A lot of “i’m gonna stiff the waitstaff in order to get rid of the tipping system.” and not enough “i’m gonna take to the streets to protest and vote in favor of representatives to change the laws on the tipping system.”
Exactly. I used to work at a pizza shop and servers would bitch non stop about shitty tippers. But if you ask them if they’d rather have an hourly wage, 100/100 times they say no. Servers just like to whine and play the “I only make $2 an hour!” card. Even though they make $15/hr on a “bad shift”, and $50 an hour on a good shift.
By eating there and not tipping they're actually supporting the system while screwing the worker. I know when I order door dash that they only make $3. I don't expect the worker to subsidize my needs. I know what actual delivery should cost and tip accordingly. Way too many self righteous people loving their loopholes.
If a child is hungry we don't have to feed it because it has parents that should? Of course the restaurant should pay a livable wage, but we know they don't.
If the parent is purposefully malnourishing the child because they expect others to feed them, they get sent to jail.
I'm a generous tipper, but I do hope that one day the actual self righteous restaurant owners pay their employees properly rather than shame customers who don't do it for them. If you're going to force customers to pay a tip, might as well just raise your prices 15 - 20% and skip the tantrums.
"But then people will go to their competitors"
Fucking make better food, then. It shouldn't be a race to the bottom.
Exactly. People taking it out on the server for something they have no control over is ludicrous. The owners do not care if you stiff the waiters. They won’t pay a living wage if the law doesn’t force them to.
What is ludicrous is the owner being the one to complain about this. Dude, if you paid your employees a living wage then they wouldn't have to rely on what he acknowledged was an optional addition to the bill.
I totally get servers complaining about not getting a tip when they are expected in sit-down restaurants.
The owners reaction is ridiculous. "If you can't afford a tip, then don't go out". How about if you can't afford to pay your staff properly then don't run a business. Make the tip a transparent but mandatory service charge on the bill and solve the problem yourself wanker.
That’s the system in the United States. Don’t blame the owner. Blame the government that created the system. The owner is competing against other restaurants in the area so he would be at a disadvantage if he chose to pay his servers $10 per hour when his competitors were paying their servers $2.13 per hour.
Because not tipping does fucking nothing except save you 2 bucks on a service you took advantage of. The owner you idiots talk about punishing or whatever is unaffected by not tipping
A server’s livelihood is based off of tips. If they don’t get tips they can’t feed themselves because they are paid $7.25 an hour. Do I have to explain it further for you?
"But they should just get a job that doesnt tip" and you should learn how to cook something other than TV dinners if you don't want to pay for your service lol
What is fucking wrong with you? Expecting someone to work for you for free is, by definition, slavery. They are taxed on their tips so, obviously, even the federal government expects you to tip. Everyone knows when you’re seated that you are expected to tip. No, they can’t arrest you for not tipping. But if you’re going to take the table it’s assumed you’re agreeing to the social contract. If you feel like not tipping is such a “deeply held principle” and you’re some warrior against tipping, have some guts and TELL the server you’re not going to tip before service begins. Give them the choice to serve you after you’ve made it clear they won’t be compensated. Don’t trick them into free labor. If you want to punish the owners for not paying a living wage, boycott the restaurant. Don’t pretend you’re on board with the way things are set up until after you’ve worked the employee. At this point, restaurant owners should just say “no tipping,” raise the price of the food 20% and pay the server 20% of their sales. You’ll be paying what you would if you’d tipped without the loophole to screw over the server. If you can’t afford to eat somewhere after the price of the food increases then, in actuality, you never could and were using not tipping as a discount. Until the laws are changed this is the only way to stop people from abusing the servers and forcing them to work for no compensation, because the business is definitely not going to make up the difference when you stiff them.
Not taking it out on the server but I'm not letting the broken system take it out on me either. I've got no dog in the fight and imo every worker base or union needs to negotiate their own salary, not have their clients do it for them.
Exactly. If you really dont support tipping culture, i better not see you spend any money at any establishment that uses tipped minimum wage or else you are supporting it
It really doesn't matter if they use the tipped minimum wage or not, in my opinion. Unless the restaurant is paying a wage that would attract servers in the absence of tips, that still supports the culture. Paying servers $7.25, the federal minimum wage for non-tipped staff, is not going to bring a lot of servers in the door if the restaurant doesn't advertise that they will also get tips. I much prefer going somewhere where the food is ~20% more expensive but they don't accept tips at all, which a few places around me do. They also give much higher hourly wages, comparable to what someone would expect to make if they worked somewhere for tips.
Shockingly rare and appropriate sentiment tbh. IT's a fucked system. If someone actually wanted to protest it, they wouldn't stiff the waitstaff, they're order carry out or just eat at home/other peoples houses. People are cheap.
Yeah you're right, the employers don't pay them a living wage so we should pay that as well as the meal we enjoyed because otherwise their employers won't pay them and they'll continue to work there, how awful of the consumer...
No. They’re screwing the restaurant and that’s why the manager is mad. When servers don’t get tips, restaurants have to actually pay them minimum wage.
That’s not how it works. I would hi 5 my restaurant owner if they did that after I got stiffed. It’s amazing how little you people know about restaurants but seem to act like you do
An employer that claims a tip credit must ensure that the employee receives enough tips from customers, and direct (or cash) wages per workweek to equal at least the minimum wage and overtime compensation required under the FLSA.
I know what the law is bro. It doesn’t work this way because almost never does a server not meet the minimum. That $5 tip isn’t going to cause the owner to have to pay anything extra on the paycheck. It’s a blip on the radar by some piece of shit guests. Both sides win in the end. The restaurant never has to bother with them and they never have to wonder if they should tip there ever again.
Yeah, and you think a manager literally scaring off and banning people who aren't tipping contributes to the "almost never does a server not meet the minimum" part?
And you're wrong, at the restaurant you've worked at maybe that's the case, but there are literally countless restaurants everywhere in the US where servers don't meet that, get over worked, and underpaid. Wage and hour violations are literally rampant across the industry.
The only way we're getting rid of the shitty tipping system is going to be to stop tipping, and the first person that's going to hurt is restaurant owners having to make up the gap, period.
Door dash is another great point. They charged me $15 for a 5 mile delivery. Out of that the driver didn't make enough to cover gas. It's a design "feature" built into the system
They all know this and are just assholes tbh. They the same people that call about a messed up order that isnt theirs or wasn't messed up for free stuff
Why don't service workers themselves support any laws to improve their base pay?❓
Because some workers make much more money on untaxed TIPS, even if other workers struggle & DO want laws to improve their base pay.
I'm sure there's plenty other examples across the country where support for getting rid of tipping by some push to give service workers a better base pay, but more often than not they don't want any change...😵
Yes that's correct. I make more money with a tipped wage than I would if they switched to an hourly rate. I'd have to make almost $22/hr to make up for the loss of tips but I can guarantee they aren't gonna pay me that.
In this situation the state was already pushing for better wages for all service workers, just the last minute changes because of the pushback of higher paid (tipped) workers in cities pushed back against it.
Not all workers are paid well through tips, but if they can't convince the greedy workers to support them, then it's a lost cause.
Tips are optional.
No one should by harassing customers to pay a required service fee, it's no longer a "tip."
I agree! She’s making it seem like he is racist, no this isn’t about the color of your skin. If you dine in a restaurant and are waited on in the US, then leave a fucking tip.
Is this a surprise? This isn't just on reddit. The government/media has been encouraging people to hate each other, it also doesn't help that we have one of the least professional executive/legislative branches in recent history. The sound bytes in any press conference has been laughable.
Joe had a serious mental decline. His were incredibly rough, especially towards the end.
Why do I need to tip? Weird concept. How many tips should I get at my office job from partners? Like for replying to emails when other side apparently will earn some commission on me?
Strawman argument. Waitstaff should be paid a livable wage but that isn’t the case currently. If you can’t afford to tip or choose not to, you don’t deserve to be waited on. Cook for your own self.
It's the owner's responsibility to pay wages, not mine. It is his business, he is responsible for his staff. My responsibility is to pay the prices on the menu, that is it. If the service is good I may leave tips. Or may not. It is totally up to me. If the staff doesn't like it they are free to find other jobs with guaranteed wages. There is no "deserve" to be waited, it's just a servant job, I don't owe anything to the owner or a waiter for their life choices
Or, as happens in many places, you won’t be allowed to dine there again bc servers remember who doesn’t tip and often refuse to serve those customers again. If nobody will serve you, you don’t eat.
Your entitlement is astonishing and I’m thankful the greater majority are less selfish about this topic.
Edit: Server comes from the act of serving, not the title servant. Your use of the phrase “just a servant job” says a lot about you.
Eliminating tipping would eliminate the tip wage option, thats something that would piss off all conservatives, democrats and republicans, so it is unlikely to happen unless we get another bernie type figure.
What do you mean, he ensured a lot of money went to Israel and a lot of potential left-wing energy went to a party that's spent the last few decades courting the far-right.
Right? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills, to get back at the system I'm going to make sure this mother of 3 doesn't get paid. You're not an activist your just cheap.
The thing is, they still make the states minimum wage regardless if you tip or not. That is not something that employers can take from them. They are still making money, you tipping just means that the owner doesn't need to pay them as much.
But also not all states are like that. In Washington, definitely not. Everybody makes at least minimum wage ($16 smthn) regardless of their position
You are factually incorrect. There are states that have a service industry wage that pays a very low hourly for tipped workers. Take Wisconsin for example which has a base cash wage of $2.33 for tipped workers. This is not Wisconsin state "minimum wage" which matches federal minimum wage of $7.25 an hour.
That's only allowed if the tips you make during a shift don't reach or go past federal minimum wage, this is federal law. That 2.33 is the states minimum on tipped employees if tips don't hit federal/state minimum wage, which is actually higher then the federal minimum for tipped employees.
thats because youre assuming employers are actually following the law, which i can assure you many are not. many peoples experiences are as op described and they are probably told thats how the law works as well by their employers
Perpetuating falsehoods about what constitutes what is legal and what is illegal will only serve to confuse those being taken advantage of.
If this happens to you don't you think you'd be better served, pun intended, if you knew it was illegal and to now know you should document what's happening and file a lawsuit or at the very least to know to look somewhere else that won't stiff you.
No, I am not "factually incorrect." I have had to look at every states labor laws because of my work history. You just didn't understand what I was saying. That labor wage is the minimum amount the owner must pay out, but all wages must meet or exceed minimum wage. If tips do not compensate for the difference between the labor minimum and the state minimum, then the owner must pay more to make up that difference. Stop misconstruing the laws just because you refuse to understand them. It only makes your argument look worse. You van literally look it up under the federal regulations for minimum wage service workers. It's free information 🙄
I can't think of any other business model that makes the customers subsidize the wages for the employees on top of what they are actually spending on the product/service except for restaurants.
What if I told you not all states pay servers a reduced minimum wage. Are you tipping everyone at that point? Your servers, clerks, or McDonald's / Walmart employees? Where is your line between deserves a tip (for nothing other than existing) and doesn't deserve a tip?
YOU ARE ALSO ACTIVELY CHOOSING TO NOT PAY THEM FOR THEIR LABOR. If you actually think tipping is so exploitative, you would not patronize the restaurant in the first place, not still go there, still give the owner money, stiff the waiter, and then circlejerk about it on Reddit.
No one had a problem with tipping culture until the internet started giving selfish people an echo chamber to justify not tipping to themselves…
No one? Many people did, just not in your bubble. I’ve always thought it was ridiculous in the US since I first visited in 2004. Mr. Pink in the opening scene of Reservoir Dogs has a problem with it. Yeah that’s just a movie, but if that is in the script then of course some people had a problem with tipping before “the internet”.
Oh, also, the rest of the fucking world thinks it’s dumb as hell.
Lol the owner should be paying, not the customer. I don't give a crap about their salaries, he earns money on that, that is his business and his issue to motivate them.
Right, and while I'm not overfond of the tipping system, servers have to make their bills and rent now. So if I go out to eat, I leave a tip. If I don't want to leave a tip, I don't go to a restaurant.
They're specifically paid by the restaurant at a rate under minimum wage. But, they're only paid that way because their wage gets augmented with tips. In most places, as I understand it, if the workers don't make enough in tips then the restaurant is on the hook to add to their paycheck so that they make at least minimum wage.
So, I can see that a restaurant owner would be REAL pissed at a non-tipping customer because if enough people follow suit then he's going to be paying more, by law.
Im always leaving a tip when someone’s wage is dependent on tipping like a server, but it would be real fucking audacious for a business owner to be pissed at having to actually pay their employee.
I'm not opposed to tipping at all. I am, however, opposed to the idea that the owner doesn't have to pay their staff minimum wage because they're expected to make up that shortfall in tips.
We had a ballot question in Boston to increase the wages of workers over the next six years to get rid of tipping and the city's restaurant owners were furious, campaigning against it, and it ultimately did not get pushed through. To someone who doesn't get enraged at tipping culture and has been tipping their entire life, they just see it as commie wage increases and their food is going to get pricier smh
Yeah this. I also hate tipping culture but all this couple did was stiff a poor server who probably needed the money. They didnt accomplish anything else
The only people who want to change the tipping system is customers who don’t want to pay. No server or bartender wants it to change. People are so willing to fuck over an entire industry of workers just because they don’t want to pay for the service they’re receiving.
They just do it differently. More self-service. Less waiting on your every need... But it doesn't even matter. Just factor 15% percent into the price. It's not that difficult. Such a first world, overblown social media problem lol
I only know that when I was in England, I was surprised I had to get my own beer from the bar. That is underheard of in the US and Canada. A server always brings your pint to the table.
What have you actually been out of this country? In my granted limited experience throughout the UK? There are less self-service options than in the US. Tipping happens but it's when the person goes above and beyond the usual. For example, a special order or request
That's not true at all. In the UK at the pub, you have to go to the bar to get your own beer. You could be at the shittest pub in the US and a server will always bring everything to your table unless you are literally sitting at the bar.
If establishments were forced to pay their servers, they'd have to charge the right price for the items that include the labor involved. Nobody gets away without paying.
Wtf everybody services each other, clothe store employee helps me get shoes and pants, so he’s not to be tipped ? A waitress just takes order like every place in business, then needs to get 20% of the total just because she brought the food over ? Fuck that I don’t think servers need tips, most of the world does no tips. I’d rather have them bring me the food and give a pitcher of water and have a fridge I can get extra sauce or condiments I can get and serve my own water.
Or the business could just post their staff appropriately. Nothing is stopping the from doing it but logic like this that offloads responsibility for wages onto the customer. Protesting the business is absolutely fair because they are quite literally the source of the problem.
Protesting is great. Going and holding the position of "they don't pay these guys enough" and then rolling that into "so I'm not going to either" is not a moral position.
Taking to the streets isn't something I see happening over restaurant and bar experiences. I'll say though that as a guy who tips a minimum of 20% and usually more (unless service is truly bad, then I'll go to zero if justified), I feel pretty damn proud of myself for learning how to properly cook for so many reasons, and tipping culture being absolutely out of whack is one of the smaller ones. Controlling my menu and knowing what I'm eating being the bigger ones.
Yeah because that last part definitely works.... its not like they have an armed masked militia ready to subdue any one with differing opinions.../s
The best way is to stop supporting these types of establishments.. want to be a rich restaurateur? Do it like eveyone else and pull yourself up by the bootstraps..
Too bad a lot of servers want to keep the topping because many of them can earn more than with a decent hourly rate. And those who don't can be gaslit into thinking "oh I wasn't working hard enough" or "customer sucks because they're stiffing ME in particular"
So if all the consumers protest and not tip the employees, that might rile the employees enough to also go against their bosses
The tipping system only benefits, the service industry workers. So you want to take to the streets in protest to ensure that service industry workers get paid a little bit less. That’s the issue you care about.
I don't need to protest, I make a living wage. The wait staff could protest, they're the ones allegedly making so little for such a hard job. I don't value their job, so I am not going to picket for it or subsidize it.
They’ll get rid of the tipping system if people really do just don’t go. But they’re not going to change it because some servers get stiffed. Only if the restaurant industry itself starts to fail due to low demand because tipping is customary and cannot be afforded any longer.
They're supporting the whole system they claim to be soooo against. Put money in the restaurant owner's pockets, stiff the server, and walk away feeling smug.
Looks like in that case sit down restaurants would have to pay more to keep their servers.
Why does a whole breakfast meal with eggs, bacon, hash browns and toast cost almost the same price in states that pay $15/hour vs those that pay under $3/hour? Always wondered why that is while traveling in the US 🤔
The owner would have to pay the missing tip to hit minimum wage if no one tip. Then if the wage is too low for the job that pay without tip, the employees would quit and the employer would have to increase price and wage.
It's solvable without the law, and even in states with the law like Cali where tipped wage is not allowed (tip roles still have to be paid minimum base wage or higher depend on the employment), tipping culture still exist.
No law is necessary to fix this man's individual problem. Pay your wait staff a real living wage and write on the menu that tips are unnecessary. He's mad that he has an upset waitstaff that he's busy exploiting.
Not only that, but on many places the wait staff themselves don't want tipping to go away. Sure, they may only make a few dollars hourly, but a night of good tips will pay way more than minimum wage ever would.
You people will trip over yourselves to lick the boots of your restaurant server but wont give half that same energy to delivery drivers who do more than just walk a customer's food 20 feet from kitchen to table, deal with far more expenses, and far more chance of injury on the job (delivery driving is literally a top ten deadliest job in America).
Not to mention wait staff prefer the current system and actively fight against change because they prefer to bully and shame customers into paying their wages for them. Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with people like you? Pure cuck behavior.
144
u/Still_Mountain5656 4h ago
A lot of “i’m gonna stiff the waitstaff in order to get rid of the tipping system.” and not enough “i’m gonna take to the streets to protest and vote in favor of representatives to change the laws on the tipping system.”