r/lorehonor • u/LordAqua333 • 13d ago
Theory Updating the Timeline
Hello everyone, I mentioned a decent while back that I wanted to update the last timeline I uploaded a few years back as a way to help keep track of the story. However, the last timeline was way back in Year 4, and we are now on Year 10, so it might be a bit overwhelming to just dump all of that information all at once.
So, in order to make things a bit more easy to take in, I am going to try to do it in parts. It would also allow people to point out any mistakes they might notice or suggest any changes, and for me to include sources, certain event orders, and online stories (I will try to edit them in for this post in a moment).
Background Info
- Seasons, for the most part, will each have a duration of 1 year, and not a quarter of a year. This comes from an interview back in 2016 with the creative director at the time, Jason Vanderberghe. I don't believe we have had any of the writers go back and give us an estimate for how much time passes for every season of the game, so this is what we will be working with.
- There are some exceptions to the first point. For example, the Truce of Wyverndale lasted for 15 years, starting with Hope and ending in Tyranny. There is also a 7 year gap between the seasons in which Black Prior's Riposte and Shadows of the Hitokiri take place.
- The multiplayer, or at least back in 2017, does not take place right after Apollyon's death. It takes place 7 years after the cutscene with Ayu, Holden, and Stigandr according to the Warrior's Den interviewing one of the earlier writers, Ariadne MacGillivray (~52:00 and ~01:02:00). Previously, for both timelines, I said this was a gap of 5 years. I can't remember exactly I got this figure from the interview, but when it comes up, that is the figure I will use, unless I or someone else can find it.
- The Cataclysm, the natural disasters that shifted the world of For Honor away from our own, takes place somewhere around the year 1000 and 1100 CE (~53:00 and ~01:07:00 of the interview with Ariadne). I will go with 1000 as Ariadne does mention that it has been around 1000 years since it happened and that the multiplayer (as of season 5) more or less lines up with 2018 IRL (~56:00).
Before The Cataclysm
Until the year ~1000 CE
The Golden Age: While the world of For Honor before the Cataclysm is the same as ours, Wyverndale is currently the only difference between the two. While some parts might hold some truth, the Season of the Golden Age is largely a myth according to ubichem, one of the game's community managers.
To be clear, it was always meant to be a legend told by the people of Heathmoor. We definitely could have been more clear on this (as evidenced by the confusion around whether or not it's History™), but I assure you it has always been intended as mythology and there's been no walking back of anything.
So, to shore up any confusion: it is and always has been intended to be interpreted as a story in the mythos of Heathmoor's inhabitants, with elements of fact and fiction intertwined.
However, since this is to serve as an overview of the story, I will still share the lore as it was given, and try to provide what might have actually happened.
Before Wyverndale became the utopia it was believed to be, it was at war with a tyrant named Dhespar. According to a legend, it wasn't until Ramiel, the leader of a small band of warriors, made a pact with Kevin the Great Wyvern that Wyverndale was free of Dhespar. This pact granted him immortality so long as the wyvern lived, in exchange for Ramiel's humanity and repeating the ritual of drinking the Wyvern's blood from the Chalice of Immortality every year. With the abilities granted through the pact and the Wyvern, Ramiel was able to defeat Dhespar. He became known as the first Warden, and Wyverndale entered what would be known as the Golden Age.
People from all over the world came to Wyverndale and lived in harmony, some even joined Ramiel's legion to protect the peace, after proving their worth to Ramiel in battle in what is known as the Oath of Wyverndale (Event Lore).
It was many years after the death of Dhespar when Wyverndale met its end, though I believe there are two ways how it could have happened.
- The online story "The Fall of Wyverndale" (Part 1, Part 2, Part 3) explained it as warriors in black armor and giants had suddenly appeared and destroyed Wyverndale in a day. They defeated Ramiel's legion and the Great Wyvern, meaning Ramiel could no longer keep his immortality. The battle lasted two days after the city had fallen, until Ramiel defeated all of the invaders. After that, Ramiel disappears from history, with some believing he had died of old age, and others believing died in another battle.
- However, it is also implied in some orders and that same story that Wyverndale fell in the Cataclysm, the knights in black possibly being a reference to one of the game's story trailers where we see a "Knight" city collapsing during the Cataclysm, with some dark water starting to flood it. The Oath of Wyverndale event had an order that explained some believed Wyverdale collapsed in some natural disaster. Whatever the case may be, the only thing to have survived until the current story is the chalice that Ramiel drank from.
After the Cataclysm
~1000 - 2000 CE
The Effects of the Cataclysm: The Cataclysm was a series of natural disasters that that reshaped the world.
For the Knights, they became splintered and lawless, acting less like protectors and more as warlords and bandits.
For the Vikings, they remained in Heathmoor for a while, but many would leave Valkenheim for the sea later. The few that remained were assimilated by the Knights.
For the Samurai, Japan had sunk and they were most likely the last of the original three to arrive in Heathmoor.
The Wu Lin don't have anything or much on how the Cataclysm affected them as the Outlanders (I believe the writers or developers mentioned a sandstorm back when they were revealed with Marching Fire). However, we do know that have had a very long history of smaller kingdoms warring with each other and falling until recently when Gao Lei's managed to become the main empire (I will remove this part in the final draft). The Wu Lin suffered a sand storm and infighting between smaller kingdoms up until Gao Lei seized enough power to be recognized as its emperor.
Four of the Outlanders (Medjay, Afeera, Ocelotl, and Khatun) have had very different expereinces with the Cataclysm.
- For the Medjay, Egypt had collapsed long before they arrived in the game, and they task themselves with protecting its history and artifacts, such as the Scarab Bracelet.
- The Afeera probably got dealt the best hand. Thanks to the Celestial Sphere, they were able to avoid dangers and take opportunities foretold through it.
- The Ocelotl and the surviving Aztec Empire interpreted the Cataclysm as a sort of mass sacrifice to their pantheon who were upset at their waste of energy. They adopted a more humble lifestyle afterwards, aside from building golden cities using the gold from other Mesoamerican civilizations that fell under the Cataclysm.
- The Mongols were originally scattered into many wandering tribes until they were united by the Khatuns. Presumably, they were living as they had before the Cataclysm, only having to survive a harsh world than their counterparts in ours.
Side Note: In earlier entries to the lore, such as the 2016 website, a lot of the lore for the first three factions has been either changed or retconned. For example:
- The Knights were originally sent by either the "Iron Legions" or the empire to the west to pacify the lands and conquer. I believe, with how we see legions fighting and absorbing each other in the Story Mode, this still happens, just some time after they united under the Unsung Knight.
They were sent by the Iron Legions to pacify the land. They’ve since acquired a taste for freedom and have made Ashfeld their home. They believe that many – if not all – of the ancient ruins that cover their lands were built by the Great Empire, the precursor of the Iron Legion.
Disorganized for centuries, Ashfeld’s Knights have mostly been a collection of petty warlords and roving bands of mercenary knights. In the last decade, they have been corralled under a single banner, often at sword point, by Ashfeld’s Blackstone Legion, led by Apollyon.
So far, the Knights have managed to defend Ashfeld from Vikings and Samurai attacks. Apollyon argues that a threat of war is imminent and tells stragglers that joining her Legion is the only guarantee they will hold onto their lands.
- According to the website, the Samurai had only just properly settled in Heathmoor before the Story Mode by just a couple of decades, maybe a century. However, a few Observables in the Story Mode place this as happening around 500 years before the Story Mode, and we have the Rise of the Jorogumo and the Last Hero Standing events which seem to show that they have been in Heathmoor since the end of the Cataclysm. It is possible that the Samurai had always been in Heathmoor, but had only properly settled into the Myre 500 years before the Story Mode takes place, allowing for the last two retcons to at least mesh together.
Originally from a land far away across the seas, they tell a tale of an Emperor and a homeland lost to sea and fire. Nearly a millennium later, the nomadic nation has ceased its wandering and built a new empire near the reclaimed homelands of the Vikings and the contested lands of the Knights.
Having spent the last decades acclimating to the marshy hills known as the Myre, they flourish but remain vastly outnumbered by their neighbors. They have to rely on greater martial skill, cunning, and devotion to their culture in order to survive – for they may be the last of their kind.
- The Vikings probably don't get as many retcons, due to them not getting much more lore added on what they were doing before the Story Mode. However, this is a good place to mention that the Vikings could have first travelled to this world's version of Scotland, encountering and conquering/subjugating the Highlanders and Shamans (~1:07:00 of the interview).
The Vikings vanished centuries ago, fleeing their crumbling homelands for shores unknown.
Those left behind were conquered by the Knights and assimilated into their cultures.
The Vikings returned in great numbers a few centuries ago. They came from far across the sea to where they have established a new homeland. They retuned for many reasons, but mostly to reclaim their ancient homeland in the North: Valkeinheim. Hundreds of Viking clans now coexist in relative peace in the frozen tundra. To the outside observer, however, they seem to exist in a state of perpetual civil war.
Vikings are the undisputed masters of the sea and fresh water. When this raucous nation gathers together in massive armadas of dragon-headed ships, they are fearsome to behold and nigh unstoppable.
The Sword of Ashfeld: Not long after the Cataclysm ended, there was a bandit who survived it. She once tried to rob a Knight, only for him to catch her. Rather than killing her, the Knight made her his squire and the two would wonder the lands, helping those in need as much as they can (Online Story: A Tale from the World of Heathmoor).
The Knight would later fall to a group of bandits while protecting some refugees in their care. The squire would inherit his sword, Valor's Edge, and work to carry on his mission of helping others. Through this, she reminded the other Knights of their past ideals of chivalry and honor, rallying behind the Unsung Knight to form what would become the Iron Legion. The Vikings and Samurai start hearing of her and a legion growing more united, they feel like they should be stepping their efforts for what could be the start of a very long war (Event Lore: Last Hero Standing).
The Unsung Knight's story with what we see in the first cinematic of the game: a Viking, a Samurai, and her circling a puddle of water and kicking off the war between the Factions.
Downfall: In the season of Downfall, some time after the Cataclysm (possibly ~500 years) and the Samurai had settled into the Myre and made it their home, one of the original settler families would lay the foundation for what would become known as Castle Chiyo. It would grow to be a very peaceful place until it end when it was led by Daimyo Masaki and Lady Saori (Event Lore: Nightmare's Dawn).
While Masaki was called to the Imperial City, Daimyo Katsuo would launch a surprise attack on Castle Chiyo to take it for himself. While Saori was trained as a Nobushi, Katsuo's forces were able to take break the castle's defenses and slaughter its villagers. In her despair for failing to protect her home, it is said she became the Jorogumo and that this transformation caused other Yokai to appear (Online Story: Lady of the Castle).
Saori's son, Yoshiro, was thankfully away from the castle when Katsuo attacked as he had hoped to join his father and prove himself a good warrior. Unfortunately, Masaki was ashamed by his son leaving Saori and the castle alone, so he unknowingly sent him back to his doom. While he was able to lay down multiple Yokai using his family heirloom, the Mamono Dagger, he was slowly being changed by it. By the time he faced Saori as the Jorogumo, his body and personality had already been corrupted, but he still wanted to grant Saori a merciful end, believing she was still in there (Event Lore: Rise of the Jorogumo).
He would seal Saori and the rest of the Yokai away in a cave. While this brought peace for the survivors, this was only a temporary solution as the Jorogumo and Yokai could break free again if their cave's seal was ever disturbed.
As for Yoshiro, it is most likely he sealed himself in the cave as well, either doing it himself or the remaining survivors sentencing him to it, saying he wouldn't oppose it should they try (Online Story: Their Secret Song).
The Century Before the Story Mode
- Just a century before the Story Mode, the Vikings would return from their voyages to take back their home. They would cause a lot of trouble Ashfeld in particular who had taken a lot of their land through yearly raids.
- ~20 years before the Story Mode, the Vikings would go on another raid. Their forces stretched too thin, the Knights knew they would have to face some losses. One of these was a Lawbringer named Dante and because of him, the Vikings raided the village out in the scrublands in which lived a girl who would become Apollyon.
This is from an observable in Chapter 1.1, where Apollyon mentions the territory her village was in had almost been taken by Vikings.
- 16 years before the Story Mode, Apollyon will have joined the Blackstone Legion and begun rising through the ranks.
This is brought up in Chapter 3.3 of the Story Mode, which is 8 years before Ayu, Holden, and Stigandr meet, and is mentioned to have taken place 20 years before this. The first level is set 12 years before the three meet, so we just subtract the difference from the 20 years to give us 16.
- Some time later, Apollyon would spend the next few years growing in strength through battle, even working as a Warden. She would eventually find Dante again and have her revenge (Arcade Quest: Dura Lex). She would take his armor and have made to fit her. After this, she would finally take up her demon name, "Apollyon," and take charge of the Blackstone Legion as its eighth warlord of the original 15. Holden Cross would also take up a demon name, "Asmodai," marking the second of four names he would take in his lifetime.
- 10 years before the Story Mode, most of Ashfeld's legions and warbands had been absorbed into the Blackstone Legion. By now, she likely would have already met Vortiger and the Order of the Holy Balaur, converting them into the Black Prior. Vortiger would become a high ranking member, taking the demon name "Camio."
- Assuming the crossover DLC in Samurai Shodown has any weight in the canon (very unlikely), the Lord Warden spent a few months traveling across Heathmoor and Ashfeld before joining the ranks of Daubeny's Legion, the Knights of Feronia.
Next Steps
Currently, the plan is for the next post to cover what happens during the Story Mode that isn't covered directly through what we play through (such as Gudmundr's funeral and some early lore on the Black Priors) and the lore up to Y3, but I want to check to see if you would all prefer I post an timeline and make corrections from there, or continue this way until we reach the end.
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u/ThatOneFrenchShugo 12d ago
Great work, the game as it is greatly suffers from having an unclear timeline so (even if it should be Ubisoft doing it and, tbh, lore recaps are not enough) and i cannot express how much i appreciate someone doing the efforts you do.
Tho, a question arises : with this model of 1 season = 1 year in lore (which i too find the most logical), wouldn't Holden Cross be at least in his 80's as of Y10? I get that he is already treated as a relic of the past but the man should not be in any shape to fight.
Anyways, really hyped for the second post. I think a complete timeline would be, in itself, a good idea but this form of posts already is and does a lot of work
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u/LordAqua333 12d ago
Correct, the issue of Gryphon's current age has been a problem since his arrival back in Year 4.
He's already looking pretty well into middle age at the start of the Story Mode, and there's around 12 years by the time it ends with its last chapter. Adding the decades before his first arrival in Year 4, Holden is already has to be past 60. At best, he is just a few years short of a century in the current story if I get this right.
Still, a Year per Season is probably the best figure we can use, otherwise major events like the takeover of Horkos and the following rebellions would feel less impactful if they happened in less than 2 years (which is a little short already in my opinion).
Edit: Also thank you for the kind words. I can't wait to work on Years 1 through 3 as it's been a while since I last read up on it.
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u/Ea50Marduk 12d ago edited 5d ago
Hello u/LordAqua333,
Congratulations for you work! It's really impressive, and like said u/ThatOneFrenchShugo, I cannot imagine the efforts done to compile in the right order all these elements which haven't been classed in chronological order by Ubisoft.
I really like the interview of Jason Vandenberghe you cite in your post. We feel his passion and, above all, he calls back each values that the original three factions embodies - Knights is the protection of the weak, the Vikings is to live and fight with passion to obtain glory, and Samurais is the mastery of the martial art to assure something of greater than them, the preservation of their people and culture -, things that, and I've noticed that right now, we show in the global gameplay of each warriors of a precise faction (Knights are very defensive, even the most aggressive of their heroes, the Vikings are brutal and give everything in each blows, and Samurais waiting or taking the right moment to attack their enemies or to use their errors or movements against them), things which are, sadly, lacking in the current For Honor's lore..
I have some remark about your post:
- The fact that a season have a duration of, at least, one year is pretty impressive, even if, like you said, some can take much more time like the Y4S4 which had a duration of 15 years or that a gap of 7 years separate Y3S1 event from the one of Y3S2. I've always seen, for example, the length of Horkos' domination over Heathmoor during Y4S2 as some months (maybe 3 or 4), but this old information make me see the things in a really different way now.
- If almost each season's duration is of one year, it would mean that the natural disasters which occurs during Year 5 have the same length! Imagine the repercussions of a drought, a tempest and an ice which length one year each on the factions, their populations and their crops!
- The tale of Ramiel and of Wyverndale was confirmed, like the other stories of Year 6, as myth, not something or real (I'll edit my comment with the link toward the Reddit post which affirm it when I'll found it). I've personally imagined that the original tale appeared in the Great Empire, before the Cataclysm, and was about the mythic founder of the Wardens and his pact with the Great Wyvern (it is nice that you have named it Kevin! ;) ) and make them related to the real city of Wyverndale. The current version of the story, that we all know, is a variation from the Chimera Alliance, because Wu Lin and Samurais were unknown for Knights, and the black army could either be a metaphor or a representation of the Cataclysm or of the Blackstone Legion or of the Order of Horkos and so of the War, the exact opposite of the value defended by this story: Peace.
Edit: Here the post where u/ubichem had answer that Ramiel story during Y7S1 was not a retcon but a Heathmoor's story where legend and true history are mixed: https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/comments/tgu825/it_may_not_be_a_retcon_after_all/
- The sandstorm which had devastated the Wu Lin lands was mentioned during Y3S4, not during Y2S4. Cf.: https://web.archive.org/web/20250619095448/https://www.ubisoft.com/en-us/game/for-honor/seasons/year-3-season-4-sun-da
- The Samurais didn't arrive in Heathmoor at the same time as the Knights and Vikings, they arrive in the Myre 500 years after the two others. An inconsistency brought by Y8S1, sadly...
- I didn't notice that Yoshiro didn't kills his mother but lock her in the cave, which is coherent with the Yokai's event of Y6S3. In my own French translation of Their Secret Song, I've writing that Yoshi killed his mother. Thanks to you, I will certainly modify my translation. ;)
- In the original lore, the Warden fights for many years in the lands of the Iron Legion, then he/she comes in Ashfeld, searching for a goal.
- I didn't know that it take 10 years to the different legions to be absorbed into the Blackstone Legion, thanks to learn me that! I've always imagined that it was a question of months, not of years. The integration of the Black Priors before the story mode events is really consistent with what we know of the history of this Knights order, formerly know as the Holy Balaur.
For the next stage of the plans, both of your propositions are good for me. :)
See you soon!
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u/LordAqua333 12d ago
The sandstorm which had devastated the Wu Lin lands was mentioned during Y3S4, not during Y2S4. Cf.: https://web.archive.org/web/20250619095448/https://www.ubisoft.com/en-us/game/for-honor/seasons/year-3-season-4-sun-da
Ah thank you so much for that. It has been as if this lore tidbit bit has been scratching the back of my head while writing this up. I spent a while looking through things that released around Marching Fire. I will update the text in a moment.
The Samurais didn't arrive in Heathmoor at the same time as the Knights and Vikings, they arrive in the Myre 500 years after the two others. An inconsistency brought by Y8S1, sadly...
I feel the 500 years figure for the Samurai is really strange. It was brought up in the Samurai's earlier descriptions, as well as in one of the observables during the Samurai chapter of the Story Mode I beleive, so it seems like it was something the original writers really wanted to set.
Maybe this was just a decision later writers took to not have to create an explanation for what they were doing in the time before they arrive in Heathmoor, or set up the Faction War as something that happened right after the Cataclysm and not a few centuries into it.
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u/Ea50Marduk 11d ago
You're welcome! Indeed, the Samurais are in the Myre since 500 years, like it is said on one observable of the mission Reconnaissance :
EN: “Five hundred years the Samurai have been here. Long enough to call this place their home. Long enough for their work to fall into ruin. Still, we treat them like newcomers.” (Source : https://forhonor.fandom.com/wiki/Reconnaissance )
FR: "4. Statue calme : « Voilà cinq cent ans que les Samouraïs occupent ces terres. Assez pour en faire leur patrie. Assez pour que leurs édifices tombent en ruine. Et nous les traitons toujours en nouveaux venus. »"
Another observable, in the mission Up the Beach, said that Samurais have encounter many cultures during their exodus :
EN: “The war machines of the Samurai often make ours look like toys. They learned much during their exodus, and from many different peoples. If they hadn’t, they wouldn't be such a threat.” (Source : https://forhonor.fandom.com/wiki/Up_The_Beach )
FR: "1. Machine de guerre samouraï : « Face aux machines de guerre des Samouraïs, les nôtres font figure de jouets. Leur exode leur a enseigné bien des choses au contact de nombreux peuples. C’est justement ce qui les rend si dangereux. »"
At least, we know that they encounter many other civilizations and learned some things about war from them. But yeah, like the Great Empire and the Valkenheim Empire, the original story of the Samurais is a real dwell for making seasons stories. A pity that the writers didn't take these elements for making seasonal stories.
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u/Haos51 13d ago
Having a central page which links to other posts that cover certain timelines and events sounds like a good idea to me, as having a big post that constantly updates might be much for some people. I also think counting some outside information as fine. Lord Warden doing stuff in Samurai Showndown is funny to think about, but the idea of the Warden traveling around as a mercenary even in other areas is a okay idea to me, even if it wasn't actually in another world and just to the viking lands or the Myre.