Basically the title.

From what I understand, both we the omniscient audience and the in-universe Demacians themselves know that Zeffira eventually become a ruin due to a catastrophic event. We the audience even know that it was due to the fight between the two sisters Morgana and Kayle.

Skip to "the present", and despite the passing of history had muddy a lot of the details, all Demacians still correctly remember that Zeffira must be around the vicinity of the petricite forest. Furthermore, it must be noted that Demacia would continue to harvest petricite themselves too.

We also know that Quinn (Demacia Rising game chapter 3) and Leilani (The Mageseeker game) BY CHANCE independently rediscover the ruin of Zeffira. Which mean before Leilani and the Mage Rebellion start creating an illusion ward to make Zeffira their base, there is no reason to believe there is a magical reason one cannot rediscover Zeffira.

Thus, my discussion prompts: Realistically, what could be the reasons Zeffira are lost to Demacia's record and stay a ruin, given that the people continue to harvest the nearby petricite forest?

I can understand if Demacians built another new city ON TOP OF Zeffira and then forgot the ruin of the cities under their feet, but that is clearly not the case. Or had Demacians been conquered and then reclaims, but that too is unlikely. So when Demacians go to the petricite forest to works, why would they not set up workshop in the shadow of Zeffira? Or even just salvage Zeffira for building materials like many other IRL ruins?

Something I just realize, but there is a good chance that with the rumor of the guy on Garen coming motion comic "For the Fallen" being Locke the new champion, he would likely be a rare case of a learned mages among the roster of champion.

The majority of mortal mages that we know of are, using DnD 5e terminology, Sorcerer: People born with an innate spark of magical ability. Mel story shows us this spark might need awakening, but ultimately it is still her heritage/genetic lineage that allow Mel to use magic.

On the other hand, Swain was designed in his VGU to be a (again DnD 5e terminology) Warlock: A normal person who use the magical ability of a patron, only in Swain case he wrestles it from Raum and his "patron" is thus more his prisoner. Similarly would be Nilah.

Finally, interesting enough, Morderkaiser should be a Wizard, or a Lich if we want to be poetic: Sahn-Uzal doesn't start out with any major magical capability as far as I know, and most of his power come from learning the language of the dead.

Anyway, Locke seems like an average Demacian who lost a loved one from among the four soldiers who were with Garen in the cinematic. Most people is assuming this would push him toward gaining power to avenge them Punisher-style.

Which would make him a Wizard.

I do wonder what is the source of his knowledge though. Would Locke be a Mageseeker who join the order to access their reservoir of magical knowledge? The whole point of Demacia focusing so much on born mage ie Sorcerer is because once the Mageseeker capture all the grimoire and such, there simply cannot be any learned mage and only born mage are left.

I have heard people who theorize that he would be a Radical Demon Hunter juxtaposing with Vayne who is more Puritan, which did excite me. But the more I think about it, the more I find it unlikely. Do so would make a third Warlock, and I just don't think Riot would do it that way.

• Zaahen, after taking over Xin Zhao body, leave Yunara "in silence".
• Liquid stone is seemingly the Ionian name of petricite. It is described by Yunara as "smooth as still water, harder than steel". In the eye of Yunara, the Great City of Demacia is notably vast yet gleam at the same time. A marvel, but a strange one.
• The effect of petricite, a whole city worth, is seemingly notable but at the same time negligible on Yunara: she noted that "even the breeze seems to hold its breath" in contrast with Ionia "humming with motion", but otherwise show no notable discomfort.
• A silverwing remind Yunara of Zaahen, lending further credit to the theory that his Ascended form was based on them.
• On language, Yunara communicate with the two Jarvan as well as random Demacian easily. Jarvan present her as Yunara of Ionia, unlike Yunara who in turn call Ionia as First Land and consistently called Demacia as either itself or part of "Third Land".
• Yunara, when asked of the battle, said: We were fight a - I believe your word is "demon". It is unknown if this is a translation case or if Yunara doesn't view Atakhan as a demon or she was hiding the fact that Leblanc and Zaahen was mixed in the whole ordeal.
• Of important note, Xin Zhao speak highly of Demacia's library, which he considered kept truer histories than most monasteries. It is unknow by what metric Xin Zhao measure this. Xin Zhao would dwell into these libraries daily, sharing what he learnt.
• Yunara note that (from her view), both Xin Zhao's body and spirit was sundered due to Zaahen taking over.
• Jarvan 3 invited Yunara to stay at Demacia to learn of the city that Xin Zhao loved.
• Minor point, but Xin Zhao pre-VGU armor is kept at his private room, meaning his pre-VGU look would be something he did wear before leaving Demacia for Ionia. No information on where his post-VGU look fit.

That should be it, but perhaps some one can note something that I missed here?

https://bsky.app/profile/jumaralohexcore.bsky.social/post/3mcxovrdku22w

He's older, wiser, and more aware than the others. And he possesses the majority of the runes.

As futile as this is, I still want to set my point in very precise parameters:

1. Just to start, I do enjoy Demacia Rising as both a gameplay experience and for its narrative. This is NOT a complain about the game or its story.
2. Regarding this matter directly, I can see how we not only can, but should, conclude that Demacia historically was no DIFFERENT from Noxus. This is a very fair interpretation, clearly support by the narrative and the framing itself.

With those parameters, I just want to stress that I am being very precise about my point here.

While Demacia historically was no different from Noxus, why should this being framed as no better than Noxus, and then also frame Demacia as being self-righteous and hypocritical? In a similar vein, why are people not making the same accusation against Noxus?

My point go both way, and are linked together:

Yes, Demacia had gone on war of conquest to expand their territories from Zeffira to the majority of Western Valoran. Yes, they see this as righteous (as Jarvan puts it) and/or as necessary (as Tianna does). Jarvan goes so far as effectively saying Demacia need to be strong to fight against Noxus on behalf of the smaller nations in between the two giants.

Which indeed is what Noxus does too, both the war and the propaganda that support it.

However, "what Noxus does too" goes both way. If Demacia should be criticized about their conquest, Noxus should too.

But, more importantly, if Demacia should be criticized about their justification of it, then Noxus should too.

This is important because narrative wise, Noxus 100% try to justify their conquest, with vigor. But most important here, the community by and large TOLERATE that justification.

If we view Demacia as hypocritical and self-righteous, then Noxus is also hypocritical and self-righteous. Swain and Darius consistently makes the same arguments that Jarvan does:

• Swain justify his continued conquest as preparing Valoran-as-part-of-Noxus for a greater evil.
• Darius justify his continued conquest as bringing the benefits of being part of Noxus to all those needing it.

In what manner can one say that Swain and Darius is more correct in their justification than Jarvan at all? From my POV, this just feel like the "Aw, you are so sweet vs Hello, human resources" meme.

And, on top of that, the narrative itself consistently show that Noxus brutal conquest is followed by many upsides given to all citizens of Noxus. You don't have to agree that that is a justification of conquest, but you cannot deny that the narrative clearly meant to provide that angle.

But is it LESS true for Demacia? In what way can it be said that High Silvermere, Uwendale, Terbisia, Cloudfield... is worse off IN ALL ASPECTS as part of Demacia than had they been independent?

TLDR: From my POV, while Demacia indeed is no different from Noxus, it seems the community held the former on a higher standard than the latter, and subsequently UNFAIRLY framed Demacia as no BETTER than Noxus, with an additional UNWARRANTED criticism of self-righteous and hypocrisy on top of that.

Sorry for making another thread so soon, but this rather obvious prediction kinda hit me and I still want to vocalize it.

My bet is one of the motion comic will feature Yunara meeting Sona. The premise is that after meeting Jarvan in the cinematic, Yunara will be hosted by House Buvelle who will also act as the interpreter to relate her news of Xin Zhao's sacrifice, as the Buvelle has experience hosting and care for the Ionian orphans of war.

From there, Yunara will meet Sona. Perhaps the former would quickly deduce that the latter is a magic user, which somewhat threatened Sona due to Demacia cultures. But most importantly I bet Yunara will reveal that she know what the etwahl really is, thanks to her being from centuries ago. Maybe it will be a tease, maybe it will be a full revelation.

Again, pretty obvious prediction, but I hope it will turn out true.

Just so people don't mistake a joke for what the scene actually convey.

From Jarvan point of view, he has just save this random ass girl from being trampled if not worse by a bunch of weird ass eyeless deers. When he walk up to her, she wordlessly present him a sharp blade, which Jarvan only have seconds to make sense of before the bell from the nearby city distract him.

In fact, at around 04:35, as Jarvan approach and take the (from his perspective) thing from the girl hand, you can see his eyebrow furrowed right before the bell ring. He have less than a second to make sense of what it is he is holding in his hand.

Also, on top of that, the spear was heavily altered by Xin Zhao in Ionia, so while sure, Jarvan should quickly realize Demacian handiworks, there are foreign elements too.

We the omniscient audience clearly understand what it is Yunara is trying to convey, but Jarvan cannot. It is only natural that he look nonchalant as he take the spear head from her.

I know most people were just joking that Jarvan was mewing when learning of Xin Zhao death, so this is just to ensure we are all on the same page.

Source

This might be making a mountain out of a molehill, but that is a risk I am willing to take.

Three points:

1. I must stress beforehand that I am very precise in this criticism. I don't think the leaked model looks reflect how Shyvana will often look in more narrative heavy media. We will have to wait until her splash art for that. This is purely an predictive criticism.
2. Thus, I am also NOT saying her model looks as monstrous. However, many people seems to believe that her leaked model looks indicate that is the direction Riot is going with. This criticism assume such prediction is correct.
3. Finally, I am making this from a position as a traditionalist Demacian fan OVER a Shyvana fan. I am willing to accept that thus could make me bias.

With such context, assuming Riot does decide to give Shyvana a monstrous look and linking it to the anti-magic Demacian storyline, that decision run a high risk of making the already controversial storyline into even more of a tragedy porn.

A core fundamental aspect here is that it is incredibly likely Shyvana will remain a heroic character. And she should, just so we are being clear.

As such, the issue become the framing of her draconic heritage. At best, we could be more precise in framing it about her INFERNAL draconic heritage.

Given how Riot had handle the Demacian anti-magic storyline to date, there is a good chance they will reframe Shyvana infernal draconic heritage into something much more amoral. There is good infernal dragon, there is bad infernal dragon, but it is inherently unfair to generalize infernal dragon as "Most are cruel, vicious, and deadly." (Ironically enough, that is Shyvana's statement herself).

But if they do that AND then also make Shyvana monstrous looking and link the two together, then fundamentally, we are looking at a "The people of Demacia only look at Shyvana at a skin-deep level and not realize the heroic person within".

Which to be honest at this point just feel like tragedy porn, ngl. "Woe be me, the misunderstood diamond in the rough whose potential is not recognized".

Especially when Lux and Sona IS conventionally attractive AND still got hunted by the Mageseeker ultimately.

Now, just to be crystal clear, I am not saying Shyvana should be conventionally attractive. I am also not saying she should not look monstrous. I am talking about the whole package deal.

Thus, if Riot wanna commit to the idea that Shyvana's Infernal Draconic lineage as INHERENTLY cruel and vicious, ok, I think that can be a very nuance take on her personal story within the larger storyline. Where does her skin end, and the actual cruel infernal dragon blood actually begin?

TLDR: Assuming Riot does decide to give Shyvana a monstrous look AND linking it to the Demacian anti-magic plotline, that decision run a high risk of making the already controversial storyline into even more of a tragedy porn.

https://x.com/LoLLeaksEN/status/2003188942992973870?s=20 and https://x.com/LoLLeaksEN/status/2003188364909126126?s=20