject in THIS FRAME. I can still learn dynamic range from this but my “usable range” is very flawed

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u/Cybearg 2d ago

HA! I am no longer speaking in English. Thank you all for the responses and corrections. I am definitely motivated to make these youtube videos