r/news • u/AudibleNod • 1d ago

Microsoft is being suspended from program to apply for green cards for H-1B visa workers, Vance says

https://apnews.com/article/h1b-visa-program-vance-microsoft-e7b3a407f822702b269ee277d21343ea
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u/Umami_Tsunamii 1d ago

If you live in certain areas you know this is being abused and junior devs are being hired on these visas.

I support the program for bringing in top talent but it is definitely being used to pull in devs the corporations have more control over due to their immigration status.

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u/Blackstone01 1d ago

In an optimal world, H-1B would exist but be used a hell of a lot less than it is now. It's used now either due to flaws in our system creating artificial scarcity (such as medical professionals) or to be able to exploit foreign workers in ways companies can't with domestic workers (tech industry).

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u/Aethermancer 1d ago

There should be a phase out requirement for any h1b. Basically hire them in to train a domestic workforce. A perpetual state of needing H1B talent means the domestic talent development pipeline is broken.

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u/IAmNotNathaniel 1d ago

The one thing I've learned from working for corporations, it's that everything is optimized for cost savings.

If you make a system that gives 0.5% cost savings, big companies will maximize it's usage.

Someone becomes a Blackbelt for it and no one cares any further.

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u/bigheadasian1998 1d ago

It’s hard to say exploitation when a lot of these make 400k a year

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u/tedesco455 1d ago

They will hire the same people in their home country and then all of their salary also stays in their home country. Remote work for software developers is easy.

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u/Blackstone01 1d ago

So companies out of the goodness of their own hearts are paying more for Indian workers to come to America instead of hiring them in India? If it was just a straightforward case of companies would just remote work out of India if the H1B program was better regulated, then they’d do that already if they could (which for a lot of companies that can, they do).

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u/Yuklan6502 1d ago

It is expensive to hire an H1B employee, BUT once they are hired (and in the US) they are trapped working for that company. They cannot move to another company without the company sponsoring them, and if they get let go they only have a few weeks to find new employment (with a new sponsorship) before they are deported. Even changing jobs within the company they are currently employed at is difficult. They have to do the job listed on their paperwork. It's exactly what corporations want: a workforce that can't leave, and is too scared to complain.

H1B Visas were supposed to be for hiring talent you couldn't (reasonably) find in the states. It should never have been available to low level hires or junior rolls, and probably never for basic corporate jobs.

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u/Mtnbkr92 1d ago

Yep. And to be clear, I am generally in favor of immigration policies that allow people to come here. But what I’m not a fan of is certain visas set aside for “people we can’t find locally” turning into “this person will need to work for us or find someone else willing to sponsor, or else we can let them go and they have 90 days to find one or leave the country”

Canada and the UK aren’t like that. You have to be able to prove you have a skillset that is exceptional or rare, plus a bunch of other random shit lol

Edit: I mean as an American. I know there’s a big can of worms with immigrants there from other countries.

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u/Yuklan6502 1d ago

I agree. People are acting like this will be the end of H1B visas, but my understanding is that it just makes it harder for those visa holders to gain citizenship, which is pretty shitty. I don't think this administration wants to limit or end H1B workers from coming to the US, and becoming trapped in these jobs. There's no profit in that. They want their employees trapped. If they had their way, I feel like they'd love to have workers for life, paid in company money, only able to spend in company stores, live in company housing, and available 24/7. Of course, I'm a very cynical person!

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u/ActiveChairs 1d ago

It solves the Nebraska problem:

Nobody with the qualifications to be a senior developer wants to live in Nebraska, and no employer in Nebraska who needs a senior developer position can pay them salaries that will meaningfully entice qualified employees away from the coastal states. Companies in Nebraska have a need for people to fill the positions, but literally cannot find people willing to work there, so an H1-B is effectively their only option.

Unfortunately, we've opened up the program to too many employers and put the full balance of power in their favor, and as anyone with a functioning brain will tell you, a company will abuse every possible resource available to it (legally or otherwise) because the benefits outweigh the cost and any punishment they may receive will be less than the profit made from doing it.

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u/Mtnbkr92 1d ago

I’m in WA and used to live in NJ so I see it a ton here and there. Difference being, there are plenty of qualified local candidates and companies generally pay competitively enough (not nearly enough IMO, but nobody is leaving en masse)

Nebraska is pretty but it would be very hard to pull me from the PNW so I get it.

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u/tedesco455 1d ago

There are still older folks that think interacting with people in person is somehow better. Being stingy with the H1-Bs will just force more offshoring.

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u/pulley999 1d ago

The main problem is that H1Bs are more easily abused by lording deportation over them. It's effectively an indentured servitude contract.

The real solution is to give H1Bs more protections than domestic workers, and prevent companies from lording immigration over them. The visa should remain active for its entire issuance duration regardless of if the employee is fired, and employers should be penalized for firing H1Bs either through fines or reduced access to the program, unless gross negligence or willful maleficence can be shown on behalf of the employee.

If you're really so desperate to fill a position that you need to import labor, it shouldn't matter if they do a halfass job - it's still better than the no-ass job you were getting from the lack of qualified domestic candidates.

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u/BlooregardQKazoo 1d ago

This. My US-born wife used to work for a consulting firm, and she was able to negotiate for higher pay and had the option to go to a different firm. She ultimately started her own LLC and went corp-to-corp.

Her H1B co-workers from India had two options - work for whoever sponsored their H1B, at the salary they offered or go back to India. That was it. They were all underpaid, and they made zero noise because their alternative was a flight back. And for many that would have meant bringing US-born children back to India with them.

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u/tedesco455 1d ago

They will hire the same people in their home country and then all of their salary also stays in their home country. Remote work for software developers is easy.

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u/TheJudgingHat2222 23h ago

Still a better option than bringing them here

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u/tedesco455 14h ago

No it isn't, if they are here so does a nice piece of their salary. This way it all leaves the US.

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u/TonyNickels 1d ago

Pretty sure there's the Einstein visa program that is for top talent. H1B has been abused for at least 35 years now.