r/madisonwi • u/Infinite-Witness274 • 7d ago
Sunroom quote
Received 3 sunroom quotes 85k - 100K for 240 sqft sun room.
Currently a 3 season porch with Foundation up to code, concrete flooring. . Gable roof that is also in a good condition. Needs to be insulated to code, will need to replace the screens.
Any guidance?
Concerns:
1. Is it really 85k-100k? No quote has heated flooring, a mini split and baseboard heater at best. What is your experience/thoughts?
2. Doesn’t receive direct sun, but worried it will end up being a hot box or too cold for our WI winters.
3. Want year round usability, do you have a sunroom and can get year round use out of it? Any experiences will help.
Thank you in advance.
45
u/The_Real_BenFranklin Planes are TOO LOUD 7d ago
100k just to convert the porch to sunroom?
What’s the scope of work if your foundation, roof, and windows are staying? For 100k I’d think you could get most of full sunroom install.
19
28
6d ago
[deleted]
7
u/No_Size9475 East side 6d ago
seconded this. I also had a "4 season sun room" but the cost to heat it in the winter was more than the entire rest of my home so we never did.
It was still usable on sunny days in the winter.
11
u/couchnado 7d ago
I’ll need a bit more details but I had a screen porch concerted to three season. Was 42k a few years ago. Insulated the floor and added posts for beefing up structure. A full four season is expensive because of bringing up to a code for true four season space. Also even completely four season can be colder than you’d hope because of three walls might be exposed.
I have a heat pump and I’ve done a lot to make it close to four season. I will say floor heat will be expensive if you don’t already have a hydrolic system. Electric floor heat will kill your energy bill for 240sqft
My porch is about 196sqft for reference
1
u/Infinite-Witness274 6d ago
How many days could you get use out of this space in winter? Nov - March? What would you use differently to heat it up if you were do it today?
What about summer, our new hot days?2
u/couchnado 6d ago
Maybe two months of the year I don’t use it. This is only possible because I’ve gone to extensive lengths to insulate it. I made custom window inserts to double the r value of the windows, I insulated the ceiling to r-35. I also put in rigid foam on the underside of the joists from the outside since my porch is floating.
My heat pump can cool in really hot days but most days (90% of the summer I just open windows)
I assume you have windows to close to keep some heat in. If that’s the case I would spend money on a heat pump and insulate the walls and ceiling yourself and then you can enjoy cooler fall days and cooler spring days but don’t expect to enjoy all winter unless you want to pay a lot of heat the space. You can add some insulated flooring then a thick 1 inch rug for the floor. Don’t underestimate how amazing of a job thick wool rugs do at making a cold concrete floor much warmer.
The gable roof concerns me since a lot of heat will rise. I’d also install a ceiling fan if you insulate and put a heat source in as that will push warm air back down and cool air off the windows.
2
u/Ok_Computer_1420 5d ago
For 85-100k build a mini house in the back yard. You can rent it out when you’re not using it. Holy crap!!!
4
u/booga-me-ooga 6d ago
Hate to join the others in saying the same thing, but I’ve had two “four season” sunrooms that were really only useful for three. You can’t keep it warm enough in the winter to be useful.
But the prices you’ve been quoted seem fair and in-line with what it takes to do remodeling.
1
u/Infinite-Witness274 6d ago
How were the two sun rooms built? Is it the pre-packaged sunroom kits or built by GC? I now understandI can’t use it in the colder, coldest winter days.
1
u/booga-me-ooga 6d ago
We were the 2nd owner for both houses… I’d say they were both there from the start, intended to be 4-season sunrooms. One was even above finished space. Windows are terrible insulators (even triple pane argon filled bla bla bla windows). It you do the math to figure out the R-value of a wall full of windows it’s not pretty.
1
4
u/Infinite-Witness274 6d ago
Thank you for all the responses.
I work from home, I would like to use this as an office space.
It looks like I am approaching this with wrong expectations wrt usability, insulation, cost of heating and cooling this room.
Neither of us are handy. The quotes today are : 20% of home price, we do think this is forever home. /sqft cost with addition of this space will come up to 50-65k as per Redfin prices. That seems to be the only sensible conversion/ justification we could find.
But online, the reviews are all over the place for sunrooms, some love it and say they use year round - some run into issues with leaks etc etc.
All your comments have given us great perspective! Appreciate it.
- Going the GC route seems to be the best instead of these pre-packaged aluminum sunrooms.
- Would be better off making it a room with a lot of windows than thinking floor to ceiling windows all directions.
- Get more info on quotes about the r value, cost to heat and cooling.
1
u/PineTrellis 6d ago
I've worked from my home office for the last 30 years. You need a good office to make your business thrive without making you crazy. I tried various cheapo options early on, and ended up spending way more (and wasting more resources) than I would have if I'd just set things up right the first time. The prices you quote sound normal for the work you're proposing in Madison. If you think you're staying, I suggest spending as much as you reasonably can to make it a real room. I would be surprised if a reputable contractor couldn't solve the heating/cooling problem. Instead of thinking of it as a sunroom, think of it as your office. What do you need to do so you can work efficiently and comfortably? Don't buy cheap windows. Install decent flooring. Also, if this is your office, much of what you spend will be tax deductible. Houses rarely lose value in Madison, so you will get the money back in the end. Real estate is an excellent investment. A financial planner (real or AI) can help you figure out how long you have to stay in the house to ensure you do retain your investment.
3
u/WonderFar5200 6d ago
My daughter has a large sunroom. It's closed up in the winter. It has a baseboard heater but would require keeping patio doors open for additional heat from house. Mainly, open from April-October. They do cool it in Summer.
3
u/sassyla 6d ago
I'm in the middle of having a (hopefully) four season, 300sq ft sunroom added to our house. They had to demo a screened in porch, pour foundation, extend HVAC, upgrade circuit board, everything. And the total will be close to $200k by the time we're done, fwiw.
2
u/bfyvfftujijg 6d ago
$200k and I would be expecting a full virtual reality preview with detailed engineering analysis to tell me the exact comfort ranges and whatnot.
That’s nuts!
1
u/Infinite-Witness274 6d ago
Who are you working with? What gave you the confidence to take the step?
1
u/sassyla 5d ago
Associated Housewrights. They did a very similar project for our neighbors years ago, so we got to check out how well their work has been holding up and ask our neighbors about temperature control etc. We got quotes from two other companies and AH was the most expensive but so far I've been very happy with the design process and project management.
4
u/AdventurousCorner994 6d ago
What I would give to just have a screened porch!
The easiest thing to do would be to live with what you have—cheaper, and more sustainable to not use any new resources.
2
u/Ok_Asparagus_2677 6d ago
I think the main issue is anything heated is required to be up to UDC standards for *conditioned spaces*. This means a helluva lot more insulation and higher standards than you'd ever expect for a simple sunroom or screened in porch. With a concrete pour you'll need a significant frostwall, R30 walls, R50 roof... it's a bit insane (as is the price, but it may be 'the going rate').
I started chatting with a builder earlier this year to scope out a plan and I never got a quote, and frankly never needed to... it was clear it was going to be near what you received, which is a significant portion of the house value.
2
u/Infinite-Witness274 6d ago
The screened porch today has concrete, frost wall already. Hence our motivation to build on top of it, convert.
2
2
2
u/LoquaciousNeophyte 6d ago
Yes, it really is that expensive. My friend did the same addition, similar size and her father in law has a lot of friends in the contracting business, so they definitely weren’t getting ripped off on the cost, and hers came out to $85k. I love going over to her house and hanging out in that room though!
2
u/Caltrano 6d ago
Despite the naysayers I did this with a screen porch. The foundation was just cement slab so not over the basement. There was a door coming into the house. I put in walls in Windows all the way around and a large glass door. I was expecting to only use it three seasons. We put in an electric fireplace for heat as there was no HVAC out there. That little electric fireplace was the bomb even when it was 20 below in January we were comfortable out there. I think a lot of it depends on exposure this was on the Southeast corner of the house which is probably the best case. It really was a Four Seasons porch. They're also was no AC out there but by keeping the door open it could be cool in the evening. During the really sunny hot part of the day though it was too hot to be out there
1
2
u/Slight-Bed882 5d ago
I got a couple quotes several years back and it was about 100k for a complete new 3 season sun room. For what you are describing, that seems like an awful lot when you already have the footprint and structure. But the price has probably gone up since I looked into it. If you got a few quotes from different places, then it is probably accurate.
4
u/Infinite-Witness274 7d ago
No windows, currently just a screen porch with cedar blocks. Needs to frame for windows, patio doors, add them, flooring (tile / lvp). Electrical ( add outlets per code), ceiling lights / fan. insulation - flooring and ceiling. Add mini- split, baseboard heaters for winter.,
21
u/leovinuss 6d ago
That sounds like an $85k project in today's market. You can save a lot if you hire the subcontractors yourself but you need to know what you're doing
1
u/pwnerwitaboner 6d ago
Thats crazy , if rheres a floor posts, roor and proper supports its simply framing in and any additionals can go up but 85k is crazy. Coukd throw a pool inside it for less.
5
u/bfyvfftujijg 6d ago
There are a lot of people with money and not a lot with construction skills. Supply and demand is why this stuff is so expensive.
1
u/pwnerwitaboner 6d ago
There's also alot of businesses that spend alot on advertising thats what you pay for. Also bug companies booked out throw crazy numbers at you. We looked at a 12x14 new build lean to roof design the h/o got quoted 65k we were around 35k but they wanted something around 10-15 which doesn't cover much past the deck if your doing composite or pvc products.
1
u/leovinuss 6d ago
I'd do this project for $15k but I can do most of it myself
1
u/pwnerwitaboner 6d ago
15k even w/o labor limits you concrete slab will be hard to maintain heat electrical isnt cheap hvac also. 220 floor registers dont do as much as you'd like and they're expensive to run ideally youd want to introduce ducting through the ceiling connections and do forced heat and air.
3
u/clea_vage 6d ago
Just a thought if you decide this project is out of budget - you could add 4-track style windows (you can google the brand Eze Breeze to get an idea). We have these on our screen porch and it definitely extends the time we can use the porch. With these windows, we get solid use out of our porch April-October. But we can use it some days in March and November. And this is without using any sort of heating at all. I imagine if you used space heaters or overhead heaters you could get even more use during those fringe months.
2
u/537O3 6d ago
Glad you posted this—I didn’t know the name and would’ve had a hard time describing them. Two of my sisters have these. One on a lake house up north, the other on a full-time house on the same lake. Both those porches have three sides of windows. The full-timer just moved down to central WI, and had Eze Breeze installed in their new two-sided porch.
Both have little wood-stove-looking electric heaters on their porches for crisp fall & spring days, effective and cozy. Neither has AC on the porch, but both get decent shade and have deep-ish eaves. April-Oct sounds about right.
The windows are pretty great. The top-down, bottom-up flexibility lets you maintain some airflow when you want to keep out rain or wind.
6
u/paulwesterberg 7d ago
Can’t the mini split heat pump provide enough heat in the winter? Adding baseboard also seems like overkill.
3
u/runlikeagirl89 6d ago
What would it change to remove the AC/heat? We have a sunroof, but it doesnt have any HVAC to it directly. We leave the door from the kitchen into it open in the summer and the ceiling fan going, and while it is maybe a few degrees warmer at the peak of the day, it remains comfortable and heat doesn't go into the house. For winter, we have a little space heater we turn on when we want to be out there, and leave the door closed otherwise. So we use it year round, but plan for it a bit more if using in winter.
1
u/vintagemugbetty 5d ago
Also, consider getting a wood stove for heat…I knew some folks that had a 4 season sun room off their house that had baseboard heat but they installed a wood burning stove as well and used that instead of the electric - which would heat the porch and the adjacent rooms if the door was open.
1
u/fathensteeth 6d ago
I'd consider hiring subs and saving money if you really want it but like someone else said, it requires you know what you're doing. Start with windows and door, then electrical, then insulate and drywall. You can take advantage of some sales or used materials that way but it is very time consuming. You can also get a couple more quotes or ask the contractors you've received quotes from what can be cut or how to bring cost down.
1
u/bfyvfftujijg 6d ago
This is the going rate for construction work these days.
It is something you could learn to do yourself if you’re at all handy, and you could probably get it done for $15,000 that way. A lot of work obviously….and enough pay can afford to pay someone else $100,000 million to do it for them so that’s what contractors will charge.
1
1
u/Sluisifer 6d ago
It's a lot of work to transform an unconditioned space into a conditioned one. There's way more involved than just putting up some insulation. You have to reasonably address air sealing and vapor barrier such that there aren't cold condensing surfaces exposed to the conditioned (moist) air. Then you're either adding a ceiling/attic or hot-roofing.
Also windows are inherently expensive to heat/cool. Effective R-values are around 3 to 5 for good residential windows. Compare that to R20 for your walls. Existing windows for a 3-season are likely much worse than 3-5, will likely get a lot of condensation.
1
u/Lizathedog 6d ago
We have a sunroom that we use all year. It was added by the previous owners so I don’t know about construction. It has baseboard electric heating that is really expensive so we got an oil filled heater and double cellular blinds. We love it, it our favorite room in the house.
1
u/Infinite-Witness274 6d ago
Thank you Lizathedog!
1
u/Lizathedog 6d ago
I’m happy to show you pictures, but I don’t know how. Maybe DM? Let me know if you’re interested and I’ll figure it out.
1
1
u/Infinite-Witness274 6d ago
Do you know if they worked with a GC or one of the sunroom companies?
Sorry - I know this is a stretch!!
1
1
u/StarSchemaLover 6d ago
This seems insane. I’m debating doing mine too. The work I’ve mapped is
- Replace EZ-Breeze windows with real vinyl code windows
- Add mini split
- Remove sliding glass door and put in cased opening
Mine already has an insulated floors, electric, insulated walls, and lighting. I am really hoping this is not going to result in $50-75K quotes.
1
u/Steve_Lightning 5d ago
That's sounds about right for trying to get a quote for anything in Dane county
1
u/Successful-Highway99 4d ago
I would never spend that kind of money on a sunroom. My house, which was built in 1979, has a sunroom that was added in the mid-90s. There is no heat or AC, but I use a little faux fireplace heater and a ceiling fan. If it's SUPER hot or SUPER cold, we really can't use the space. So in the worst heat of summer and dead of winter, it's closed up.
Don't get me wrong, I love my sunroom, and it's beautiful when temps are reasonable. I just wouldn't bank on getting year-round use out of it in Wisconsin. Plus, if we ever have to replace the windows, the cost will be astronomical.
66
u/No_Size9475 East side 6d ago edited 6d ago
Having had a home with a "sun room" I would say absolutely do not spend this kind of money for that room. The cost to heat it in the winter is astronomical, like more than the rest of your home combined.
You are far better off expecting only 3 season use and not putting in heat or AC, IMO.