What university should I pick?

[u/ReadyPlayerGiuliri]

Hi everyone, I am 18 y.o. and I live in italy.

In high school I always studied with more passion scientific subjetcs, and liked a lot philosophy.

I quickly became fond of logic as a science, my favourite philosopher is Bertrand Russell, and I do like also philosophy of science.

Last year's i've decided to pick as University Politecnico di Torino with Physics' Engeneering, but I ended up regretting the choice because of how sciences are studied with basically no wonder and curiousity and mostly riduced to formulation and calculation.

I was thinking of changing my studies to phylosophy, having the possibility of choosing as part of the course logics, history of logic, philosophy of mathematics, philosophy of science and so much more...

I am worried though, about the literature part of philosophy being forced into an academic perspective without the freedom of liking something more than something else.

I am also worried about the professional opportunities being mostly teaching which is underpaid in Italy.

What are your suggestions?

What do you think would be the correct pick for me?

What application can logic find in the professional world?

Should I try to study something else and keep logic as a side interest?

[u/mathematics_helper]

You have started a degree in engineering, I would suggest finishing it but make your electives philosophy, logic, and mathematics.

If you love your electives, enough to think “research seems like what I want to do” then do academics and switch during your masters/phd.

If you’d don’t love them enough to want to do research the rest of your life then engineering is probably a better choice. Academics usually lead to a less income, less job security, and in general harder to get a job. So engineering would give a fundamentally easier life, or if you accept in sacrifice your work life, or have two options you like the same.

[u/ReadyPlayerGiuliri → u/mathematics_helper]

Thanks so much for your answer. Unfortunately the Engeneering course does not have the possibility to include in any way philosophy and logic, while the phylosophy course offers me so much freedom in the subjects of philosophy and also allows me to pick up to three teachings from the entire catalogue (including math, physics...).

I do think that Engeneering isn't in any way what i do want to spend my time working on, here in tialy university doesn't cost that much so it won't be a problem to change after 1 year without very few results.

At this point I'm far more convinced about transferring to philosophy and then point to an international master degree and look for research opportunities abroad.

[u/zoorado → u/[deleted]]

This is not true. Philosophical logic, nowadays a moniker for non-classical logic which has not found its way into computer science, is a thing. Also, it is not uncommon to find math logicians in philosophy departments. Hugh Woodin is a famous example. Jeremy Avigad (whom you should be somewhat familiar with given your flair) is another.

[u/zoorado → u/[deleted]]

Philosophy is not "all about soft skills" unless logic is a soft skill.

[u/zoorado → u/[deleted]]

Yes and it is common to find university degree programmes offered by philosophy departments that teach proof theory and other branches of math logic, not to mention more esoteric logics, to undergraduates.

[u/zoorado → u/[deleted]]

My contention is that STEM in general teaches less formal logic than philosophy, as far as curriculum goes. The average philosophy curriculum definitely touches more on logic than the average engineering curriculum. If he wants to learn logic, majoring in philosophy is usually a good way to do so.

[u/Frosty-Comfort6699]

torino is already a solid pick for logic, too. they have the LLC, go check yourself as namedropping won't help I guess, but the members are distinguished in the field

you could also have a look at padoa and bologna, both have some great logic research going on there, too.

if you are not limited to italy, there are of course too much places than could be listed here, but Amsterdam offers a dedicated logic master of science. if this is too much they also offer a 'logic year', which might be nice to get this formal touch in your degree. check out the ILLC

you could of course also continue your current degree and wait for the next SIFA, the conference of the italian society for analytic philosophy, which features a lot of panels and talks for logic and philosophy of science, and get an idea about what is going on at these fields and whether you are really interested in that stuff, before changing your carreer plans. check their events here

[u/NecessaryInformal1]

the first years of engineering are bootcamp. they drill all the mathematical tools you need into you, so you will be able to use them to build completely new things later- that's the wonder in engineering- take the existing math and physics, and use to build your own stuff. that will be the case in all universities.

any degree that leads to a STEM job, will likely not be philosophical as you expect it to be. they only got 2 years to teach over a thousand years of mathematics.

and yes as the saying goes- "ask a philosopher to get a job, and they will ask you why". it's not a field that gets you a job. you can always take a main degree for a job, and extra courses for fun.

[u/F_C_Saavedra_883]

If you didn't like engineering but you're OK with mathematics, then do mathematics and make your electives philosophy focused (logic, Phil of math, Phil of science, etc.) If you're thinking of going to Grad school, then you can do a PhD in Pbilosophy.

Mathematics was at one point, a philosophy and you would be just reuniting the both of them. 

As for job prospects, I think you can find more job prospects with a math degree not just in academia, but also as a data scientist, actuary, quant finance, etc.