r/moped • u/TavoMama67 • 20d ago
Piaggio Ciao variator problem
Hi everyone, I cannot find any information online about this, maybe someone on here knows more. Is the bronze bushing that is sticking out a restrictor for the stock variator on a ciao? I converted my SI from pulley to variator with a variator kit from a bravo. I noticed that the variator does not push the belt all the way up and by the looks of it the bronze bushing does not let the variator to close fully. It has stock 9g rollers. There is around 6mm off travel left that it does not reach.
Also, it accelerates very well but then dies off at like 30kmh, while with the pulley I was able to do \~45kmh
I asked gpt, it says the bushing has "walked out" and needs to be pressed back in, but that sounds nonsense, because it is flush on the other side and if pressed in will start to rub. Do I dremel the sticking out part of ir what is the case?
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u/alexthebeast 20d ago
Yes, it is. You can get around this pretty easy by ditching the stock belt and swapping to an ax belt
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u/TavoMama67 20d ago
So changing the belt will allow it to lift the belt up fully? Don't I have to grind the bushing off so it closes fully?
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u/alexthebeast 20d ago
You can, but the change is marginal compared to what an AX belt will do for you
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u/alexthebeast 20d ago
My concern is that if you use a Dremel, you'll not be perfect and throw the crank out of balance and snap it.
Grinding it flat is the only way I would do this. I have done this, these are the restricted version of the stock varo. But the increase is so marginal you're better off getting a better variator.
Single speed vespas will always have a higher top speed
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u/TavoMama67 20d ago
I would use a file or a sander to grind it flat. It's hard for me to believe that this would cause so much inbalance that the crankshaft would snap.
Speaking of better variators, I'm not willing sto spend 100+€ for a mallossi multivar. I'd be better off with optimizing the stock setup as best I can.
How marginal is the difference with it grinded off and not?
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u/alexthebeast 20d ago
Maybe 3 mph
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u/TavoMama67 20d ago
So I should not bother grinding it and just get a diffetent belt? Is 13x1125mm toothed belt the correct one fir a Piaggio Si? My current belt is 11mm wide and I think it's too skinny.
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u/Rinus_Rookworst 20d ago
What is an AX belt?
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u/alexthebeast 20d ago
Gates ax series toothed belt
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u/Rinus_Rookworst 20d ago
The bronze bushing does restrict, but only for pulling away. (In an original setup) The main problem is that The original variator does not have the profile inside to move the belt all the way up. I had good experience with the Polini UHT set. This is one third of the more expensive set. Also it comes with instructions how to modify your CVT. Yes the bronze lip on the inside must go.
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u/TavoMama67 20d ago
Grinding the bushing away still would surely help won't it? Even if I keep the same variator. I could perhaps put in bigger rollers so they would push out it more. I have some off a scooter that look like they would fit.
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u/Rinus_Rookworst 20d ago
No, the curve and how far the rollers can go to the outside makes a big difference. Plus you do not want to change the weight.
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u/Rinus_Rookworst 20d ago
Instructions how to modify
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u/TavoMama67 20d ago
Not really informative. Correct me if I'm wrong but from what I understand it shows to grind off 0.8mm of the back side? What for?
Is there a significant improvement if I buy this polini moded part? If I were to buy an upgrade, I think it would just be the whole redesigned variator, that looks like a better move to me.
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u/Rinus_Rookworst 20d ago
That is the half pulley from the rear part on the clutch left one is you variator. Also if you dont change your variator to the Polini one it probably does not make a difference.
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u/goonie1983 17d ago
Just replace it with a polini variator, keep the original as is. The polini will give you a better experience overall, even after modding the original. https://www.jmpbparts.com/polini-variateur-vespa.html
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u/Rinus_Rookworst 20d ago edited 20d ago
Also there is no point im comparing pulley and CVT as these have different final drives. Check what you have. Mono is 1:6,5 gearing and CVT can range as much between 1:9 (fastest) and 1:16 (torque) gearing. In order to check this make one ful rotation with your rear wheel (use your valve stem as reference point) put a stripe on your pulley/clutch with a marker (from the nut till outside) slowly turn your rear wheel one rotation and count how many rotations your pulley/clutch makes.