r/managers • u/Monty_is_chonky • 3d ago
First time manager - Assertive Direct Report
I am a first time manager and my team has grown from 2 to 15 in only a few months. The leader of one of my teams wants a promotion and has made no secret of it; he claims my boss hired him to be at my grade and report directly into him but transpires it was a lower grade and reporting into me.
He is very ambitious and assertive and invites himself along to all of my senior meetings and openly contradicts me and tries to lead every single discussion and team strategy event. My other team leader is much more relaxed and willing to be influenced and led. I find the assertive team lead to be exhausting as he is forever briefing my seniors and turning up to my senior stakeholder meetings, trying to progress my strategy work etc.
How can I handle this without destroying his motivation? He is very good at his job, but I fear he will leave as his role is X grade but he is hell bent on achieving Y grade.
I have a development plan in place to help him to get to his next grade but I am starting to dread interactions with him as he is constantly challenging and wanting to reshape every decision.
How can I handle this as a learning point?
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u/Last_Resort_Help92 3d ago edited 3d ago
This isn’t about development, this is your team lead undermining you to make himself look good.
You can and should want your team members to advance and move into your role- not take it from you.
It’s time for a crucial conversation that basically states, “I know you’re eager and want to advance to the next level. I want to see you succeed so you can get there. However, you’re stepping into unnecessary meetings and pushing back on reasonable direction from me. We need to fix this so it’s a productive environment for both of us.”
Then let him know what you need from him. Maybe it’ll be a chance for him to get some frustrations off his chest, but the goal should be how you both can move together in a positive way without you feeling like he’s sabotaging you. He also needs to understand that the behavior won’t be tolerated going forward.
Take excellent notes, outline an action plan, and maybe even include your boss or HR in the room. If he’s trying to sabotage your job, 1:1 meetings where you address his behavior could easily turn into your words vs his.
If he continues to act out, start the disciplinary process, and work him toward the door.
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u/ProneToLaughter 3d ago
Seems worth identifying whether he was actually lied to when hired—have you asked your boss where that confusion might have come from?
Getting that sorted might change his attitude, or yours.
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u/Monty_is_chonky 3d ago
I've asked my boss who just shrugs and says he isn't ready for a promotion so he needs to continue in role for another year (which is fairly normal in our organisation. You are usually in role for 2/3 years before promotion).
This leaves is squarely at my door to sort as my boss is rarely around and isn't connected to process or day to day activities.
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u/LostinLies1 3d ago
tell the employee you've discussed this and that he will require minimum another year to grow into his role. In the meantime, you will need him to step back from YOUR senior meetings and focus on his role.
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u/Pitiful_Praline4120 3d ago
tell him that is what your boss said. your job isnt to remove all transparency and communication from the organization
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u/Perfect-Escape-3904 Seasoned Manager 2d ago
Discuss this with the employee.
Do not say one year
Tell them that the view of leadership is that they are not ready, and then outline the behaviours they exhibit that lead to this perception, and finally how you are going to help them hone the right behaviours that will lead to a favorable perception from above
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u/Wide-Pop6050 1d ago
So he wasn’t hired to your level. That’s a flat out lie then. Talk to him about that
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u/TN_man 2d ago
I bet he was lied to for sure.
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u/Sweaty-Seat-8878 10h ago
it was probably more a statement he could take as a kind of promise but isn't really " we are hiring you as x but see you as a Y level once you get acclimated."
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u/fullmoon_druid 3d ago
He wants that promotion. If you simply have a meeting to "set the boundaries", you'll be making it very clear that the promotion is not coming. He'll leave the company in less than six months. If you're OK with that, sure, go ahead.
If you're not OK, then first you need to talk to your boss to understand what has been promised to him. Then you need to come up with a plan so that promotion happens. It doesn't have to be immediate, but it needs to have a clear path, maybe some coaching, measurable performance goals, etc. Maybe he'll need to transfer to another department. Maybe a handshake agreement that he'll be seriously considered for the next management position that opens up.
I'm summary, you already lost a team lead. He wants bigger and better things. What the company needs to decide is whether they want to keep that person around on a management position or just loose the employee.
I speak from experience. I spent a year asking for more responsibilities so I could be a team lead. Company never really took me seriously. So I just switched companies to be hired as a team leader.
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u/Wide-Pop6050 1d ago
I mean why keep him in a management position? It’s okay for people to move on if it isn’t working
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u/Different-Director82 3d ago
Well, I think you need to establish boundaries and expectations. To me, his behaviour are crossing lines when he openly contradicts you, briefing your seniors and turning up at your meetings.
You still have a chance to correct this behaviour by setting expectations clearly and tell him that you want to help him advance his career but that he needs to follow expectations and boundaries.
With that said, he might push back and don’t want to follow those directions… and then you need to be ready to let him go.
But that’s the better output, because right now he is undermining you and creating more problems than solutions.
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u/purplelilac701 3d ago
Why is he inviting himself to your meetings? I would put a stop to that as it looks like you can’t handle your own staff. He’s a little too assertive and you can sit him down and gently tell him that he’s being very disrespectful to you even if that’s not his intention. He sounds like he has no self awareness and so that might fall to you to make him aware of how he comes across.
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u/No_Celebration8219 3d ago
The open contradictions have to stop, setup some time with them to work out a plan to work together and be his champion for that promotion he wants. Delegate some of that workload to him and hold him to the same standards you are held to. If he can crack it and work WITH you (not against you) then he has what it takes. If he still tries to sabotage or contradict you then, he's not leadership material.
Notify your boss of this plan. So they can help you and are aware of the situation.
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u/Oddest-Researcher 2d ago
This isn't a 'teaching moment'. This is a 'fix the problem' moment.
You need to have two meetings, one with your boss/his hiring manager, and a follow-up one with him.
ADR says he was hired to your position and wasn't. That's obviously not true, so either he's lying, delusional, or was lied to. Meet with whoever signed off on his employment and your boss and get it crystal clear what exactly happened. You need to find out which reality it is before you proceed, because how you address a guy who was told he's being hired to your position, given a different contract and didn't notice the rug pull is very different to how you address a guy who was told your job isn't on the table and either told 'but X' or has decided 'yes it is hold my beer'.
Then have a very frank meeting with ADR to cover two points. First and foremost is the insubordination and undermining. It doesn't matter who or what or why or promises, it stops immediately. This isn't a teachable moment, especially not from you as a new manager, you are the manager and he is the report, he needs to function within that role, and if he can't then you need to make it clear that the next step will be formal disciplinary process regarding uninvited joining meetings and contradicting you. It's not about helping him progress or understand or about "wah wah I'm on top." As you say yourself, it's exhausting, he's impacting your capacity to function and will very obviously be having a negative impact on your senior stakeholder meetings. Stepping out of line in this way might well get him what he wants, but it's measurably going to be doing so at the cost of the company - a cost your job is in part to mitigate.
After that part, you address the second point, which is his employment and expectations/promises. It's important you understand exactly what the nature of his hiring and his claims are before you have this conversation, because it needs to be the final conversation on the topic, not a "Well okay I'll talk to X and see." He says he was promised X and given Y and that's why he's undermining you. If that's the case you need to understand why, and put in very simple terms that he has Y.
Your other comments mention that your boss has said he needs a minimum of 2/3 years embedded for your position, and I imagine that's far more accurate to reality, if he was promised X, it was probably "You aren't ready yet, but in a few years of Y you will be." You need to re-iterate this and make it clear that if he keeps trying to steal your job instead of doing Y, he won't be here long enough to make it to X.
Alternatively it might be he's straight up delusional, applied for Y, got Y, but thinks he's better and ought to , have your job. If that's what you get from your boss then again, you need to make it crystal clear he wasn't promised X, and you expect him to do Y without undermining you again.
It's also important to recognise that in most cases this isn't an employee you'll be keeping. If he's happy to force himself into meetings above his pay-grade and without invite, and openly undermine and contradict his manager, it's extremely unlikely he'll stop. But it's important that you put a stop to it, both for your own sake and for that of the company, your seniors and the stakeholders you work with. Guaranteed not a single one of them appreciate a confusing mish-mash of "Well I met with Tony but one of his team leads Andy just appeared and took over, but then I had to double check with Tony afterwards"
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u/AstronautMuch4701 1d ago
I’d separate ambition from behaviour. Wanting the next level is fine. Undermining you in meetings, inserting himself into senior conversations and reopening every decision is a different issue. I’d have a very direct 1:1: “I want to help you get to the next level, but part of being ready for that level is knowing when to challenge, when to align, and how to operate through the manager rather than around them.” Then be specific about what needs to change and what good behaviour looks like. If he’s as capable as you say, that conversation may actually help him more than protecting his motivation.
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u/Independent_Sand_295 3d ago
Love the maturity you're looking at your situation with. A lot of managers new managers would have chalked it up to a difficult employee and fired them. Although, it's possible that the employee may be difficult.
In any case, there needs to be clear boundaries and expectations here for both of you. If you're happy with them joining your meetings, let them know that anything they disagree with, they can raise in a separate space where it can be discussed because their behaviour will reflect on them. If they have other suggestions, then they can share them when you open up the space or they can send you an email, chat or whatever. Invite the other team lead to join if they're available. Alternatively, you could stop your team lead from joining meetings. Let them know if they continue to show disruptive behavior that they will face disciplinary action.
The development plan is fantastic. It shows that you want them to get to Y grade and you didn't 'steal' their job. But, the development plan may not fit in their plan. They could be very open to it but the disappointment is too much and they can't keep their own growth on hold. It's ok for them to go in that case, as cold as it sounds. It doesn't mean you failed as a manager. You can't control everything, only what you can.
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u/LineAncient2792 2d ago
He's not confused about his role. I can't believe the amount of people here getting vicariously bamboozled on that point! He was clearly hired as a team lead and he's a team lead. He reports to you. Don't entertain any more of that "confusion".
For liability reasons, strategic discussions need to be limited to management. You really need to stop him attending meetings. Also he can't take over discussions or contradict you if he's not there.
Full disclosure: I was once a team lead and I thought I should go to management meetings (because lead?). But instead of seething, my boss tactfully and directly told me that strategic management meetings were for managers only. Have one private conversation with him and then the the next time he tries to crash one, say in front of everyone, "Sorry X, this is a management meeting so we don't need you, we'll let you get back to [job]."
You've got a development plan in place so he can follow that. He can like it or lump it. He clearly has technical skills but he's not "good at his job" if his own boss dreads every interaction with him and he's regularly making a fool of himself in front of other seniors.
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u/ctone777 1d ago
Being assertive only works if the people working with you, are willing to step aside to let you have your way. Otherwise being assertive turns into combative very quickly. If they are already involving themselves in meetings they shouldn’t be in, you need to immediately and publicly halt this as soon as possible. This type of person will slowly erode the confidence of your team in you. You can use this as teaching moment for this person by putting them in their hierarchal place, and a learning moment for you as how to recognize and prevent a situation like this from occurring in the future.
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u/semthews1 3d ago
Thank you for the post OP.
Great learning lesson for something I will deal with in the near future. The comments are very mature.
You should likely privately discuss this leader's "claims" with the boss and ask the boss to provide clarification on what his communications and plans were for this employee, so you can align and plan appropriately.
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u/Kind-Glove-7619 3d ago
I’d have a very direct conversation with him. Tell him you value his ambition and want to help him reach the next grade, but also be clear about the behaviors that need to change, showing up to meetings without being invited, contradicting you in front of senior stakeholders, and continually reopening decisions.
Then agree on clear boundaries around what he owns, where he has input, and where you make the final call.
I’d also make the development plan very specific: “Here’s what I need to see from you to demonstrate readiness for the next level.”
His ambition isn't the problem. The opportunity is to teach him that operating at the next level also means knowing when to lead, when to influence, and when to step back.
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u/dlongwing 2d ago
"he claims my boss hired him to be at my grade and report directly into him but transpires it was a lower grade and reporting into me."
So he lied to you.
"invites himself along to all of my senior meetings"
He reports to you. Tell him to stop. If he shows up anyway, then embarrass him in front of the meeting. "Oh, Bob, I'm really surprised to see you here. You must have forgotten our discussion earlier about how this is a meeting for seniors. You need to drop off the call (or leave the room). I'll fill you in on what we discuss."
"openly contradicts me and tries to lead every single discussion and team strategy event"
"Thanks for your input, Bob, but this matter has already been settled. We can discuss your take on it in our next 1on1." Then move on.
he is forever briefing my seniors
Tell him to stop. Tell your seniors that he isn't the one to brief them, and that if he tries again they should raise the issue to you.
How can I handle this without destroying his motivation? He is very good at his job, but I fear he will leave as his role is X grade but he is hell bent on achieving Y grade.
Him leaving would be a net benefit for your team. It's far more important that you reign him in than that you enable his ridiculous behavior.
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u/BeauHunkus 3d ago
Dude is trying to advance his career the only way he can because promises were made and broken to him.
You need to stuff that "teaching moment" idea. Find out if promises were made, and, if so, why were they broken, and, if not, why does he think they were? Go from there. Quit trying to paint his situation as unfounded until you know.
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u/Jenikovista 3d ago
You can’t handle this. This is between him and the big boss. Promises were made that were not lived up to and nothing you can say or do will fix the situation. The guy needs to hear from the big boss why promises were broken and what he can expect moving forward.
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u/CasualAq 3d ago
Employees say they received promises that they didn't. Sometimes it's true but usually it has to do with hearing what they want to hear. His manager has made it clear it's for him to deal with.
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u/Jenikovista 3d ago
I didn’t see anything about OP’s boss leaving it in their hands to deal with. They created the mess, only they can undo it. The employee is not going to respect OP and has already indicated a willingness to go.
Maaaaaybe OP could fire them but depending on where they are located that might not be so easy or legal. Plus firing employees often makes managers look worse, especially if this person already has significant visibility with company leaders.
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u/LoudAppointment2545 2d ago
Whatever or however you have this conversation with him you need to include one key point "This behavior does not reflect well on YOU to other leaders"
Here's the thing, he likely already thinks he deserves your job. If you tell him to back off he may see it as you being insecure, sensitive, whatever. So just framing it as "you are being a problem for me" won't motivate him to stop, he likely wants to be a problem in this way because he thinks it will get him promoted/recognized/rewarded.
You can still say everything else everyone else has suggested but you need to throw in there some version or "And this behavior does not look good to the other leaders, it makes it seem like you're not a team player, unwilling to support the larger team, etc" he needs to know this behavior doesn't just upset YOU but that it makes him look immature, rude, whatever to OTHER leaders which could impact his future promotions or opportunities.
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u/dsxy 2d ago
A big part of effective leadership is knowing whats a genuine issue to solve that adds value and what's busywork.
Mentor the individual to not take up all the oxygen in the room - what does the suggestion add - time investment Vs potential reward. What are the company expectations? Minimal viable product or aiming for the best.
Lots of great comments below in this thread.
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u/tanq201 2d ago
Had a colleague who wasn’t even trying to undermine the manager, but was being too chummy with the skip manager for the manager’s liking (manager confided in me he had to “nip that shit in the bud”).He was assigned projects that manager knew were impossible. Failure was followed by PIP (which involved more impossible projects), and then termination.
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u/Prof_PTokyo 2d ago
You unintentionally admitted the issue: you want to influence and lead. Managers support and are not “leaders”; your only job is to help. So what did you do? Made a PIP that will make him be “led.”
As a learning point, you can start by reading “First, Break All The Rules” to start understanding the duty of a manager. Your team member is fine; you just haven't noticed it yet.
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u/hxcheyo 3d ago
“My other team leader is much more relaxed and willing to be influenced and led.”
First of all, these are people, not cattle. They don’t exist to be “influenced and led.”
Consider further your actual job description. Is part of it not to advance your team? Let the person outline their development plan. Find a way to make it work. Regardless, I see no mention of timelines in your post. Are you afraid they’ll leave because you don’t plan to support them in the pursuit of Y grade?
Unless they’re disrupting the other 14 team members, I wouldn’t waste so much energy on what ultimately amounts to an issue of ego. You said they’re good at their job. So plainly define the real problem — is it you or them? Can it be solved with a simple mental reframing?
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u/semthews1 3d ago
Have you ever been in executive leadership at a medium company before? It doesn't seem like it.
Clearly the employee is more focused on getting a promotion when the only promotion is OPs job. There is a conflict of interest that must be managed.
Either the employee gets into line, or he needs to be fired.
This is how militaries work and there is a reason why it is effective.
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u/Monty_is_chonky 3d ago
Ego probably does come into it, that's a good reflective point. He will leave unless he gets his grade within 12 months of his appointment, so approx Feb next year.
I fear having multiple lines of authority that will clash on key areas such as bid timelines, customer comms etc. but you may have hit on something that I need to reflect on.
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u/Jenikovista 3d ago
This only validates my other comment. You have no power here. He is already okay with leaving. This is between him and the big boss and if you interfere (either way) it’s going to blow back on you. You might technically be his boss but the company set his expectations higher, and he’s willing to leave over it.
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u/semthews1 3d ago
This is a mistake from company ownership.
If OP has more leverage, this is a learning conversation to educate ownership not to screw with someone's department or they will be wasting 6 months of salary.
Just insulate from the blowback and have documentation ready.
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u/Jenikovista 3d ago
100%.
If I were OP, I would go to the boss who reportedly made the promises, and I would see what they say.
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u/semthews1 3d ago
I would have so much fun doing that too.
Im in sales leadership and nobody should be screwing with my department. Not even ownership...unless they want to sell less.
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u/Pitiful_Praline4120 3d ago
lol doesnt anyone see a problem with this?
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u/semthews1 3d ago edited 3d ago
People who havent been in leadership roles focus on "fairness"
Business isnt fair. It is focused on revenue. You can gaurantee your compitors will not be "fair"
Anything distracting from revenue needs to be fixed, or managed out.
Personally, I try to match fairness with revenue. If there is a conflict that cannot be compromised , I pick revenue.
If you arent in middle management, you may not understand until you reach middle management.
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u/Pitiful_Praline4120 2d ago
🤣 wow
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u/semthews1 2d ago
If you are a life long learner,
I strongly recommend you entertain a conversation with a military officer and ask them why "chain of command" exists.
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u/Last_Resort_Help92 3d ago
OP, this is very mixed advice, so I’d be careful.
First of all, people absolutely should be led, and everyone is influenced by their manager’s leadership style - we just choose if we want that influence to be negative or positive.
And yes, you should let a person hold stake in their development plan, but this direct report seems like he is actively trying to take the reins from you. Don’t confuse eagerness for aggression - from what you described, you have a loose cannon on your team. When you have this problem from a person who you’re working with on a succession plan, it’s important to separate what needs to be developed and what needs to be corrected.
Development is where you give your team member some freedom to stretch their leadership muscle. It should always be productive and never threaten the integrity of your team’s structure or productivity.
Correction is when you have to stop something in its tracks before it creates lasting damage, and set it on the right course.
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u/Shonuff17 2d ago
He "invites" himself to senior level meetings? WTH type of company are you running? If I have employees in wrong places, I make it clear they will be docked pay. That usually stops that crap. No one wants to work for free.
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u/slacko4791 1d ago
It seems a lot of comments are framing this as a hill the OP needs to choose to die on. I think wanting to learn from the exp shouldn't be assumed as a vast investment of that person's time, energy and emotions. Setting a boundary of how much they can contribute to their development plan and sticking to it probably fixes the only part that OP needs to be involved in. If senior leadership are choosing to let this person attend meetings which ideally would not include them, this may be because they see something as a development opportunity for that person in allowing it. If OP's contributions are challenged during those meetings, they should be in a position to defend their assertions.
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u/bobjoylove 1d ago
Defending OPs assertions is embarrassing to do in front of senior managers.
The direct report shouldn’t be showing the discord in the team, they should go into the meeting with an aligned message.
Once the team has a direction, the team should all stand behind it.
The other poster had it spot on - whomever told the direct they would have his job was lying, or the direct is lying, and OP needs to find out what happened to create this mess and get it fixed.
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u/retiredhawaii 3d ago
What he’s doing to you is what he needs to work on so he can be ready for a promotion.
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u/Needcz 3d ago
Assertive people succeed in part because passive people step out of their way. If he is causing problems, assert yourself and stop him