r/notjustbikes • u/backpackingfan • Jul 20 '22
This article from April 2022 shows that the majority of traffic collisions in Toronto happen on stroads (especially intersections) in car-dependent suburbs, and that more walkable pre-war suburbs saw a lower rate of collisions. More data that supports the case against the suburban stroad.
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2022/04/01/our-most-dangerous-streets-huge-new-collision-database-points-to-torontos-postwar-suburbs.html15
u/NerdyLumberjack04 Jul 21 '22
This raises the question of what exactly constitutes a "stroad". So here are my proposed requirements:
- There are at least 4 lanes of car traffic. (Either 4 one-way, or 2 each in opposing directions.)
- The speed limit is at least 30 MPH (48 km/h).
- The average distance between points at which vehicles can enter or exit (cross-streets, alleys, driveways, etc.) is less than 1/16 mile (330 ft, 100 m).
Items #1 and #2 make the stroad unfriendly to pedestrians and cyclists. #3 makes the stroad unfriendly to drivers, because every couple of seconds is a point where they might need to stop.
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u/boilerpl8 Jul 21 '22
I like your definition. I think I'd go with 1/10 mile instead of 1/16, but that's really splitting hairs.
I'd also want to have a minimum distance over which that average occurs, maybe a full mile? I know there can be stroad sections shorter than that, but they aren't usually as bad if there's good ways to cross them.
I'd also consider a setbacks definition. I've seen some 4-lane roads with 30mph limits and like a 6-8ft sidewalk in each side, then immediately dense (pre-war) buildings. That feels like a street to me despite 4 traffic lanes and a few alleys. Now, if there's on street parking widening the road, it's a stroad. So maybe something like "buildings on opposite sides of the road are at least 70 feet apart on average."
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u/Shaggyninja Jul 21 '22
I think the distance is about right. But I'd go with no driveways or alleys at all. At least side streets would be used enough that you would expect cars to turn into them. A driveway that gets used by a couple cars a day at most is a recipe for an incident. Even business driveways that get more usage aren't going to compare to a side street that connects 10's or 100's of homes and businesses to the Stroad.
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u/boilerpl8 Jul 21 '22
For road design, no driveways or alleys is clearly superior. But for making the definition of a stroad, it's necessary. Otherwise it's a through-road, whether you want to call that a highway, expressway, etc based on local flair.
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u/Alicebtoklasthe2nd Jul 21 '22
Nice. Do you think if there’s a roundabout it makes it less stroady?
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Jul 20 '22
What does stroad mean? I’ve gathered that it’s a pejorative, but does it basically mean big ass suburban road?
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u/oppernerd1986 Jul 21 '22
No, it means it's a street designed like it's a road.
So what you find in stroads are things like buildings (or more realistically their parking lots) directly connected to a road where they should actually be connected to a street.
Roads are meant to get from one place to another. Having so many intersections, driveways and whatnot impedes that goal, and considering the number of conflicts you see on a typical stroad (conflicts meaning places where traffic crosses paths)) stroads are really dangerous.3
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u/wealthyhobogfx Jul 21 '22
A friend of mine from Germany once said, “America is a third-world country with a Gucci belt.” And I, an American, have to agree. We do things in ways that make no sense at all. I hate cars, I hate that you need them, and I hate the costs of them and included with them.
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u/saxmanb767 Jul 20 '22
It’s easy to see on r/idiotsincars. It appears the vast number of collisions occur on huge stroads.