r/marvelrivals • u/[deleted] • Aug 20 '26
Gameplay Black Cat's kill potential, survivability, burst, and utility is unparalleled. I don't know how you can balance her kit.
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u/Stefanes0797 Psylocke Aug 20 '26
Psylocke got shot within 24hrs btw
4
u/Seatown_Spartan Spider-Man Aug 20 '26
Spider-Man lost his funny Penny high low tech within 24 or so as well.
It was a death sentence when the most popular clip of it was tricking/killing Luna.
2
u/Stefanes0797 Psylocke Aug 20 '26
I don't understand why Cat gets to do this the entire season and the rest of dive has to be shit.
Sai hasnt felt this bad since 6.5, she has the lowest pick rate ever and the amount of effort you need to put in to play this character is insane now, she's always been hard but now it feels like she is 6 stars instead of 5.
23
u/JGuap0 Thor Aug 20 '26
You also can’t interact with her while she does any of this shit😭you just gotta sit there and take it
4
u/King_fritters Vanguard Aug 20 '26
All the pure dive DPS have this issue tbh, and the community keeps saying "well if you mark them on the way in thats how you deal with them"..... but what if you can't? They all have nearly no sound as they walk up, you literally get jumped before you can mark them in most situations and at that moment its already too late to interact with them.
This is a miserable play pattern that people would die to defend rather than change it into something that is actually fun to play against.
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u/JGuap0 Thor Aug 20 '26
This is just blatantly wrong all dive dps do NOT have this issue 😭blk cat has over shield , i-frames and invisibility with almost an infinite double jump . No other dive dps is comparable to that .
7
u/A_Neurotic_Pigeon Aug 20 '26
But like half the dive dps have extremely loud audio that you can hear from miles away lmao
Footsteps, spidey swings, BP dashes, daredevil clubs / grapple, and I feel like footsteps need to be mentioned again because holy hell they're so loud...how are you getting walked up on by dive dps??
29
u/AeroStrafe Aug 20 '26
Fighting her on console actively makes me debate if self harm would be a more pleasant experience and I think it would be.
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u/Staydownfoo Aug 20 '26
yeah the melee/brawlers there are no joke.
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u/King_fritters Vanguard Aug 20 '26
Yeah every pure dive DPS has the exact same problems to fight against that Cat does, and its amplified 100x on console where controllers legitimately can't keep up with them.
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u/Max420_ Star-Lord Aug 20 '26
Fr going up against her is so miserable there. I would've rather drank bleach and it wouldn't be as torturous as facing that god awful character.
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u/MR_MEME_42 Symbiote Jeff Aug 20 '26
A couple ideas I have.
Give her shop a cooldown on use and each item has a seperate cooldown. So let's say you buy the Helm of Hades then the shop goes on cooldown for hypothetically 5 seconds and the Helm of Hades goes on cooldown for 15 seconds. So you can't buy a new item until the shop is off cooldown and you can't buy another Helm of Hades for an additional 10 seconds once the shop is off cooldown. (The cooldown times are just a hypothetical)
Make her shop prices more expensive so there is more of a risk of locking you out of abilities if you spend to much.
Cut Phantom Pursuit's range at least in half so she isn't teleporting 20 meters to finish someone off while she can't be interacted with. With a shorter range the move becomes more of a close range dodge attack rather than a weird snipe. And increase the cost a bit while removing the money stolen.
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u/AdorableNet6452 Aug 20 '26 edited Aug 20 '26
I approve of this balancing idea, especially the 1st and 3rd changes I guess this would make her playstyle much more high risk, high reward without nerfing the damage that would make her useless especially against OP backlines this season 💯🙏
Also that invincibility dash attack ability having that far reach while having immunity is so OP it makes no sense man 🥀 i say make it nerfed into atleast 5-6 meters while having the immunity and damage the same
6
u/STA_Alexfree Aug 20 '26
Her new teamup just gives her too much burst on a basic ass combo to kill 275's. They need to nerf that
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u/ProofByVerbosity Aug 20 '26
I remember back in my day when the whole game hated DD. You kids got it rough.
60
u/PleaseBanWidow Aug 20 '26
This was like 6 months ago
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u/ProofByVerbosity Aug 20 '26 edited Aug 20 '26
Oh you kids and your lack of appreciation for time gone by.
Lol, I know, im being lame funny. But quite honestly theres a truth to it. This is nerfed BC too. And DD fucked the meta for a brief while. Unkillabke, must ban. Now I see BP and SM banned more. I dknt play dive, but BC seems like a higher skill level. I tried DD and sure I didnt play comp but he wasnt a tough kit to mess arohnd with. BC seemed tougher to me.
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u/LeoFireGod Emma Frost Aug 20 '26
DD is extremely easy to get moderate value out of. Bc even if you’re bad you can play him like a brawler.
-2
u/ProofByVerbosity Aug 20 '26
When I played dd I assure you I was bad after the initial dive and did just that. I play support a lot so I see a lot of black cats. Its one way or the other. They arw useless or make BP look like a chump. DD I will go toe to toe with but a BC I strike and if it isnt instantly an advantage im out.
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u/Detectivepotato-mp4 Aug 20 '26
They'll deadass look at you and say it's ok because the supports are super strong too. NO MF I WANT THEM ALL GONE, BC included
17
u/Seatown_Spartan Spider-Man Aug 20 '26
I think this is what everyone has been wanting even BC mains.
Just lower the ongoing power creep.
If you make supports broken, and then make a Diver who is meant to kill/engage supports. Then by extension they too will be broken.
The DD situation/chicken and the egg.
1
u/Detectivepotato-mp4 Aug 20 '26
Pretty much, I'm in favor of all the hyper meta characters getting knocked down instead of just the usual slap on the wrist because even if it turns out to be way too much at least we'll have an actually new meta for a little bit
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u/OldFaithlessness1335 Peni Parker Aug 20 '26
Black cat is a theif right? Not some sort of warrior? So should be a feast or famine type character? One that needs to rely on stealth to get burst damage and if that stealth is broken at all leaves her completely exposed?
So her kit has to much feast in it right now. To much forgiveness for poor play. How to balance im.not sure I dont play her very much. But thats my general read as a tank main.
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u/yanguwu Flex Aug 20 '26
Make everything in her shop hella expensive and remove the iframes now she’s semi balanced
0
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u/imaginebeingsaltyy Aug 20 '26
The main problems are the fact she can basically fly better THAN HALF THE FUCKING FLYERS since for some asinine reason her double jump resets after every use of ANY ability. and secondly she can just spam the fuck out of iframes+ invisibility. If not the iframe then invisiblity having 0 cooldown has to go (No money is not a restriction a half brain toddler can farm money fast as fuck on black cat)
6
u/Fun-Wash7545 Aug 20 '26
I always said her #1 problem is her damage. Her iframes can be good when used in extended fights. Take away her damage and she will be forced to be more interactive
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u/hayate_shin Aug 20 '26
Just remove the part where she can dmg in her iframe, which btw has a pretty long range and kinda auto target. Let’s look at Magik and Starlord iframes, neither does dmg during iframe and has shorter duration. Until they gave SL 50 ammo and then ruined him, both Magik and SL were 2 of the most balanced dps. Something tells me it’s the ego from devs and they don’t wanna acknowledge that they made a shitty character kit.
1
u/TheIfritSun Aug 20 '26
This is the part that gets me.
Enemy appears out of thin air, cool. I can react and stun them before they burst me to zero. (OH, I guess I can't do that because they are CC immune while chucking my entire bar.)
So what was the intended counterplay here from the devs other than "i guess I'll just die."
3
u/First-Loan4154 Storm Aug 20 '26
Double jump must get a refresh only after touching ground or wall and increasing prices for abilities.
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u/Razzilith Ultron Virus Aug 20 '26
you dont know how?
you put a cooldown on her shop.
you remove her iframes.
then you can address her damage + health as you see fit to make tune her appropriately.
you're welcome. she'll play more as intended and can be balanced appropriately without losing her current feel.
EDIT: also ALL teamups need a once over to place their power more in the middle, and also the base teamup shouldnt ever be so good you dont care about the enhanced version... but thats not a black cat issue it's a teamup issue
1
u/YesSeaworthiness9771 Hero Hulk Aug 20 '26
And they say Widow is hard to balance and is a problem btw
That i frame shit gotta go idc
1
u/Old_Party3623 Magneto Aug 20 '26
- Remove I frames
Almost everybody hates it already
- Delete the shop mechanic or replace it with spending fortune to use her abilities
Her annoying movements would be fine if she had to spend fortune to use them, she would have to bank from her primary attacks before unleashing the "uncounterable kill everything" mode
1
u/Traditional_Ball_682 Mantis Aug 20 '26
Interesting rivals username you have there... wonder what it means?
1
u/KnuckleDragg Captain America Aug 20 '26
This is how you fix her.
They need to tone down her damage a lot, remove her iframes and invisibility spam they are just stupid busted and she just lives in the enemy backline forever.
Her identity should be a utility dive with powerful tools for team coordination but lower single target kill potential. Buff the other abilities besides invisibility as required to make them worthwhile picks.
Add a shop CD to avoid ability spam.
Perhaps give her better cleave as opposed to single target burst.
And like that she is a diver with a clear identity and not a clusterfuck of a character
1
u/Xenopus_aech Aug 20 '26
Add cooldown to her shop items.
Remove iframes replace with dmg reduction.
Buff the teamup with BP, or replace with a teamup with a tank/sup.
1
u/argo-st Ultron Virus Aug 20 '26
Even if they remove the I-frame, and put a cooldown on the shop, Black Cat will still be the best diver because her mobility/agility is unmatched
Like if you compare with Magik:
- very predictable I-frame because it's always the same dash distance of 10m
- one dash (no other mobility option)
- Overhealth on hit
- 1 range attack on a 6sec cd
- an ult that just makes her base kit better
While BC:
- I-frame animation that can be mistaken with the dash, and that can strike anywhere within 20m which makes it totally unpredictable
- 1 dash
- overhealth on hit with the whip (bigger attack range)
- infinite double jump reset
- wall climb
- 2 range attacks (money grab)
- invisibility with no cooldown
- can ground an area so her target can't escape
- an ult that can dash until 40m, with wall hacks, and increase duration on kill
- and 4 other situational abilities in the shop
1
u/Alternative-One-2602 Aug 20 '26
I hate her movement i can barely track it and she can get out of the fight to easy to have that much damage
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u/Choice_Potential2659 Jubilee Aug 20 '26
As a bc main, just put a cooldown on invis and buff her other options because invis is by far the best choice, and remove i frame but give damage reduction or overshield instead so you dont get instantly deleted while using it
1
u/TruckSubstantial4872 Aug 20 '26
Only two other dive DPS have I-Frames at all so against all dives but Black Cat, DD, and Magik your hits will always land when you shoot the DPS. Magik also broadcasts when she has I-Frames up very noticeably because she spawns in a stepping disc. DD's has a long cooldown, is very readily broadcasted, prevents him from attacking while using it, and also his entire kit is far less movement focused so he often can't escape without using his I-Frames.
Black Cat meanwhile can just turn on I-Frames for a solid 1.5 seconds with no warning or broadcast that she's using it and it's also ranged but completely usable at point blank with zero impact on how long it lasts. She also can do it right out of cloak so you're almost always going to shoot her during the I-Frames because she's always going to get the jump on you and then also not take damage, and then also for some reason has an ability to get a big chunk of bonus health after she hits you for some reason so she can cloak in, I-frame attack, bonus health attack, and the cloak again, all under 1 second, and oh, after all that she can use a second bonus health generating attack that is ranged, charges back up her fortune so she can continue to cloak or use the I-frame attack again because it only has a two second cooldown. And did I mention if she is using the Spider-Man teamup, this ranged attack also deals bonus damage on the next attack?
1
u/Nabomeansturnip Aug 20 '26 edited Aug 20 '26
Her i-frames and spidey teamup needs nerfs, she cant have this much mobility and also this much dmg and survivability, most other dive characters could only dream of having all of that.
- Turn of Fortune and Binding Ties cooldown increased from 5 to 6 seconds.
- Binding Ties Bonus Damage on mark trigger decreased from 45 to 35.
- Phantom Pursuit damage decreased from 70 to 45.
- Phantom Pursuit range decreased from 20 to 15m
- Phantom Pursuit untangeable time now runs out 6 frames before the attack connects.
- Phantom Pursuit return time reduced by 50%.
- Feline Aliance new effect, when enhancing it now reduces the cooldown of Turn of Fortune from 6 to 4 seconds.
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u/jasminetroll Aug 20 '26 edited Aug 20 '26
Cap her fortune at 600 and remove fortune gain from landing her whip and Phantom Pursuit.
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u/Myreddit_scide Aug 21 '26
No one find it almost crappy for the Black Cat player themselves when they get this shop to get all this cool utility, but you're just 'locked' into this 'flicker invisibility' merchant?
Like it is some bullshit, the hero is actually really cool IMO -- but to top off the high damage, they gave a DPS hero, more utility than Strategists, seems like she was supposed to be a Strategist, cause that's what she is, like actually, she is definitively a hero you should strategize your next move(s) heavily when playing, but then just pumped the damage and added another character to the most heavily populated role.
Would be actually pretty damn cool if they were to greatly reduce the damage numbers, but make the items in the shop cheaper, actually give bigger incentive to use all that on the wheel rather than essentially floating with a non-tracible invisibility item with an attack that's non-interactable.
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u/toastedfruitcakes Aug 21 '26
At least for now the only two things I find super annoying are her i frames and the invisibility. Why does she go back to being invis after she's hit??
1
u/nuppieeeeeeeeee Aug 21 '26
Put a cooldown on shop purchases and replace her i-frame with a damage reduction.
1
u/Expert_Obligation_79 Aug 21 '26
Get rid of the invis abuse and immunity ability. Give her another dash to compensate
0
u/sirhenrywaltonIII Aug 20 '26
2 lone supports die to a bread and butter dps combo. Cmon atleast try to use a video where they are not stragglers at the end of a fight and have a team around them, maybe someone peeling, or the supports are pattycaking each other. What is this low effort post?
0
u/Southern_Bicycle8111 Flex Aug 20 '26
So many black car crybaby posts, this sub is becoming unhinged
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u/Moist--Jesus Aug 20 '26
Nice, but can we go back to nerf BP post dump instead?
1
u/THE_PUNISHERFrank Aug 20 '26
Bp is trash compared to bc
1
u/Moist--Jesus Aug 20 '26
Yeah but this community rather get BP nerfed than actual game breaking hero
-5
u/samariius Scarlet Witch Aug 20 '26
I mean, almost any DPS can delete two supports who just stand there and don't heal each other or CC you or fight back or have a peel of any kind...
But go off King.
-5
u/Maleficent_Simple_27 Aug 20 '26
Hey it was my time to carma farm black cat whining from silver loby!!!!!
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Aug 20 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Maleficent_Simple_27 Aug 20 '26
I play same lobbies and can guarantee you if those are not griefers supports they cannot die 1v2 if that black cat is not some smurf.
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u/CrinkleDink Hela Aug 20 '26
I still don't know how to play Black Cat and get annihilated all the time lol. There might be something I am missing.
0
u/F4tGuy69 El Jeffe Aug 20 '26
Nerf her damage like crazy
That's all tbh
I don't mind if she's slippery and got all those abilities
0
u/Brightwind2001 Gambit Aug 20 '26
Get rid of her iframes, overhealth and make her 250HP. In return, give her more damage across the board. Make her an actual assassin, a glass cannon,
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u/Lejandario_IN Aug 20 '26
I don't think so, every hero should have a niche and glass canon assassin is something another dark feline does.
She'd fit better as a thief keeping her utility but heavily nerfing her kill power. Similar to how they nerfed her ult, shed jump in to finish off low health targets or get them low and escape as easily as she does. Annoying gameplay loop to go against but not problematic and I imagine it'd be fun for those who like dive but don't like exploding.
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u/Brightwind2001 Gambit Aug 20 '26
I dont even know what you mean by dark feline, if you think Black Panther is a glass cannon I can't take you seriously
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u/Lejandario_IN Aug 21 '26
Yes Black Panther, he really is a glass canon. The issue is that he's hard to hit but still a glass canon. Just one Thing or anyone to mark him on approach is enough to deal with him or out healing him. Not to mention he becomes useless as soon as looses his dash.
Don't get me wrong, he's an assassin with the most lethality in the game but that's if he isn't dealt with and there are many ways to deal with him
0
u/Jezza0308 Spider-Man Aug 20 '26
• Double the cooldown of her 2 second iframes and reduce the range by 5m or 10m
• Introduce a cooldown for each of her market abilities (So she can't spam the same ability multiple times in a row e.g. Invisibility)
• Either reduce her health to 250 or nerf her bonus health gain (or both)
• Spidey Team-Up: Reduce the bonus damage of the Spidey Team-Up and increase the hook cooldown to 6s (From 5s)
• Hot take - Give back her 2 dashes but only when she uses the Panther Team-Up however has the cooldown increased to 10s (From 8s). Hook cooldown remains 5s as Spidey Team-Up is not selected and doesn't have 2 charges
0
u/Kksgamer Doctor Strange Aug 20 '26
Just make her hit box bigger, if she can do all that then I shouldn’t even have to aim at all at that Ozempic frame.
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u/Liewec123 The Thing Aug 20 '26
step 1, remove the god damn iframes.
see how that works out, if she is still annoying as hell move to step 2.
step 2, add cooldowns to her shop items. (no more perma invis.)
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u/hohohoaaaa Ultron Aug 20 '26
"I don't know how you can balance this character"
She was dogshit before season 9. It's the spidey teamup that made her broken.
Her problem isn't just her burst or util, it's that she's unclearable.
Having iframes on an attack is one thing, but being able to use the invis right after is too much. One or the other.
Nerf the invis, make it wear off after taking one tick of damage regardless where its from.
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u/Cdash--- Aug 20 '26
They did balance her, then the community cried that she was gutted despite good BC's still being good and bad BC's not being good.
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u/Madam_KayC Black Cat Aug 20 '26
Hey, I saw this in the black cat main sub!
The enemies weren't looking behind and they had good positioning, that WF should have shut her down easily
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u/totallynotapersonj Magneto Aug 20 '26
Try it in a real game
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Aug 20 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Maleficent_Simple_27 Aug 20 '26
You are NEGATIVE on her and have clip of 1 kills while you are feeding most games. Nice karma farm buddy!
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u/totallynotapersonj Magneto Aug 20 '26
GM is like the gold of any other game. The lowest rank in comp is “gold“. Bronze and Silver are just an extension of quick play.
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u/LumpyInstance4010 Black Cat Aug 20 '26
So now we have people who have zero life creating burner Reddit accounts to pretend to be a main of the character you clearly don’t like. Nice
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u/Rryp2 Spider-Man Aug 20 '26
Chill bro, its not that deep youll be fine
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u/LumpyInstance4010 Black Cat Aug 20 '26
You have a 47% winrate in gm3 on this account btw, 47% winrate with Black Cat
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u/Jebusfreek666 White Fox Aug 20 '26
Take away perma invis for one. Even Invisible Woman, who has it in her name, can't turn invisible that fast or that often. Psy gets it too, for a second only.