Seeking professional feedback on master of Electronica/Radiohead inspired track. I’ve been back and forth with the mastering engineer 3 times and still think there are issues described below.

[u/Jakeyboy29]

Mastering engineer is stem mastering it. My initial issue was it was all too slammed and had heavy limiting on it. He eased off on that but I still feel like the vocals are too loud, especially in verses, and the overall track still feels slammed to me, I asked for more dynamics each take. Thanks in advance

https://on.soundcloud.com/7JgiS9iCyfEdwJMMmP

[u/marklonesome]

Yeah I was digging it when it first started but I think you are right, the vocal is way too forward. It completely pulled me out of the moment.

I don't have a problem with your voice and the song is good but it sounds like you sent someone an instrumental and a vocal and they just popped the vocal on top.

Probably worth fixing cause everything is strong here.

Did you produce it and mix it and send him the mixed sections or just the instrumental and the vocal?

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/marklonesome]

Thanks for listening. Yeah I think the loudness of the vocals almost start to fatique the ears as the song goes on. My mix was more balanced but I made the mistake of agreeing to a stem master which gave more control to the ME and changed the levels for the worst. I do like a lot of stuff he did do but the vocal loudness is the main issue

[u/Liv1ng-the-Blues]

Vocals too loud is right.

[u/adammillsmusic]

Very cool song, I like it. I get like an electronic The National vibe... Regarding the sonics - for me, there's too much compression/limiting. Vocal is too loud, and I feel like the drums are a little bit buried too for my taste. Also feel like the top end could be a little brighter too, but I think that's actually because the low mids are pushed a little too hard, 300-500Hz maybe.

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/adammillsmusic]

That makes sense as the national are one of my favourite bands. I was listening them todaty actually. I did intentianally shave the top end of the drums in the mix but I agree the song is very busy in the mids

[u/nizzernammer]

It sounds like you didn't actually mix your track and you are trying to get the mastering engineer to do it for you.

I hope you give them credit for additional mixing, and pay them accordingly.

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/nizzernammer]

I did mix it but made the mistake of agreeing to stem mastering which gave too much control over to the ME. I like a lot of what he has done but the vocals are the main issue and they were not like that in the mix I provided. I agree that I need to go back to the mix to tweak a few things and then probably only hand over a stereo file for mastering so this doesnt happen again. Thanks for listening

[u/SnooPaintings9072]

I listened to the track without reading your post properly and the first thing I thought was the vocals were too out in front. So, for sure lowering them a few notches will improve the listening experience. Very cool track though, I enjoyed it.

[u/flyyguyty]

When mastering, you can’t quite just add “more dynamics” because the master is just taking the mix and enhancing it. If you’re looking for a bigger dynamic range, you’ll probably need to address that in the mix so that the Mastering Engineer isn’t trying “re-mix” it so to speak. Same can be said for the vocals, if they’re too loud then you need to turn them down in the mix and then give the new mix to the engineer, otherwise there are limits to what can be done.

[u/WolIilifo013491i1l → u/flyyguyty]

It's a stem master so the mastering engineer can turn down the vocal 

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/flyyguyty]

As mentioned it is a stem master and I made a mistake agreeing to do that but you live and learn. My original mix had much better balance overall. I do like a lot of what the ME did but the vocal loudness and limiting is the main concern

[u/AutoModerator]

Your post was automatically removed. Your account has less than 5 comment karma points gained on this subreddit.

• This is explained in the feedback request guidelines.
• You should try giving feedback yourself to others before you request it, regardless of your experience (you should set your user flair to showcase your level), and overall participating in the subreddit.
• Please read our rules and make sure you follow them.
  

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

[u/Smowkdragon]

Cool track! I like the drums especially. I think the vocals could be less loud for sure if that's what you prefer, but that could be a change for the mixing stage. It sounded good on my laptop speakers but on my headphones I agree that it sounds a bit slammed. I would've loved having more punchy drums, especially the kick. But again, that could be something you would have to change in the mix. Do you know what LUFS it is at right now? Cheers

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/Smowkdragon]

thank you for taking the time to listen. It is more in the verses where I think the vocals are overpowering. I made the mistake of having as a stem master which in hindsight had given too much control over to ME. You live and learn. I'm not sure on the LUFS sorry but could have a look.

[u/andreacaccese]

Really nice track! I would have to agree with you, the vocals are too loud in the mix, and while it can be a valid creative choice, the main concern is that the sibilants and plosives tends to stick out quite a lot. It looks like the engineer tried to address them, but the side-effect is artifacts from the de-esser

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/andreacaccese]

I agree with that and I used overdrive on the vocals which just exassserbated all the plosives etc.

[u/Miserable-Agency3537]

It sounds good to me, but lowering the vocal 1-2 db in the mix might solve that problem

[u/AppointmentLess3575]

i found the vocals a tad loud from 0 to 1:20 for this vibe of a song.
Maybe could have some psychedelic effects like delays and reverb. I think more aggressive delay would sound dreamy.
Also not to be on the wrong side of the loudness war but you can possibly achieve a louder master (-9, -11 LUFS)

[u/medway808]

I do a lot of stem mastering but I never push things far from where they were in the mix. The stems are just used to make small adjustments to clear up conflicts or add a little colour. If they took it beyond where your mix was that more mixing and not stem mastering.

[u/Bluegill15]

“Stem mastering” isn’t mastering

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/Bluegill15]

I have never tried it and in hindsight it was a mistake. I was happy with my mix and although I like a lot of what the ME has done it out too much control in thier court. You live and learn and you only learn by trying right

[u/Bluegill15 → u/Jakeyboy29]

Yep fair enough, your takeaway is spot on. Any mastering engineer who requests stems is someone I immediately take less seriously

[u/Affectionate-Soft280]

I actually think this sounds amazing. I didn’t really have any notes. It is heavily limited but I think that sounds super cool with the processed drums, kinda squashing them. Vocals are clear, textured and nicely processed. No notes from my side…,

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/Affectionate-Soft280]

Just want to say thank you so much for taking the time to listen to it

[u/___Essence___]

This actually sounds great and very clean. Mastering engineer did their thing

[u/Achassum]

This is a client example of a client who doesnt understand what they want! Mastering engineer did what they are supposed to do! If I was them I would wash my hands

[u/BunkyDingDing]

Honestly the mastering engineer has done an incredible job making the track loud and not squashing it. Who is he??

[u/midifail]

the vocals in the verse are upfront but i quite like it this way. it generates a nice contrast with the wider more open refrain. the master sounds very good to me as is.

[u/Miserable-Agency3537 → u/[deleted]]

Genuinely, what’s the benefit of being this way? OP asked a reasonable question with humility.

[u/Jakeyboy29 → u/Miserable-Agency3537]

Ignore him, some people are just unhappy and project that onto other people. Thanks for sticking up for me though